21
   

Why Wait Until They're Dead?

 
 
Roberta
 
  1  
Reply Sat 25 Jun, 2011 11:39 pm
@Sturgis,
Sturgis, I'm not suggesting that we start separate threads to tell people how wonderful (or rotten) they are. I'm suggesting that we take advantage of opportunities (whether public or private) to tell people how we feel, how they've influenced or affected us. and simply what they mean to us.

When I read what people had to say on Bob's thread, I thought that it would have done him good to know how people felt and what they thought. It's as simple as that.

I agree with you that a comment made in the natural course of conversation is the best way to handle the situation. However, how often does it happen?

It never occurred to me that any kind of tiering existed. It never occurred to me that people are counting responses to birthday threads. Insensitive on my part? Mebbe.

I have no interest in syrupy threads or personal tributes. I'm simply suggesting that we let people know how we feel before it's too late . Not only would it do the person we're talking to some good. But it might make us feel better as well.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 12:21 am
@Roberta,
Quote:
I have no interest in syrupy threads or personal tributes. I'm simply suggesting that we let people know how we feel before it's too late . Not only would it do the person we're talking to some good. But it might make us feel better as well.
I think where you have gone wrong is that you take the nice words said in a community setting such as the funeral or the dearly departed threads on A2K as being about the person we are talking about, when it is not....that activity is a community bonding activity, for instance the DYS thread meaning is " A2K means a lot to me". For instance we saw people who have not posted in years come back to let us know that A2K still matters to them, even though they only spoke of DYS. You are right of course that if people dont know how much we care about them before they die then saying the words after they are gone is not going to fix the error, and I have often heard regret for not saying the words before death, but in my experience the words are often not only not needed but would have been painful/awkward to both side had the exercise been accomplished . Is it possible that DYS was not aware of how important he was to A2K, of how the majority held him in high esteem? Based upon the posts from him that I have read I would have to say no.
JPB
 
  6  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 12:34 pm
@hawkeye10,
This is such bullshit that I don't even know where to start.

Yes, wakes (IRL or online) are community bonding experiences, but Roberta is not at all wrong about the words spoken about dys, or cav, or timber being about each of them as individuals. The fact that you haven't made personal connections to A2Kers in no way means that others haven't done so and aren't speaking from their hearts about those personal connections.

You also forget, in this case, that Diane (Bob's partner) is the one who started the thread and that many of the posts there are in support of her and her grief from people who truly care about her as an individual. You shortchange the emotional/personal connection that many A2Kers share with your comments.

I won't comment on your assumptions about what dys did or didn't feel about his perceived roll and/or importance at A2K other than to say that you admitted yourself that you didn't know him very well. How can you possibly have an understanding of what was in his head?
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 01:05 pm
@JPB,
Thank you. I was too flabbergasted to respond.
JPB
 
  2  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 01:09 pm
@ossobuco,
I'm wary that this is a typical hawkeye attempt to post some inflammatory bullshit as a means of making the thread about him and not the topic. I have a feeling I'm going to wish I ignored his post as I'd originally intended.
hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 01:17 pm
@JPB,
Quote:
but Roberta is not at all wrong about the words spoken about dys, or cav, or timber being about each of them as individuals.
those thoughts and feelings are not directed towards the dead, they are an act of sharing, which is a community bonding exercise. The broad show of support towards Diane is likewise a community event.
hawkeye10
 
  -1  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 01:20 pm
@JPB,
JPB wrote:

I'm wary that this is a typical hawkeye attempt to post some inflammatory bullshit as a means of making the thread about him and not the topic. I have a feeling I'm going to wish I ignored his post as I'd originally intended.
The subject at hand is why do we come together after someone passes to say things that we never said to the person who just died directly. Either you want to get a better handle on why this happens or you dont, so either talk or dont talk, but this thread is not about me or any other individual.
Roberta
 
  2  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 06:08 pm
@hawkeye10,
I'm not questioning why we get together after someone dies. I think this is a natural occurrence. And it's not for the person who dies. It's for us--as individuala and as a community.

The issue I've raised is saying how we feel to the person while the person is still alive.

It clearly makes some people uncomfortable. If that's the case, then those people shouldn't do it.

But I am convinced that Bob would have truly benefitted from knowing what people thought.

C'est tout.
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 07:47 pm
@hawkeye10,
hawkeye10 wrote:

Quote:
but Roberta is not at all wrong about the words spoken about dys, or cav, or timber being about each of them as individuals.
those thoughts and feelings are not directed towards the dead, they are an act of sharing, which is a community bonding exercise. The broad show of support towards Diane is likewise a community event.


