14
   

Write to the American Catholic Bishops...

 
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 12:21 pm
@Foofie,
If life has no sanctity what is it?

A Thanksgiving dinner is sanctified by the ceremonial arrangements surrounding it. Otherwise it is a carnivore at the downed prey.

0 Replies
 
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 12:42 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Interesting. That little fertility blip is in Afghanistan. I wonder why it's different from surrounding areas.
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 02:34 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
What good will it do, OmsigDavid asks, to mail, or email, or post on Facebook as I have done, this little set of liturgical mandates?

1) It will return the Holy Roman Catholic Church to it canonical standards. That can't be bad for Mother Church.
2) It will show the members of Church that the Authority vested in the clergy is based on a fidelity to its stated theology AS A WHOLE and not, as some have suggested, that it's possible to pick and choose which Papal decrees must be followed. Clarity, it can be argued, is a good thing.
3) It will reveal to the rest (and doubting world) that the Holy Roman Church can once again be trusted as a director and adviser on matters of faith and morals.

Actually, unless the Church begins regulating the birth control behaviors of its members, it will be generations before anyone outside the Church believes a single thing it proclaims.

Joe(how's that?)Nation
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 02:54 pm
@Joe Nation,
Quote:
Actually, unless the Church begins regulating the birth control behaviors of its members, it will be generations before anyone outside the Church believes a single thing it proclaims.


I would be happy just seeing, "that the church has a loves for humanity", but if the church thinks regulating the birth control behaviors of its members are more important then I just do not know what to say.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 02:58 pm
@reasoning logic,
That's the problem with any church trying to control birth issues is that most Catholic women (in the US) already use contraceptives.

Is the church going to intrude into every private bedroom to make sure contraceptives are not used?

Ridiculous!
reasoning logic
 
  0  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 03:06 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
Is the church going to intrude into every private bedroom to make sure contraceptives are not used?


Don't give the republicans any new ideas because they have passed all kinds of laws intruding on peoples private life's already
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 03:43 pm
@reasoning logic,
Hey!
What ever happened to the party that promoted "less government intrusion into private lives?"
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 03:48 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Sociopaths have to pander to the church to get more votes
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 03:53 pm
@reasoning logic,
What is more amazing is their dogma of "do it my way or the highway" mentality. They vote in lock-step with their party leadership like ducks following their mamma. With all that time they quack along on those roads, it's a wonder they haven't been runned over - yet.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 03:56 pm
I have to wonder why anyone is compelled to start a thread like this?

The Catholic Church doesn't govern this nation, and it's members are free to accept or reject its teachings and proclamations.

Whether or not its position on contraception is shallow, hypocritical or just plain stupid, why do you care enough to post a screed?

I guess I must have missed similar screeds posted about the failings you've identified in other faiths.

Clearly, Catholicism fits anyone's definition of a "religion," and therefore is afforded protections by the First Amendment.

It really doesn't matter one whit whether or not you agree with it's tenets any more that it matter whether or not someone has a problem with the tenets of Islam.

The current controversy is all about religious freedom and not contraception. I appreciate that liberals want to frame it as a debate on contraception, but that's because they are seeking cover for their assault on the Constitution.

For whatever reason, the Catholic Church opposes contraception. It's, frankly, not required to justify it's opposition to you, Sebilius or Obama. Forcing it to fund a practice it clearly finds antithetical is a violation of the First Amendment.

Liberals seem to think that the Constitution only applies when they agree with the practices for which others are seeking protection.

If the Catholic Church maintains the exemption that it has had for many many years, there are no women who will be prohibited from obtaining contraception. None.

Considering the rate of teenage, out of wedlock pregnancies, and the heroic efforts of the State to provide them with contraception, the argument that the poor won't be able to obtain the contraception they want if Catholic institutions are not forced to provide it, is specious to say the least.

This is about religion, and the Left has it's humanist religion that holds so-called "Women's Reproductive Rights," far more sacred that does the Catholic Church regard it's opposition to contraception.

reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 04:02 pm
@cicerone imposter,
Quote:
What is more amazing is their dogma of "do it my way or the highway" mentality. They vote in lock-step with their party leadership like ducks following their mamma. With all that time they quack along on those roads, it's a wonder they haven't been runned over - yet.


It is completely normal behavior for humans and I am not trying to put them down when I say that. The problem is that there are intellectual psychopaths that are very logical and they play on this behavior, I also think that they control many world events.
0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  3  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 04:09 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
It's not about religious freedom. People have the right to choose whether to use contraceptives or not, but the "church" is trying to restrict/limit its use to "everybody," not just church members.

That's not about religious freedom; it's about imposing their religious foolishness on all Americans.

Each individual can choose whether to use condoms or not. Many Catholics already use them; that's religious freedom.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  2  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 05:39 pm
@cicerone imposter,
cicerone imposter wrote:

It's not about religious freedom. People have the right to choose whether to use contraceptives or not, but the "church" is trying to restrict/limit its use to "everybody," not just church members.

