52
   

Question to those who do or do not doubt Christianity

 
 
spendius
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 6 Jun, 2012 11:29 am
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
Quote:
Like some Catholics do??


That's a problem you have. I'm not bothered about what "some" Catholics do. I'm telling you what they are supposed to do. Be obedient. Only the ordained are required to be poor and chaste.

Disobedience in public will cause denial of the sacraments. The Church knows how difficult obedience is and knows that not everybody can manage it but it requires them to be contrite when they have succumed to temptation.

The theology would be that if it didn't have confession to return people to a state of grace after sinning it would be soon be gone. But public promotion of the sins is out of the question. And the idea that they are not sins is throwing the towel in. There is then only the outward ceremonials which would be empty. Like the re-enactment performances I mentioned.

reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Jun, 2012 02:11 pm
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
Quote:
I say that it could be wrong depending on how it is acquired.

But now, you are breaking down morality into sub groups...Which makes it even more confusing to try to breakdown...


Why do you insist on making morality more difficult then what it needs to be?
Exactly how hard is it for you to understand that morality can be evaluated by viewing how you think your own mother should be treated. I do understand that some people have mental problems and may not treat their mother with respect so I do not expect people like this to "not" have some challenges being moral. Do you find yourself in this category?.

If you get rich by condoning wage slavery then yes you are being immoral.
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Jun, 2012 04:30 pm
@spendius,
Quote:
Your real task Spade, which you are avoiding facing up to with all these pointless sophistries about right and wrong or good and evil, is to get into a rhetorical battle with all the others who have an open line to God. And to win it and be the Messiah.


Do you think that Ryan has as much love for sophistry as you do?
If you like mind boggling them maybe you will like this.

Reggie Watts disorients you in the most entertaining way

0 Replies
 
JeffreyEqualityNewma
 
  6  
Reply Wed 6 Jun, 2012 04:41 pm
http://desmond.imageshack.us/Himg24/scaled.php?server=24&filename=religiong.jpg&res=landing
spendius
 
  -3  
Reply Wed 6 Jun, 2012 05:02 pm
@JeffreyEqualityNewma,
We know what they are against JE. And we know why.

What are they for? Do they want to demolish all the churches for example. Do they want to remove all Christian influence in schools or in Media? What's their position on baptism, marriage, family and funerals?

They could do with a better tailor before they present themselves. Normally only those in the military wear those style of jackets. Are they para-miltary or playing at air soldier?

Never trust a man in shades. I've never seen the Pope wearing shades. Have you? Or standing outside a ******* shop.

No wonder atheists are languishing in the polls if that's the best you can offer. Why don't you get the knickerless Can-Can going?

What's your objection to the knickerless Can-Can Mr Fraud-fighter?

Have you read Budgie the Helicopter yet?
spendius
 
  -2  
Reply Wed 6 Jun, 2012 05:06 pm
@reasoning logic,
What's "wage slavery" rl? Could you condone it without getting rich? Would that be immoral?
JeffreyEqualityNewma
 
  4  
Reply Wed 6 Jun, 2012 05:08 pm
@spendius,
You're an idiot! Oh I get it, but you don’t. Being an atheist is like being the only sober person in the car, and nobody will let you drive.
spendius
 
  -3  
Reply Wed 6 Jun, 2012 05:12 pm
@JeffreyEqualityNewma,
Never mind that ridiculous analogy.

What are they for was the question you were asked. I even listed a few things to make it easy for you.
0 Replies
 
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Wed 6 Jun, 2012 05:51 pm
@spendius,
Quote:
What's "wage slavery" rl?


Wage slavery has entered into society by means of rankism. "By agreeing that you are more valuable than another person, "who may be more intellectually or environmentally challenged than you, "You have also indirectly agreed to financially rape some of your own love ones. 2 Cents

Quote:
Could you condone it without getting rich?


Sure there are many of people who have drank the poison and are blind to their demise.

Quote:
Would that be immoral?


Ignorance of the moral laws lead to immorality.
FOUND SOUL
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Jun, 2012 02:28 am
@JeffreyEqualityNewma,
Why is your mouth shut if you are an Attorney? Smile

They are gay right? Not that it matters, but.... Therefore angry at the Church for non acceptance, in one way, I agree, rightly so, God made all people, if he stuffed up in the making, then he forgot to put that in the Bible that's all. Equality and all that, I do believe in. Either that or the woman slept on both sides, you are meant to sleep on one side to conceive a boy and the other to conceive a girl.

