Romney 2012?

@joefromchicago,

joefromchicago wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Wow, Romney sure has managed to piss of the Brits pretty good, eh?

Cycloptichorn

The thing is, though, that Romney was right -- the security lapses at the Olympic games are disconcerting. The British press that is excoriating Romney is, at the same time, busy printing stories about those same security lapses.

So what? It doesn't matter if you are correct, when your mission is to make friends. My friends have lots of problems, I don't get far by going over to their houses and pointing them out.

And calling them by the wrong name doesn't help either

Cycloptichorn

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@joefromchicago,

I thought the same when I saw something about it on MSNBC last week. However, since Romney is running for President of the US and he was visiting London at the time, perhaps he should have expressed those sentiments when he came back home rather than putting the British leadership's back up.

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He's running for Ambassador in Chief. This trip was an opportunity to demonstrate that he can speak without being arrogant and obnoxious - that he can get along with folks around the world. What's he's demonstrated so far is that he is completely out of touch, not only with people in this country but with people overseas as well.

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Romney was asked a question, he gave an honest answer. For that, he was pummeled by the media. I don't see anyone saying "he's right, he just shouldn't have said it." Instead, everyone is just assuming he shouldn't have said it without even considering the fact that he's right. The reaction has been just as dishonest and hypocritical as Romney's continued distortions of Obama's statements.

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@joefromchicago,

I saw that this morning. That it doesn't matter if his concerns were legitimate or not, but that you don't walk into someone's house and give your honest opinion when they ask you if you like their new yellow naugahyde couch - even (or especially) if you're an interior decorator.

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@Cycloptichorn,

I'm just glad that Romney's team is there to keep us aware of the threat from the Soviets!

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@joefromchicago,

joefromchicago wrote:

Romney was asked a question, he gave an honest answer. For that, he was pummeled by the media. I don't see anyone saying "he's right, he just shouldn't have said it." Instead, everyone is just assuming he shouldn't have said it without even considering the fact that he's right. The reaction has been just as dishonest and hypocritical as Romney's continued distortions of Obama's statements.

Uh, like I said, the question of whether he's right or not is totally immaterial to the point. That's why nobody's discussing it. It's not Romney's job to be handing out correct criticism of our allies at this time - it's his job to wave and smile and shake hands and pretend that he's everything Obama is not. That's totally fucked now.

Cycloptichorn

1 Reply

@JPB,

Background for the first 5 mins then the discussion of why what he said is more important than the accuracy of his statements.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036789/ns/msnbc_tv-morning_joe/#48350026

1 Reply

@joefromchicago,

That would be okay, but he's already known as a liar, so what good is "truth" when it offends your hosts? He could have lied again, or kept his mouth shut, and all would have been well.

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@joefromchicago,

The two would be comparable if left wing activist or news shows edited his comments to make them mean something other than what he said.

It was rude and people have said it was rude. It also further demonstrates Romney's people problem.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Uh, like I said, the question of whether he's right or not is totally immaterial to the point.

And I'm saying that it shouldn't be immaterial.

Cycloptichorn wrote:

It's not Romney's job to be handing out correct criticism of our allies at this time - it's his job to wave and smile and shake hands and pretend that he's everything Obama is not. That's totally fucked now.

No, what's totally fucked is that Romney gets criticized for telling the truth, and then, when he is forced by the criticism to backtrack on his initial, truthful statement, he's criticized for being hypocritical. That's why the level of political discourse in this country is so abysmally low. What's surprising, though, is that you seem to have totally bought into it.

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@joefromchicago,

Imagine for a second that you are wearing a suit that makes ya look fat, Joe. When I first walk into your office, meeting you and a bunch of your colleagues for the first time, is it my job, when I'm trying to make a good impression, to point it out? Nope. My job is to make a good impression - not to point out the truth.

There's a time for truth-telling and a time for diplomacy and people ought to know the difference. I'm not a politician, someone who gets paid to do this for a living, and I know the difference.

I'm surprised that you can't see the difference here.

Also, I'm not one of the ones criticizing Romney as a hypocrite here - I just think he has a tin ear.

