52
   

Question to those who do or do not doubt Christianity

 
 
spendius
 
  3  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 09:33 am
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
I don't know. If I was to spend my time conjecturing why people do idiotic things I would look for something more significant than a down thumbing.
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 09:44 am
@reasoning logic,
These are my questions....


What do you believe about all the things he says have no evidence are speculative?

What do you believe about when he says that with the 3 theory's, that a multi-verse has to have a beginning, and ANY expanding universe has to have a beginning?

And ever oscillating system, and structure string theory, and higher dimensions or otherwise, has to have a beginning?

What do you believe, about him saying before physics began, there was no physical time? No Physical reality? Prior to that moment the physical moment is nothing?

What it means is nothing, is nothing, and there is no such thing as nothing?

There is no such thing as a vacuum, No such thing as not space, nothing is not empty space, Nothing is not what Steve Hawking Says about a low energy state, (that is like saying I don't have a bank account because my account is at zero?

The only thing nothing can do is Nothing.....

What do you think of this, that he says?

What is the point? The Universe, Couldn't do anything before the beginning point, because it was nothing, and nothing can only do nothing, then there is only one conclusion, the universe could not have created itself and the universe before it was nothing??

It could not have brought itself from nothingness to somthing-ness, because that would imply it could do something?>

Well, what does that mean? that you better think about God, and every physicist who understands this, knows this??

What would you say about what the 2 physicist said about as long as a universe met 5 conditions it would have to have a beginning...If it did not it would not matter, and there is no such thing as past time incomplete??

What do you believe about what he says that the man who is the high arck, for MIT (Guth) said he studies monitory inflation of the universe, and after trying to map out every way, science and math can ONLY explain the future, but not the past?

It must always have a beginning....

What about the 3 getting together and forming the BVG theorem....Which is that all universes, whether, ours, oscillating, expanding etc....Are based on one condition, and that condition, is that the average expansion Huble of our universe, and the other universe, multi, string, etc...that the average Huble expansion be greater than zero, NO MATTER HOW SMALL.....

(it is the rate of the expansion of the universe as a whole)

It would prove ANY universe would have to have a beginning....

To this date, NO ONE has found An EXCEPTION.....



To BIll:

So long as the expansion is greater than zero, no matter how small, that muti-verse, string universe, oscillating universe etc...we can conceive of in an inflationary condition, would have to have a beginning??

Logic:

And with all the universes applying to the BVG theorem, because it has one cause...then all universes would have to have a beginning....

What do you believe about what he says about the bit on thermodynamics of the universe??

(It is around 33 min...)
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 09:46 am
@spendius,
Quote:
You can have 1 to as many powers as you want and it's still 1.

I get that....I am not bothered if people do not thumb me up....I am bothered that people thumb me down, but don't explain why??

If they believe it is that bad, why not tell me why, and we can explain it?

If they thumb me down, it helps no one, not me, or them....
0 Replies
 
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  2  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 09:55 am
@spendius,
Quote:
I don't know. If I was to spend my time conjecturing why people do idiotic things I would look for something more significant than a down thumbing.

I do, but it is still idiotic, and it is significant here....

Like I said I wish it was not even an option....

If people have a pr0blem, they can explain why....If they are going around and thumbing votes down just because, then they are being hurtful!

It is idiotic, and significant here, because Robert Gentel made that an option...

If it was not, it never would have been....
0 Replies
 
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 10:18 am
@spendius,
I will drop it, it does not bother me that much at all....

Just stating to whoever is laughing, it is pointless...
0 Replies
 
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  2  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 11:53 am
Putting aside all the drama and bullshit for a second....Logic, answer my questions when you get a second, we can discuss them...Then I will read the link you provided, and we can discuss them....

OK mate?
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 04:11 pm
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
Quote:
What do you believe about all the things he says have no evidence are speculative?


That does sound true. things without evidence are speculative.

Quote:
What do you believe about when he says that with the 3 theory's, that a multi-verse has to have a beginning, and ANY expanding universe has to have a beginning?


I will be honest it is not my subject of expertise but I could pretend that it was but I think that it would be dishonest.


Quote:
And ever oscillating system, and structure string theory, and higher dimensions or otherwise, has to have a beginning?


same as above

Quote:
What do you believe, about him saying before physics began, there was no physical time? No Physical reality? Prior to that moment the physical moment is nothing?


Without man's brain to construct those concepts none of it would exist.


Quote:
What it means is nothing, is nothing, and there is no such thing as nothing?


You should have watched the Allen Watts video that I shared about nothingness. that way you would have another viewpoint.

