Is it possible for a person to have no beliefs at all?

@cicerone imposter,

Reading some of the readers comments on Frank's personal blog certainly reinforces the "facticity" angle !

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@north,

Quote:

there are absolutes though Frank

without air you die

You are totally correct, North.

Boy, if only Fresco would stick to stuff like the need for air in order to stay alive.

He doesn't. He tells us what REALITY is...how it is constituted...what can be eliminated...and all sorts of other stuff.

Don't get me wrong...nothing wrong with that. Theists do it all the time. I just don't agree with them...or with Fresco.

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so fresco what are you on about ?

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@north,

...might as well be the price of fish as far as you and Frank are concerned.

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@north,

I love to know what he is talking about also, North.

The only place I post other than here is at Open Salon--a very different type of forum.

He may be talking about the two guys who post tandem slurs to many of the people there...and who take special delight in trying to get my goat, but except for them (and most people there have trouble with them) I get along fabulously with the group. Met many of them; I've had drinks and personal conversations with two dozen of them; still meet with them in the City (lots of New Yorkers)...no problems at all.

I not sure it is proper to mention another cite here in A2K, but anyone who wants to visit my blog at Open Salon is more than welcome to stop by. Love to hear your comments on anything I have blogged.

As for Fresco, hey...

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@Frank Apisa,

Quote:

Well, ci, what you actually wrote was: “Reality is based on individual observation and perceptions.,.”

That doesn’t seem like an opinion to me. That is why I suggested the alternate wording.

It doesn't seem like an opinion to you, because you're drawing conclusions that's not stated. If you disagree with any of my opinions, provide proof or evidence they are not correct. Until then, it's an opinion.

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

Quote:
Quote:
Well, ci, what you actually wrote was: “Reality is based on individual observation and perceptions.,.”

That doesn’t seem like an opinion to me. That is why I suggested the alternate wording.

It doesn't seem like an opinion to you, because you're drawing conclusions that's not stated.

No...that is not why I am saying it doesn't sound like an opinion. I am saying it does not sound like an opinion...because it is conveyed as though it is a fact--a great truth being revealed by you. It seem, ci, to broach no arguments.

But I am willing to acknowledge that I may be wrong, so let me ask you this: Is it possible that Reality is NOT based on individual observations and perceptions?

Quote:

If you disagree with any of my opinions, provide proof or evidence they are not correct. Until then, it's an opinion.

If you have an opinion, ci...it is your opinion. How would I prove it is not your opinion???

What are you thinking about here?

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@Frank Apisa,

A fact is objective truth; I claim no such thing, and call it an opinion. My opinion is open to challenge.

I cannot prove it as a fact; ergo, it's an opinion.

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

A fact is objective truth; I claim no such thing, and call it an opinion. My opinion is open to challenge.

I cannot prove it as a fact; ergo, it's an opinion.

Well, I will accept then that when you wrote, "Reality is based on individual observation and perceptions"...you were merely expressing an opinion and not sharing some revelation that you have had in this area.

I personally have no idea of what REALITY actually is...beyond whatever IS...IS.

It may be that "Reality is based on individual observation and perceptions"...but then again, that may be totally wrong.

So...we are in agreement. Good to end it this way.

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@Frank Apisa,

You say "that might be totally wrong," but provide no challenge for it. As expected. Mr. Green

You had three choices; 1) agree with the statement, 2) disagree with the statement, or 3) say "I don't know." Instead, your response was to suggest that it might be totally wrong without any explanation. Your ability at debate belongs on the laugher curve.

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

You say "that might be totally wrong," but provide no challenge for it. As expected.

Hello, hello...Earth calling ci!

I did not say it was wrong...but since you insisted it was an opinion, obviously it might be totally wrong.

And since I have said dozens of times that I have no idea of what the REALITY is...how could I "challenge" it????

Jeez.

Quote:

You had three choices; 1) agree with the statement, 2) disagree with the statement, or 3) say "I don't know." Instead, your response was to suggest that it might be totally wrong.

I had another "choice." I could simply call attention to the fact that it might be right...but you might be wrong.

I exercised that choice.

Do you have a problem with that?

Quote:

Your ability at debate belongs on the laugher curve.

Well obviously I am debating the right guy then.

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@Frank Apisa,

Saying "it might be totally wrong" without any explanation for why only insults anyone with intelligence.

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@Frank Apisa,

Wishy-washy as usual. Actually, what you meant was "I don't know."

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

You say "that might be totally wrong," but provide no challenge for it. As expected. You had three choices; 1) agree with the statement, 2) disagree with the statement, or 3) say "I don't know." Instead, your response was to suggest that it might be totally wrong without any explanation. Your ability at debate belongs on the laugher curve.

cic you are being a sophist here and you know it

otherwise , okay cic , you are totally wrong

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@north,

At least you took a position. Now, explain why it's wrong?

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

At least you took a position. Now, explain why it's wrong?

Quote:

Reality is based on individual observation and perceptions"...

because Reality is based on not individual observations and perceptions but based on the whole of individuals , and these are based consistency of the whole

I would say more in depth , but this thread slides into my fundamental reality thread

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@north,

Are you saying that the individual is not the whole? Explain, please.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Are you saying that the individual is not the whole? Explain, please.

yes

the individual is seperate from the whole , yet can be part of the whole at the same time

and as well there are some individuals that never become apart of the whole

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@north,

How does that relate to each individual's reality?

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For whatever it's worth, apparently Wittgenstein couldn't even agree with himself when it came to matters of language, beliefs and reality. Just sayin...

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Is it possible for a person to have no beliefs at all?

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