Hope you see my humor.

0 Replies
 
spendius
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 7 Jun, 2012 03:17 am
@reasoning logic,
But rankism outdates money. The female invented rankism in selecting mates.

Thus, if there is no rankism some females are required to mate with males they don't want to mate with and that's rape. Rankism is an evolutionary principle. It's aka the "pecking order".

Are you anti-evolution rl? Have you been reading early Bernard Shaw?
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 7 Jun, 2012 03:38 am
@spendius,
Quote:
Not at all. I turn no heads. I direct people to Rome that's all. The Church's first question on hearing of someone claiming to be in touch with God is to ask if anybody is listening to him or her.

Claiming to support Christianity, but ultimately being an atheist, does not turn heads???

Good question, do people listen to me?? Yes, they do, maybe you do not, does not mean, that others, do not....

Quote:
I already have done. The Church is the rock (Saint Peter) on which Jesus said it would be built and any messages coming down go through the Vatican switchboard. Splitting hairs dissenters notwithstanding.

No, you have not, that scripture you quoted, says nothing about NEEDING to back the church 100%, to be one of them, or saved...

It is basically saying that the Church will be Jesus when he is gone, but that does not mean that humans still will not make mistakes, and the Church is perfect...

I happen to believe I have a direct line to God, in which I hear things that differ, and God tells me to tell others, and the Pope, which I will do...

There is nothing wrong with that, as they will probably reject it anyways...

Fathers speak well of false prophets, and badly of the good ones...

But, you can not blame me for trying, and caring about the future of the church....


Quote:
What are your points of disagreement with the Church?

I would rather not explain them to you, as I see this as a lose lose for me...

If another true Christian, or Catholic asks me, I will explain it to them....
0 Replies
 
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 7 Jun, 2012 03:47 am
@spendius,
Quote:
That's a problem you have. I'm not bothered about what "some" Catholics do. I'm telling you what they are supposed to do. Be obedient. Only the ordained are required to be poor and chaste.

Disobedience in public will cause denial of the sacraments. The Church knows how difficult obedience is and knows that not everybody can manage it but it requires them to be contrite when they have succumed to temptation.

The theology would be that if it didn't have confession to return people to a state of grace after sinning it would be soon be gone. But public promotion of the sins is out of the question. And the idea that they are not sins is throwing the towel in. There is then only the outward ceremonials which would be empty. Like the re-enactment performances I mentioned.


And who exactly are you, to be telling others what they would/and should be doing, when you do not do it yourself???

Do you go to confession? Do you do the sacraments??

And you did not answer my questions, would you like me to tell you, and constantly remind you, that if you deny Christ, you will be going to Hell, like Catholics believe?

It seems, you are happy, I do not preach that kind of stuff to you, but on the other side of things, If I vear off from what the Church says, you feel it is necessary for you to point it out to me, as to why I am a loose cannon???

Why???

It can not be both ways, either, I am being real and genuine with people...Or I am not...

I happen to find that accepting anyone, is the right thing to do, As in judge not, be not judged...

Whatever you give in my name, you will receive 100 fold...

So, I will continue to speak about God, and talk about peace, mercy, love, acceptance, forgiveness etc...

Because that is how I see Jesus, and that is what I ultimately need from him!!!

It is wrong for you to criticize me, when you do not do any of it yourself....and pose an a Christian, for social reasons...

I do not understand how you can not understand this....

Or, you simply are being think-headed....
0 Replies
 
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 7 Jun, 2012 03:51 am
@reasoning logic,
Quote:
Why do you insist on making morality more difficult then what it needs to be?

Just asking you, some questions, that is all...From an atheistic perspective...


Quote:
Exactly how hard is it for you to understand that morality can be evaluated by viewing how you think your own mother should be treated. I do understand that some people have mental problems and may not treat their mother with respect so I do not expect people like this to "not" have some challenges being moral.

Do you find yourself in this category?.

No...
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  -2  
Reply Thu 7 Jun, 2012 04:32 am
@spendius,
Quote:
I already have done. The Church is the rock (Saint Peter) on which Jesus said it would be built and any messages coming down go through the Vatican switchboard. Splitting hairs dissenters notwithstanding.

So the Church, is Saint Peter, huh? And is not imperfect, huh?

This same Saint Peter, who told Jesus Christ, that he would not denounce Christ, even till death? And Jesus told him, before the rooster crows twice, you will deny me 3 times??

