19
   

Earth to Msolga. Do you copy? Over!

 
 
spendius
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 3 Dec, 2012 02:48 pm
@farmerman,
He also said that Americans thought something was true on the evidence that they had said it.
0 Replies
 
JTT
 
  0  
Reply Mon 3 Dec, 2012 03:14 pm
@dalehileman,
Quote:
Alas JTT perhaps a slight exaggeration. Today it's generally acknowledged for instance that my hero Roosevelt was right even though against majority and even somewhat underhanded


Even if it is a "slight" exaggeration, Dale, it's a damning indictment of what the US actually is, especially, ESPECIALLY when you compare it to the propaganda.

And of course, I was not referring to internal US policies. I've asked before for someone, anyone to offer an example where the US does something without expecting something in return wrt foreign countries. There has been no takers.

Quote:
However as I implied we might have been misled while most of our hearts were in the right place. Few of us are as militant as the typical Eastern fanatic in such overwhelming numbers without the slightest chance of redemption


You have been mightily misled. Why you stand for it, when y'all supposedly stand for government by the people is the great mystery.

It's cold comfort for the 10 million slaughtered, not even considering the multiplier effect for overall suffering when 10 million are murdered, that y'all aren't militant.

Wasn't it 88% of you idiots who were for the invasion of Iraq?

Consider just how militant y'all would be if you had another country interfering in your country for generations, another country brutalizing your people, stealing your wealth. For dog's sake, 20% of Americans polled thought that the Japanese race should be exterminated. Small wonder that they believed they had to fight to the death.

Remember the Japanese had seen the incredible brutality that the US heaped upon the people of the Philippines, people who the US made a huge pretense of liberating from the Spanish.
dalehileman
 
  0  
Reply Mon 3 Dec, 2012 03:16 pm
@farmerman,
Thank you Farmer you've made my entire day
dalehileman
 
  0  
Reply Mon 3 Dec, 2012 03:26 pm
@JTT,
Quote:
offer an example where the US does something without expecting something in return wrt foreign countries
I wouldn't expect us to send aid to one openly hostile, of course not

Quote:
Wasn't it 88% of you idiots who were for the invasion of Iraq?

Who me

Yea but we were a little misled weren't we

Quote:
20% of Americans polled thought that the Japanese race should be exterminated
I hate to agree but better than 50 percent of us are hopeless morons, and I suppose looking back I too might have served there if not just a little presently

I love the U.S. but have my qualms when for instance some "distant" neighbor fires up his outside 17-in. loudspeaker and it's BOOM boom BOOM boom all night

Quote:
Small wonder that they believed they had to fight to the death.
As I recall it was a certainty that the average citizen didn't feel that way at all but was drawn into declarations by tiny militant military faction
spendius
 
  0  
Reply Mon 3 Dec, 2012 04:04 pm
@dalehileman,
Quote:
Yea but we were a little misled weren't we


But, dale, it was thought to be true that Iraq had WMD. And it was true, under the Churchill characterisation I posted, because the No1 man had said it.

If by "misled" you are saying that Mr Bush didn't think it was true then that is a serious charge to make.

If what Mr Churchill said is true, and he was wise enough to recognise evil and know that it must be confronted at all costs when the American ambassasor was asserting Hitler was no danger, then if Mr Bush said Iraq had WMD then it was true on the evidence he had said so to a people which had the same opinion on everything they said.

