Love triangle

Bill,

My apologies, I originally replied to your post, but that comment was aimed at two people that used that term.

I too think people should always take full responsibility for their own lives - both the good and the bad.

Affairs can be both right and wrong (at the same time). Given that your husband and you made vows, and he expects you to keep them while married to him (and may be very hurt by your actions...it is certainly wrong to deceive your husband about this, and not allow him an informed choice on whether to stay with you or leave you. The 'right' can exist when it comes to trying to achieve a happy life (that would take more explanation), but that 'rightness' is always a flawed path to happiness. It's more 'understandable' than 'right'.

It seems most people engaged in affairs still do. But do you respect him?
Sex with the opposite sex is a natural inclination. That's not what is wrong with it, and you know it.
You certainly can't use the actions of others to justify your own unique circumstances.
Seriously? You can't comprehend that a person who has little compunction cheating on a partner they promised to be faithful to, doesn't hold faithfulness in the highest stead? You actually believed that he would never 'cheat' on you to?
So you had sex with your husband as well during that time? Your concept of loyalty is bemusing. I said to a friend once that people rewrite their concept of loyalty once they start engaging in affairs.
So you flirted with other guys too? (I actually don't find anything wrong with flirting if that's all it is, but it is interesting that you mention this in such a way)
That shouldn't be a surprise at all. Exactly what did you promise him? That you would be with him for the rest of his life? That he'd have to play second fiddle? That he'd have to share you with your husband? Grow up girl - you are playing a world of deception, expecting that you are special and won't be yourself deceived by the deceiver... and then you are surprised when you are 'deceived'?

I am not surprised and didn't expect him to be loyal to me. He is a flirty man and it is possible that he was engaged with other women besides me. But I was hurt that it happened and still happens in front of me. I have a very good job and currently quiting isn't an option. I need some advice on how to be able to be in a situation where i'ts all over between us but still have to work together as part of a team on a daily basis and still maintain distance between us. How should i react to him because not talking to him at all isn't an option. I am concerned that due to our daily interaction things might develop again. There's a very big attraction between us but i don't want to let him hurt me again....

I would suggest that you might gain an understanding of your situation and how to deal with it by seeking out some mental health counseling.

Most such counseling is likely to be cover by your company healthcare plan.

I think that's really the core issue -- the affair part is distracting.

Lots of people enter into workplace relationships, then break up and still have to see the ex -- alllll the time.

It's a big reason to not get involved in those kinds of relationships -- but there is nothing you can do about that now.

You mentioned that you had started seeing other guys, I think. That's good. It's harder to move on when the ex is right there and you're still attracted, but you seem resolved to not let things start up again.

Time will help. Seeing other people will help. A new job would definitely help but I understand what you mean about not wanting to quit. He might move on at some point.

But it's likely to just be rough for a while.

Good luck...

If someone fucks around with you they will **** around on you. You're both guilty of whoring around. Grow up.

Betty -
You are in a marriage that is not fulfilling. Since you had this "distraction" at work, you let the marriage simmer, status quo. Now the distraction is gone (in fact, he has moved on RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOU) and there you are: left with your crappy marriage and humiliated by your lover. .

You know the only way to get away from this man is to change jobs. But I really don't think you want to. In fact, I think you have the fantasy that you and lover-boy are going to get together again.

So here's what you want to hear: Yes, YOUR LOVER IS A CREEP

but YOU ARE A FOOL.

I bet the office gossip is really amusing.

Girlfriend, get ahold of yourself!!!!!

I completely forgot that SHE's married. Heh. "Seeing other guys." Oh dear.

Yeah, that does make the affair part more pertinent.

You could start by making up you mind as to whether it is all over or if you are hurt when he cheats on you by flirting with other women. And if it is all over then stop being whiny about him doing his cruising in front of you in the office, you knew when he cruised for you that he does this in the office, and as you have no claim on him he owes you nothing. The problem is not him, it is that you have not learned to take the emotionalism out of office romances. He was never your husband or Boy Friend, he was never WITH you. The thread title shows that you fundamentally do not understand the situation.

