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What is free will?

Forums: Free Will, Philosophy, Logic, Determinism, Definition
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neologist
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 09:57 pm
@Pasture Timmy,
Why not?[/quote]You said Eve should have been able to resist Satan's lie, I'd like to know why you think that? [/quote]Eve was created perfect. Why do you think otherwise?
Pasture Timmy
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 10:43 pm
@neologist,
Pasture Timmy wrote:
You said Eve should have been able to resist Satan's lie, I'd like to know why you think that?
neologist wrote:
Eve was created perfect.
You think Eve should have been able to resist Satan's lie because she was a perfect creation by God, so was Satan's lie stronger than God's perfect creation, or do you have some other explanation as to why Satan's lie overcame Eve's perfection?
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 10:46 pm
@Pasture Timmy,
Pasture Timmy wrote:
You think Eve should have been able to resist Satan's lie because she was a perfect creation by God, so was Satan's lie stronger than God's perfect creation, or do you have some other explanation as to why Satan's lie overcame Eve's perfection?
Answered here:
http://able2know.org/topic/181975-46#post-5494678
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 10:47 pm
This is becoming a roundtable.
Check, please!
0 Replies
 
Pasture Timmy
 
  1  
Reply Thu 14 Nov, 2013 11:18 pm
@neologist,
Pasture Timmy wrote:
You think Eve should have been able to resist Satan's lie because she was a perfect creation by God, so was Satan's lie stronger than God's perfect creation, or do you have some other explanation as to why Satan's lie overcame Eve's perfection?
neologist wrote:

Do you have an explanation as to why a perfect human still wants to do wrong things?
0 Replies
 
Pasture Timmy
 
  1  
Reply Fri 15 Nov, 2013 08:33 pm
@Pasture Timmy,
neologist wrote:
Eve was created perfect.

Did Eve benefit from being perfect when confronted by Satan, and if yes, in what way did she benefit?
0 Replies
 
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Nov, 2013 08:17 am
@neologist,

Quote:
Are you sure you do not have another a2k identity? Reasoning Logic hasn't posted in a while. But you seem to have inherited his learning curve.


You should be glad that not all witnesses are stereotyped to be like you. Many of them do not talk about learning curbs that others may have.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Nov, 2013 10:04 am
@neologist,
neologist wrote:

Why not?
You said Eve should have been able to resist Satan's lie, I'd like to know why you think that? [/quote]Eve was created perfect. Why do you think otherwise?
[/quote]

The story does not show that she was created perfect. In fact, it shows a couple of indications that she was not.

She did not have immortality...and she had no sense of right or wrong...good or evil.

Why do you keep insisting that the story indicates she was created perfect?
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Nov, 2013 01:13 pm
@reasoning logic,
Good to see you back, RL. I honestly have missed your input.
But I was talking about your learning curve.
I had intended to keep your learning curb a secret.
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Nov, 2013 01:28 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:
Why do you keep insisting that the story indicates she was created perfect?
Forgive me, Frank. I know this is inconvenient; but I keep referring to the Bible. Moses did aver: After that God saw everything he had made and, look! [it was] very good. And there came to be evening and there came to be morning, a sixth day (Genesis 1:31)

And I just assumed Moses was talking about the same God when he said . . .The Rock, perfect is his activity, For all his ways are justice. . . (Deuteronomy 32:4) Naturally, I figured that meant Moses thought Eve was perfect.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Nov, 2013 02:54 pm
@neologist,
neologist wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
Why do you keep insisting that the story indicates she was created perfect?
Forgive me, Frank. I know this is inconvenient; but I keep referring to the Bible. Moses did aver: After that God saw everything he had made and, look! [it was] very good. And there came to be evening and there came to be morning, a sixth day (Genesis 1:31)

And I just assumed Moses was talking about the same God when he said . . .The Rock, perfect is his activity, For all his ways are justice. . . (Deuteronomy 32:4) Naturally, I figured that meant Moses thought Eve was perfect.


Well that certainly is one way to read that...a convenient one for your constant assertion that the story has Eve being created perfect.

But we know she was not immortal.

And we know she did not know right from wrong...or good from evil.

So...perhaps Moses also was flawed...and was mistaken for thinking that Eve was perfect.

The story seems to indicate that she was NOT perfect.

Why do you think Moses was right...considering the flaws in Eve that I have pointed out?

neologist
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Nov, 2013 04:07 pm
@reasoning logic,
BTW, while you're here meet Romeo
http://able2know.org/user/romeo_fabulini/
He will delight you
0 Replies
 
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Nov, 2013 04:12 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:
But we know she was not immortal.
Brilliant! Even angels are not. Immortal.
Frank Apisa
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Nov, 2013 07:10 pm
@neologist,
neologist wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
But we know she was not immortal.
Brilliant! Even angels are not. Immortal.


Your GOD is perfect...and your GOD is immortal.

Eve was not immortal.

Eve was not perfect.

neologist
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Nov, 2013 07:38 pm
@Frank Apisa,
Frank Apisa wrote:
Eve was not immortal.

Eve was not perfect.
Are you saying that perfection implies immortality?
Pasture Timmy
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Nov, 2013 08:33 pm
@neologist,
Pasture Timmy wrote:
You said Eve should have been able to resist Satan's lie, I'd like to know why you think that?
neologist wrote:
Eve was created perfect.
Why do you think otherwise?

Pasture Timmy wrote:
It's your beliefs up for discussion so there's no "otherwise" for me to think.
Eve had the perfection which should have enabled her to resist Satan's lies, and yet, she fell to Satan's lies.
You refuse to discuss why Eve's perfection wasn't enough to protect her from Satan, and I suspect it's because you're too embarrassed to admit you don't know.
I'm simply shining some light on your beliefs and you keep pulling the blinds :-)

PS
When one isn't willing to honestly examine their beliefs, it may be time for new beliefs.
0 Replies
 
Romeo Fabulini
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Nov, 2013 09:50 pm
Who sez Evey was perfect?
If she was perfect she'd have obeyed God when he said "Keep your hands off that fruit!"
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Sat 16 Nov, 2013 10:41 pm
@Romeo Fabulini,
Satan was perfect
He was created by a perfect God
He chose to rebel
As did Eve
And Adam
Fil Albuquerque
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Nov, 2013 12:31 am
@neologist,
If we were to take democracy and common sense into account it seams rebelling was the right thing to do... Laughing
neologist
 
  1  
Reply Sun 17 Nov, 2013 01:48 am
@Fil Albuquerque,
It is certainly understandable when men rebel against an imperfect human purpose. God's purpose does not fit into that category.
 

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