Gotta say I very much agree with hawkeye on this.
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 07:51 pm
@Roberta,
Roberta wrote:
But I am convinced that Bob would have truly benefitted from knowing what people thought.


I think dys had a reasonable idea of what people thought about him - both good and bad - though he didn't always understand how he could come across to people who didn't know him well. We had a few go-rounds on this on the phone.
Thomas
 
  3  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 08:14 pm
@Roberta,
Roberta, have you checked out Deb's thread from two or three years ago? It was dedicated to telling things to people while they're still alive. It didn't get very far, but if you want to revive it, I guess you're welcome to try.

http://able2know.org/topic/121030-1
0 Replies
 
dlowan
 
  2  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 09:15 pm
@ehBeth,
I think his assessment of what people thought of him became skewed as he got sicker.

When I spoke to him I often thought he was taking offense at things that were meant very positively, for instance.....and hyper-reactive to people who WERE critical.

A couple of times he misinterpreted comments from me that he would have understood easily to have been meant in jest previously.

I truly wish I had assured him how much he meant to me more frequently and more recently.
0 Replies
 
Mame
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 09:51 pm
@ehBeth,
I agree with this and your post below this one, 100%. I believe he knew - he pm'd a lot of people, by the sounds of it, and you can get a great personal interaction from pm'ing. ONce in a while I'd get a one-word one from him that sparked some irreverent discussion - he'd write "Poopity-Head" or "Love that" or some such... he KNEW.

But I understand where Boida's coming from. The time to tell people is when they're still here, not to tell their friends at their Celebrations of Life. Of course, you can do both, but the former is so much more rewarding.

A lesson to us all.
Roberta
 
  2  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 10:25 pm
@Mame,
I agree with Hawkeye on this as well, Bethie. Said so, I think.

Thanks, Thomas. I don't ever remember seeing that thread. A good one, too.

dlowan wrote:

I think his assessment of what people thought of him became skewed as he got sicker. I AGREE>

When I spoke to him I often thought he was taking offense at things that were meant very positively, for instance.....and hyper-reactive to people who WERE critical. I AGREE.

A couple of times he misinterpreted comments from me that he would have understood easily to have been meant in jest previously. ME TOO>

I truly wish I had assured him how much he meant to me more frequently and more recently. ME TOO>
Mame, I think Bob's perspective had changed. I repeat. I think it would have done him good to hear what people had to say. But maybe since his perspective had changed, it wouldn't have mattered. I don't know.

Bottom line:

You wanna say something, say something.
You don't wanna say something, don't say anything.
You think the person you wanna say something to won't take it well, use your judgment.

0 Replies
 
Butrflynet
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 10:52 pm
Just want to say that I love my mom, BBB, and hope she has a very positive outcome after her surgery tomorrow morning. I'm hoping this repair and replacement of her knee is just as much of a life changing event as the first one was, only much more positive this time, and that it leaves her relatively pain free and with a much improved and more fun-filled quality of life.
0 Replies
 
Mame
 
  1  
Reply Sun 26 Jun, 2011 11:09 pm
I have, as it happens, recently lost 5 or 6 people who were quite dear and meaningful to me - they were all, but one, in their 50s and friends of mine for years. I miss them... there is a gaping hole in the fabric of my life now and I don't expect it to be filled any time soon. I have their pictures on a bulletin board and I see them every time I type. Sometimes I will want to call them to share something specific, then I look up and remember that they're no longer available. It's a total bitch.

This time in my life I seem to be going through a lot of that missing-ness and it totally sucks... it's hard to adjust to. My friend, Don... well, it took me the better part of a year just to be able to realize he was actually gone. We'd lived so much of our lives together, he was a brother to me. I miss him.

Missing people really sucks.
Roberta
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 Jun, 2011 02:30 am
@Mame,
I share you good wishes, Butreflynet. Hoping very hard for a good outcome.

Gotta agree, Mame. Missing is suckocious. I've done my fair share of that. I think we all have.
0 Replies
 
Butrflynet
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 Jun, 2011 05:38 pm
Just wrote this privately to Izzie, but decided to shout it out to the world.

Quote:
Love you for always being you, Izzie. No matter how much you are hurting or how badly the world is treating you, you always have time, kind words and good thoughts for others.

Thank you. It means a great deal to me to know that you are there if and when I need a virtual hug.

Right back atcha with the good thoughts, my dear.


The world needs a whole lot more people like Izzie.
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Mon 27 Jun, 2011 05:48 pm
@Butrflynet,
That is so true.
0 Replies
 
sytico
 
  1  
Reply Tue 28 Jun, 2011 12:23 pm
I agree and many times people don't express how they feel until its too late. The dead does not know how you feel its better to tell them when they are alive.
0 Replies
 
 

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