Cycloptichorn

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@joefromchicago,

Imagine that the question was asked with the Prime Minister sitting right beside him. Do you honestly think he would given the same exact tactless answer? No, he wouldn't have, because it was rude and stupid to boot. One of the skills a president needs is the ability to communicate without insulting everyone around you. That is what people can't get over.

1 Reply

@JPB,

JPB wrote:

Background for the first 5 mins then the discussion of why what he said is more important than the accuracy of his statements.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/3036789/ns/msnbc_tv-morning_joe/#48350026

Nope. Nobody even mentioned anything about the accuracy of his statements. Howard Dean even recommended that Romney give an evasive non-answer to the question that he was posed. But then that all just reinforces my point.

1 Reply

@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Imagine for a second that you are wearing a suit that makes ya look fat, Joe. When I first walk into your office, meeting you and a bunch of your colleagues for the first time, is it my job, when I'm trying to make a good impression, to point it out? Nope. My job is to make a good impression - not to point out the truth.

Did I ask you if you thought I looked fat? Am I hiring you because I expect that you will be truthful with me if I ask you direct questions? Is the fate of millions of people riding on whether or not you can be square with me when I ask for potentially inconvenient truths?

Yeah, hypotheticals are hard.

1 Reply

@revelette,

revelette wrote:

Imagine that the question was asked with the Prime Minister sitting right beside him. Do you honestly think he would given the same exact tactless answer? No, he wouldn't have, because it was rude and stupid to boot. One of the skills a president needs is the ability to communicate without insulting everyone around you. That is what people can't get over.

But it wasn't insulting. It was true! Hell, it was in all the British newspapers. The press over there has been complaining for over a month about the slipshod security arrangements, but when Romney points out that they've been having problems, suddenly that's out of line?

Really, Romney has uttered so many outrageous lies during this campaign that I find it highly ironic he's being criticized for one of the few times he actually told the truth.

1 Reply

@joefromchicago,

joefromchicago wrote:

Cycloptichorn wrote:

Imagine for a second that you are wearing a suit that makes ya look fat, Joe. When I first walk into your office, meeting you and a bunch of your colleagues for the first time, is it my job, when I'm trying to make a good impression, to point it out? Nope. My job is to make a good impression - not to point out the truth.

Did I ask you if you thought I looked fat? Am I hiring you because I expect that you will be truthful with me if I ask you direct questions? Is the fate of millions of people riding on whether or not you can be square with me when I ask for potentially inconvenient truths?

Yeah, hypotheticals are hard.

I think most of the hiring committee would want an employee who understands what tact is, and when to use it.

Here's what Romney said, when he was asked if the Brits were ready for the Olympics:

Quote:

"You know, it's hard to know just how well it will turn out," Romney told NBC. "There are a few things that were disconcerting. The stories about the private security firm not having enough people, the supposed strike of the immigration and customs officials … that obviously is not something which is encouraging."

That's not 'truth-telling.' It's an incredibly stupid ******* answer. All he had to say was, 'yes, I'm quite sure they are ready. Even if they have had a few stumbles along the way, well, I can tell you from my personal experience that no program of this size goes off without a hitch. But the country looks excited and I'm sure that the small problems they've had won't ruin what look to be a great Olympics.'

THAT would have been a good answer. The questioner wasn't asking for him to provide details about the problems the Brits have had. He was giving him an opportunity to show support for an ally. And he fucked it up, because he's a consultant at heart, and it shows.

He's a politician - it's his job to know when to be truthful and when not. And it's his job to correctly understand questions that are posed to him.

Cycloptichorn

2 Replies

@joefromchicago,

joefromchicago wrote:

The British press that is excoriating Romney is, at the same time, busy printing stories about those same security lapses.

of course.

I can slam Set, but don't you dare try.

That's how family/friend stuff works.

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@Cycloptichorn,

Cycloptichorn wrote:

I just think he has a tin ear.

both of the Romneys have that problem (IMNSHO)

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@joefromchicago,

The point is that the accuracy of his statements is irrelevant in the context and setting of his response to the question. He's there to demonstrate that he can be "Presidential" on a world stage, not that he's been an Olympics organizer whose opinions on such things matters.

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