There were people saying it wasn't true but they were shouted down.
JTT
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 3 Dec, 2012 04:12 pm
@dalehileman,
Quote:
Thank you Farmer you've made my entire day


Farmer wrote: It was Churchill who sid that " Americans can always be counted n to do the right thing, after exhausting all other possibilities"

I hope not, Dale, if you were expecting that this description of the US was an admirable one.
dalehileman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Dec, 2012 05:46 pm
@JTT,
Quote:
if you were expecting that this description of the US was an admirable one
Thought it was funny
0 Replies
 
dalehileman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Dec, 2012 05:49 pm
@spendius,
Quote:
Yea but we were a little misled weren't we
Quote:
But, dale, it was thought to be true that Iraq had WMD.
Why of course it was but what's your point

Quote:
If by "misled" you are saying that Mr Bush didn't think it was true
Oh I'm sure he did


Quote:
There were people saying it wasn't true but they were shouted down.
I'm sure there were but what have I asserted that you're disputing
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Dec, 2012 06:15 pm
@dalehileman,
Quote:
I'm sure there were but what have I asserted that you're disputing


Nothing really. I was commenting about things being thought true because they were said and where it leads to.

Take it being said that we helped the countries of the ME to be more democratic for example. It only might be true. My best guess is that it is an unmitigated disaster and that was what I tried to impress on OLga.

But I hoped she was right of course. Her heart was in the right place.
dalehileman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 3 Dec, 2012 10:17 pm
@spendius,
Quote:
But I hoped she was right of course. Her heart was in the right place.
To save me a half hour reviewing the preceding 11 pages, Spend,who is she, what did she say, and why was it so important
spendius
 
  0  
Reply Tue 4 Dec, 2012 05:25 am
@dalehileman,
Olga of course. What she said was too extensive to quote. It was important because it gave us something to argue about.

If it was unimportant we were arguing about something of no importance and that means we are unimportant, which would never do.
dalehileman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Dec, 2012 10:13 am
@spendius,
Quote:
too extensive….gave us something to argue about.
Still curious Spend about the gist of it at least, it must have ruffled some feathers

I see Bob got really involved, even to a separate thread
spendius
 
  0  
Reply Tue 4 Dec, 2012 11:32 am
@dalehileman,
Quote:
I see Bob got really involved, even to a separate thread


I don't know much about that except that it got a bit heated. I don't remember contributing to it.

Quote:
Still curious Spend about the gist of it at least, it must have ruffled some feathers


At it's bottom it was Olga's feminine idealism, which I quite admire, concerning things in the news. The Chinese coal ship crashing into the Great Barrier reef. Whale hunting. The Arab Spring.

All I did was point out a few practicalities relating to those matters which Olga had not thought fit to consider.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Dec, 2012 03:23 pm
@spendius,
Those "practicalities" are only important if your life is a bit antisocial. Olga's is not
spendius
 
  0  
Reply Tue 4 Dec, 2012 04:10 pm
@farmerman,
I thought quite the opposite fm. You're marking your own homework again you silly sod.

The practicalities are the practicalities precisely because they are practical for our communal life. Social. Derived socially in a democracy to meet social needs as well as maybe. If they are anti-social there's something wrong somewhere.

If you have Chinese coal ships plying those seas sooner or later one of them is going to hit the great reef. It is going to happen. There are people waiting for such things to happen so they can jump up and down with indignation, with Media winding them up, and if anybody takes any notice of them the cost of carrying coal increases. And still the certainty of another ship hitting the reef at some time is not excluded. Its a balance. Risks against price. Experts run the show--not Olga. There was not a thing she said that the experts didn't know about. She was playing with toys and George told her as well.

And not one person was scratched in that case. Just a dent in the reef and a late coal delivery. That's a bit bloody trivial to be getting on a high horse about.

If no ship foundered for 20 years marine insurance would fade out.

You couldn't think through a tissue paper.

What a great idea it was getting rid of Gadaffi so the Libyans could all be free like us and have 2 car garages and sprinklers on the lawns. And inflame the hotheads from east to west. And we had the bugger half way converted. Now we have Syria. As I predicted to her. And Egypt is on the edge. Patriot missiles in Turkey.

What a mess it is thinking things are simple. Nobody could disagree with Olga. She had the moral high ground. But somebody has to sign the cheques to pay for her recommendations and thus forbear signing some for other things.

You're anti-social.

0 Replies
 
 

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