Betty, Hawkeye in a way has it right, but largely his comments I see as unfair, because you are female, and generically (and genetically) speaking, most womens emotions behave differently in these situations than mens.

What you need to realise is that it is well and truly over between you and him. By what you've said, you may not want to be hurt by him again, but a part of you still craves him (or the connection you had with him, or similar, but it still ends up the same).

Let me put it this way - if he started chasing you again, saying how much he missed you, and how much of a mistake he made, and that he should never have been so much of a fool, but he's realised he can't do without you...would you weaken to him? IF you did consider going back to him, you wouldn't be understanding this guy in the least (he was married and having two affairs at the same time - that you know of). He was having two sexual relationships at the same time within his own office - do you realise what kind of guy does this?

On a deep and complete level, he is not compatable with you. He is like an addiction (of any sort)- gives you the great highs but can destroy your life.

He will destroy your life because he has no respect for you (none, zip, zero). I mentioned that people engaged in affairs lose respect for their spouses - but in that case, respect is categorised - you don't (and can't) respect your husband for believing your lies, or for not seeing what's going on, but you can respect him for other things (maybe he is kind in other ways, or socially popular or some other). For this guy at your work - your main relationship with him is that of prey, of a thing to be hunted for sex. He says the words, but they are empty, only serving to satisfy his lusts. His respect for you is actually next to non-existant...you were just an means to an end, so long as you amused him.

He may have used the 'my marriage is unhappy' line on you - and almost every single guy that has ever engaged in an affair with a woman who was cautious about engaging in an affair, has used that same line. He no doubt used it with the other girl at work as well.

What I'm saying is - you need to understand men, and the types of men out there, and that this guy is deeply incompatable with either you - your self esteem and your (overall, longterm) happiness.

He's not going to change for you, and has likely been engaging in many more affairs than you are aware of, over a long period of time.

Lastly (sort of lastly), his initial path down this road may have started with a similar attitude to where you are at now...peoples beliefs change with their actions. If a persons behaviour goes against their beliefs - the first time they can talk it away, the second time they hop to and fro, and by the third time, they are talkng themselves into why their behaviour is right...enough times and they come to believe their behaviour is truly 'right'.

There's a likely pedophile on these forums who started of stating he was attracted to (only just) post pubescent girls, and he was able to argue black and blue with great articulation why (if they consented) it was okay for him to chase them and have sex with them...it didn't matter how many arguments people put against him he found what he believed was a justification that argued their 'positions' away. I mentioned that he did this and that he was likely to progress to children and when he did he would come up with justifications for his tasted then too, and he denied this. About 2 years later, I found him posting about how pedophilia wasn't wrong, and despite people giving him very good reasons, he once again, argued black and blue how their stances were actually in error....and that is what I mean by peoples beliefs change to suit their actions (whether that action is right or wrong). Not calling you a pedophile - just giving you a warning of how the mind works to accomodate our behaviour, even when something is clearly wrong.

This is why it's very important for people to stick up for themselves - because not doing so leads to your mind justifying why it's 'not important' to do so...which if you don't stick up for yourself over and over, often leads the mind to believe 'it's not important because I'm not worth it'.

The second time is easier than the first, and the third time is easier than the 2nd. So be aware of who you are, and respect yourself (and others too, but yourself first 51/49).

...ugh I'm long winded !

However, when a woman complains of being victimized because the man in her life is not conforming to her emotional expectations she must be made aware that men are different, that the fact that men are not women and do not behave always as women want them to behave does not make them abusers.

I dont think that we have heard any evidence that this guy has done anything wrong...he is on the hunt for chicks, he is successful, he is open about what he wants and about how he attempts to get what he want. Women who get mixed up with him who dont understand the score have only themselves to blaim, and should stop taking out their hurt on him.

And the woman you are writing to have no problem with lying to her husband and betraying her husband and her vows.