That's not about religious freedom; it's about imposing their religious foolishness on all Americans.

Each individual can choose whether to use condoms or not. Many Catholics already use them; that's religious freedom.


How is the Catholic Church trying to impose its opposition to contraception on everyone? Yours is a pretty outlandish claim.

Clearly you do not understand freedom of religion as addressed by The Constitution, and I have to seriously question whether or not you understand the whole of the Constitution.

The First Amendment in citing freedom of religion as an unalienable right is not addressing whether or not a citizen must follow the proclamations and tenets of a given religion, it is proscribing the government from intefering with citizens and their chosen religions.

The Constitution lays out the rights of the citzenry and sets limits around the actions of the government. Liberal insist that the Constitution is fluid so that they can accomodate their inate desire and need to coerce the citizenry in accordance with what they have determined is best for them.

Whether or not Catholics choose to ignore the teachings of their church is up to them, but because some, or even many, do has no bearing on those teachings unless the Church, not the government, decides they do.

The government (and most definately the Executive Branch) doesn't get to say "Church XYZ, a lot of your followers don't agree with your teachings and so they don't come under the protection of the First Amendment."

The Catholic Church does not have the power of The Government. It cannot prevent its members from obtaining contraception if they so choose. The fact that it does not want to, in anyway, fund a practice it morally opposes is not the same as prohibition.

This is not an issue of conflicting rights.

I would argue that there is no Constitutionally protected right to contraception, but even if there is, the position of the Catholic Church is not violating that right. There is certainly no Constitutionally protected right to have someone else pay for the contraception you want.
0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 06:15 pm
@reasoning logic,
Quote:
Sociopaths have to pander to the church to get more votes.


But they think you are a sociopath and not without good reasons.

Can you win an argument where you come from by asserting your opponent is a sociopath? That seems a bit easy rl.

You sure can tell who uses contraception. What are you on rl? The cap? Infibulations under the beautiful skin of our helpless doxies? Poisonous pills? Hysterectomy? Lilac scented rubber johnnies with sperm killing insecticides?

Which is it? And abortion if you slip up as backstop.
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 06:23 pm
@spendius,
Quote:
What are you on rl? The cap? Infibulations under the beautiful skin of our helpless doxies? Poisonous pills? Hysterectomy? Lilac scented rubber johnnies with sperm killing insecticides?


Are you asking me on a date?
0 Replies
 
Joe Nation
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 08:05 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Quote:
The Catholic Church doesn't govern this nation, and it's members are free to accept or reject its teachings and proclamations.

Whether or not its position on contraception is shallow, hypocritical or just plain stupid, why do you care enough to post a screed?


Because I think a religious e institution cannot, on the one hand, claim an exemption from the Affordable Health Care while, on the other, completely ignoring the bald fact that 98% of the persons most affected by the issue equally ignore the institution's own rules and mandates.
I want to post this screed(?), as I've said, the original post was not a screed, but a re-statement of CURRENT Catholic theology. I think, if they want an exemption, they should at least be expected to attempt to abide by their own rules, otherwise, yes, we end up being ruled by the shallow, the hypocritical and the plain stupid.

Joe(Sometimes three in one person can mean more than the Trinity)Nation
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 08:41 pm
@Joe Nation,
They are "shallow and stupid," but the conservatives are crying foul, because they claim it's government intrusion into religion. That's even more laughable - beyond shallow and stupid! How does religion interfere with the sexual habits of their members - as if they can. Question #1: Do you wear contraception when you have sex? Question #2: Who wore the contraception? * To determine who sinned. Laughable.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 11:50 pm
@Joe Nation,
Joe Nation wrote:
What good will it do, OmsigDavid asks, to mail, or email, or post on Facebook as I have done,
this little set of liturgical mandates?

1) It will return the Holy Roman Catholic Church to it canonical standards. That can't be bad for Mother Church. * * *

Actually, unless the Church begins regulating the birth control behaviors of its members,
it will be generations before anyone outside the Church believes a single thing it proclaims.

Joe(how's that?)Nation


U posted:
Joe Nation wrote:
Write to the American Catholic Bishops,
even if you are not Catholic,
and demand the following: . . .
FOR WHAT REASON
shud non-Catholics be interested in returning:
". . . the Holy Roman Catholic Church to it canonical standards. . . " etc.

If I convince them to take my (your) advice,
I don't see how I 'll be better off for that. Did I miss something, Joe??

I 'd rather leave them to manage their own affairs.





David
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Fri 2 Mar, 2012 11:56 pm
@OmSigDAVID,
Just because what they are advocating for also affects non-Catholics.

Religious freedom also means freedom from religion.
OmSigDAVID
 
  1  
Reply Sat 3 Mar, 2012 12:55 am
@cicerone imposter,
Joe Nation can speak for himself.





David
 

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