Quote:
There is no such thing as a vacuum, No such thing as not space, nothing is not empty space, Nothing is not what Steve Hawking Says about a low energy state, (that is like saying I don't have a bank account because my account is at zero?


I understand what he means but I would like to hear exactly what Hawking said and let him reply to that comment made by Spitzer.

Quote:
What is the point? The Universe, Couldn't do anything before the beginning point, because it was nothing, and nothing can only do nothing, then there is only one conclusion, the universe could not have created itself and the universe before it was nothing??


To claim an empirical understanding about the beginning is to have one hell of an ego.

Quote:
It could not have brought itself from nothingness to somthing-ness, because that would imply it could do something?


same as above

Quote:

Well, what does that mean? that you better think about God, and every physicist who understands this, knows this?


What about all the other physicists that disagree with this?

Quote:
What would you say about what the 2 physicist said about as long as a universe met 5 conditions it would have to have a beginning...If it did not it would not matter, and there is no such thing as past time incomplete??

I would say that they could be wrong or they could be correct I do not know.
I am going to send this before I lose what I have because it is lightening.



reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 04:20 pm
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
Quote:
It must always have a beginning....


We could make all of this much simpler by skipping all of the questions and giving him the benefit of the doubt. Let's say that he was empirically correct in all of what he said, so now we have a God. Lets talk about this God. This God is much more complex than all of what we have been talking about. Does this God have to follow our same understanding and rules that we put forward that we are using for our complex universe or can God just exist and our universe that is less complex than God can not? if so did God have to be created.
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  2  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 07:31 pm
@reasoning logic,
Quote:
What about all the other physicists that disagree with this?

Quote:

What would you say about what the 2 physicist said about as long as a universe met 5 conditions it would have to have a beginning...If it did not it would not matter, and there is no such thing as past time incomplete??

Go on to watch the video at that point, he explains how other physicists are trying eagerly to prove that wrong.....But up to this point, no one has proved otherwise...

It has to be around 22 min or so...
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  2  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 07:50 pm
@reasoning logic,
Quote:
We could make all of this much simpler by skipping all of the questions and giving him the benefit of the doubt. Let's say that he was empirically correct in all of what he said, so now we have a God.

OK...

Quote:
Lets talk about this God.

OK....

Quote:
This God is much more complex than all of what we have been talking about.


Yes...

Quote:
Does this God have to follow our same understanding and rules that we put forward that we are using for our complex universe or can God just exist and our universe that is less complex than God can not?

A God can do anything it wants to do...Do you not agree if God is God, and is a true God??


Quote:
if so did God have to be created.

The only description the Bible gives, was he always was....

So no, he did not have to be created, because he was always was....

The same can not be said about our universe, or any other one....

Whether God always was or was not, doesn't hold water though....

The point at which everything was what it is, was when this God became, or when he decided to start it all, by creating itself, or being there, and creating, time, space, mass, light,....existence...etc....

If it had not happened, there would still be nothingness....And there is no such thing as nothingness....Not with our universe....and it seems not with any other one either.....

And forget the string theory and stuff...Because there is no proof that what physicists say about that is true at all....Its all speculative....

If you can take leaps of faith into trying to prove such things, than clearly a God being here, and starting it all...Is much more plausible....

And easier to examine, and breakdown, and think you "prove" or "disprove" and why?
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  2  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 08:05 pm
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
Quote:
What about all the other physicists that disagree with this?

Quote:

What would you say about what the 2 physicist said about as long as a universe met 5 conditions it would have to have a beginning...If it did not it would not matter, and there is no such thing as past time incomplete??

Go on to watch the video at that point, he explains how other physicists are trying eagerly to prove that wrong.....But up to this point, no one has proved otherwise...

It has to be around 22 min or so...

He goes on to explain that 3 physicists got together...I do not remember their names, just that their initials were BVD....They proposed so long as a universe met 5 conditions it would have to have a beginning, If it did not it would not matter, there is no such thing as past time incomplete....

So far, every universe meets that requirement, and can't be debunked....It is simple, meet one thing, and it shows evidence it had a beginning, not one person, has proved otherwise yet....

Other physicists are trying to prove it wrong, and can't, and have not....

Because it seems every universe meets these 5 requirements....And has a greater huble inflationary higher than zero....(which basically means, the rate at which they expand is greater than zero, no matter how small)

Something had to create it all, and there is no such thing as nothingness....

It means energy always was....And there is no proof....that the universe will fizzle out one day.....Like some say it will just stop dead, and everything will die....