Which he did?

And the same Peter, who was crucified upside down, because he was thought to be against Jesus?

The church, nor mortals are perfect, everything has flaws that are not God himself...

Peter was a man, who had flaws as well....Just like you and I do...

If the church is him, it is not logical to think, the church does not have flaws, as well...

0 Replies
 
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 7 Jun, 2012 11:57 am
@spendius,
What is the significant importance, to you, Using prudent introspection, as to why Jesus makes it clear, that Peter was a sinner, and would deny Christ 3 times before Christ dies?, And says I will build my rock of foundation upon you???

After you answer, I will tell you mine...
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 7 Jun, 2012 12:04 pm
@JeffreyEqualityNewma,
Quote:
You're an idiot! Oh I get it, but you don’t. Being an atheist is like being the only sober person in the car, and nobody will let you drive.

Or, like making a statement about "it" (atheism/Christianity)....By parading around here with you and your buddies, and purposely voting down posts who you "think" are potential Christians? Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

Yeah! I think Spendius, and I, got it!!! Idea 2 Cents


I will break it down for you in case you do not understand it clearly!!!

Quote:
You're an idiot! Oh I get it, but you don’t. Being an atheist is like being the only sober person in the car, and nobody will let you drive.

(You're an Idiot! I understand it, but you do not, Being an atheist, Is like being the only one who is making any sense, but nobody will even listen to you!!!)

Or, like making a statement about "it" (atheism/Christianity)....By parading around here with you and your buddies, and purposely voting down posts who you "think" are potential Christians? Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes Rolling Eyes

Or, Like making it clear, what you think about "potential Christians" By purposely acting like a fool with yourself, and others, by showing a hateful act, to people you do not even know???

Yeah! I think Spendius, and I, got it!!!

Yes! We both understand crystal clear! And you're no better than the next "evil guy"!
spendius
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 7 Jun, 2012 02:58 pm
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
That Jesus chose Peter to impart the last mysteries of his mystical doctrines to, and that He charged Peter with organising a Church which would stand against the waves of heresy and trimming, which had so blighted the Pagan world, so long as Peter chose his successor in the same way and that they each did in their turn right down to our own Pope.

The sort of things that Jesus knew from his curiosity about the secrets of the Pagan mystery religions which were secret and known only to the initiated because the various ancient Greek governments feared them if the masses came to accept them. That is why Jesus spoke in parables at gigs.

But comparing this world to a lightning flash in the dark spaces where new worlds are created still sends shivers down the spine of sensitive souls. I think it is in Luke.

That was no parable. That invented our science. The infinite is in play which was anathema to Pagans for all sorts of wierd and wonderful reasons which can be found in Spengler. The Pythagoreans, with their irrational numbers, were persecuted by murder and exile.

Pilate, as a worldly Roman, did not understand why such things incensed the tribal leaders and to him Jesus was just another Jewish peasant and things were bad enough without having the local bigwigs ranting and raving about something he didn't care about. A fully transparent, free information society would not understand why our leaders are incensed at Mr Manning who, in this fanciful speculation, takes on something of the mantle of a real Jesus.

Or, to say it better, Mr Manning gives us a sense of what Jesus faced.

The secrets being similar in some minor respects, not in content, to the secret arcana of the diplomatic circles which Mr Manning and Mr Assange have shown to the masses.

And "How many years can a mountain exist before it is washed to the sea?"

I don't know that Peter "sinned" by the denials. His courage was being questioned and stimulated for the task Jesus delegated to him and hence to every Pope.

You need to see all the actors in a world as real to them as yours is to you.



0 Replies
 
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Thu 7 Jun, 2012 04:49 pm
@spendius,
Quote:
Rankism is an evolutionary principle. It's aka the "pecking order".


Yes it is the pecking order but sometimes we find that some of the animal instincts in us also handicap us.
Our brains have evolved and allowed us to do many things that other animals have not even dreamed of doing.
It is this pecking order that holds back science from being more useful in our society. If you your pecking order position is looking good to you, it is hard to let that position go.
spendius
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 7 Jun, 2012 05:05 pm
@reasoning logic,
I agree with the last sentence but not the rest. I have seen nothing in pre-Christian thinking that contradicts our animal nature. Only the use of intelligence to refine it. Excepting Ovid. And he was banished.

How useful do you want science to be? And what use was it before the Christian era?

 

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