In fact the evidence he presents shows that there always has and is stable energy, not a beginning from nothing, and not a fizzle at the end....Like most physicists claim....Though the evidence is under their noses....
0 Replies
 
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  2  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 08:16 pm
@reasoning logic,
Why do you say this???

There is no such thing as a vacuum, No such thing as not space, nothing is not empty space, Nothing is not what Steve Hawking Says about a low energy state, (that is like saying I don't have a bank account because my account is at zero?



Quote:
I understand what he means but I would like to hear exactly what Hawking said and let him reply to that comment made by Spitzer.

Quote:

What is the point? The Universe, Couldn't do anything before the beginning point, because it was nothing, and nothing can only do nothing, then there is only one conclusion, the universe could not have created itself and the universe before it was nothing??



Quote:
To claim an empirical understanding about the beginning is to have one hell of an ego.

Quote:

It could not have brought itself from nothingness to somthing-ness, because that would imply it could do something?



Quote:
same as above


What do you believe he is wrong about in reading that???

You say you are good with Logic....(and I am not being sarcastic) but that makes perfect logical sense, and is straight to the point....

What is wrong about it??? What would you change or word differently>?

XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  0  
Reply Tue 8 May, 2012 08:25 pm
@reasoning logic,
You know, (no offense) but people are smarter than you think, they are not all evil....there are a lot more righteous than you think (even doubters) and not everyone has a hidden agenda, or is up to no good...

I think you honestly should work or trusting people more often than you do! Wink Wink Not everyone is out to get you, or others...In fact, most probable are not...With some who are...Not that most are....Wink Wink Very Happy 2 Cents
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 May, 2012 12:56 am
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
Quote:
A God can do anything it wants to do...Do you not agree if God is God, and is a true God??



Who says ? do you have proof?

Quote:
The only description the Bible gives, was he always was....

So no, he did not have to be created, because he was always was....

The same can not be said about our universe, or any other one....

Whether God always was or was not, doesn't hold water though....

The point at which everything was what it is, was when this God became, or when he decided to start it all, by creating itself, or being there, and creating, time, space, mass, light,....existence...etc....

If it had not happened, there would still be nothingness....And there is no such thing as nothingness....Not with our universe....and it seems not with any other one either.....

And forget the string theory and stuff...Because there is no proof that what physicists say about that is true at all....Its all speculative....

If you can take leaps of faith into trying to prove such things, than clearly a God being here, and starting it all...Is much more plausible....

And easier to examine, and breakdown, and think you "prove" or "disprove" and why?

You are making a claim that not even the smartest scientist would try to make you have no evidence to back up your claim therefore it ids not scientific.
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 May, 2012 01:02 am
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
Quote:
Why do you say this???

There is no such thing as a vacuum, No such thing as not space, nothing is not empty space, Nothing is not what Steve Hawking Says about a low energy state, (that is like saying I don't have a bank account because my account is at zero?



Quote:

I understand what he means but I would like to hear exactly what Hawking said and let him reply to that comment made by Spitzer.

Quote:

What is the point? The Universe, Couldn't do anything before the beginning point, because it was nothing, and nothing can only do nothing, then there is only one conclusion, the universe could not have created itself and the universe before it was nothing??


I said what I said because anyone can claim anyone said anything. If someone said that you said you seen a unicorn I would like to hear your reply about that because maybe the person is taking what you said out of context.

Quote:
What is the point? The Universe, Couldn't do anything before the beginning point, because it was nothing, and nothing can only do nothing, then there is only one conclusion, the universe could not have created itself and the universe before it was nothing??


You are making a claim that we do not know empirically. even though you may be correct.

Quote:
It could not have brought itself from nothingness to somthing-ness, because that would imply it could do something?


same as above
reasoning logic
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 May, 2012 01:05 am
@XXSpadeMasterXX,
Quote:
.there are a lot more righteous than you think



Romans 3:10
As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 May, 2012 01:24 am
@reasoning logic,
What have the ******* Romans done for us?
FOUND SOUL
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 May, 2012 01:26 am
@izzythepush,
shhhh you hurt my ear drum Smile
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Wed 9 May, 2012 01:31 am
@FOUND SOUL,
Other than sanitation.....
0 Replies
 
XXSpadeMasterXX
 
  2  
Reply Wed 9 May, 2012 11:46 am
@reasoning logic,
Quote:
Romans 3:10
As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Fine, I will rephrase it, There are a lot more good wholesome people, than evil people like you believe, not one is perfect....Is that better?

Why do you quote the Bible, if it is wrong?
 

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