Somehow your implying that she is just a poor victim of a smooth talking male is sickening.

If I cheated on my wife it would be my fault not any woman I picked to cheat with.

Abuser? I didn't use that term, though it could apply depending on how you wanted to define and apply it - predator is more accurate, or hunter if you like a softer term for it.

That would depend on whether you think it is wrong to unecessarily hurt another person.

Ouch...Bill, I posted that before I had completed my post (bad habit of mine). See the completed post. By the way, she is a 'victim' (if you want to use that word it's up to you prey/victim) of smooth talking (though 'prey' would be more accurate). That doesn't make her any less responsible for the decision to engage in an affair with him. Your issue with this view is that you victims as helpless and 'not at fault', where as in these cases, victim is just a terminology, and she is not helpless and not 'not at fault'.

Sounds like you have two relationships that you need to end.

Your husband deserves better, and you are too jealous to be in a relationship with someone who puts you in 3rd or 4th space. Recognize it, deal with it.

Let your husband find someone who's more respectful of him.

NONSENSE and I mean nonsense if it was not this guy she would had found another partner.

She was on the market for having an affair and if she had not been all the smooth talking men in the world would not had been able to get her into bed.

I love the idea that women are children and prey to any man with a smooth line.

You obviously didn't read my post properly (to reply what you did), and you have quoted out of context - that wasn't a standalone sentence or concept - explanation followed. That line of thought was purely related to your use (not my use) of the word 'victim'. Personally, I don't care for the word victim, unless a person is in a true victim situation (eg a pedestrian suddenly being set upon by a group of drunken thugs) - an even then, after the situation, I don't care for people playing the victim (grief is okay, playing the victim is not). Being nostalgic - my brother, who is quadraplegic through no fault of his own, has never played the victim...and if he had tried I probably would have had words with him. For what he's in, I'm quite proud of him

We don't disagree.
Obviously sarcasm, but you aren't reading my posts properly to even conceive that I have anywhere suggested that. I'm guessing you read something in isolation.

So what is your argument here, that once a guy hooks up with one woman in the office that he can not hook up with anymore if that one woman objects, is hurt that he is finding other women in front of her? I think not, she knows what he does or at least should, and he should not feel guilty about not changing his hunting grounds in the face of her objection.

I was referring to the OP, and while she did not use this term she implied that he was abusing her emotionally.

I would have thought what I said was straight forward - if you don't find anything wrong with unecessarily hurting others, then according to you, he has done nothing wrong.

But it appears that are getting confused with overall right and wrong, versus part right and part wrong (the same action can be right for him/her and wrong for someone else)...whereas you said he hasn't done anything wrong.

Let me put it this way - men will always be hunters - that is our very nature. Men will also carry out the 'hunt' in different ways. Some will do so respectfully, some will do so with great focus, some will do so with humour etc. But to say that 'it is in our nature to hunt so nothing we do on the hunt could be wrong' would be niaive.

You want to talk about naive....the work place is the primary place to find sex partners, and you are claiming ( I gather) that this guy continuing to use the workplace as his hunting grounds is disrespectful. You are attempting to place an onerous burden on this guy because one woman who has no basis to complain is complaining. I agree that he should not rub his ex FB's face into current operations, but since you seem to be saying that he should not be doing anything in the office I have to conclude that you are out of line.

You are reading way more into what I said than exists

We agree that one of the primary places to find sex partners is the work place (there are others : pubs, clubs, organisations, social gatherings, internet dating sites etc).

You note that you went from a discussion of what was right and wrong, to not even having attempted to to answer the question (is it right or wrong to unecessarily hurt another - which is a generic question) to trying to do away with the question by trying to attach it to a specific example? I presume you think that by then arguing away the womans 'right to complain' you can avoid answering the question.

As another note, I'm not trying to place an 'onerous burden' on anyone. I asked a simple question. Can I presume you view it as onerous only because you don't care for the answer?

Btw you have, a number of times now, used examples to try to 'justify' his behaviour by comparing the specific given situation to a pickup guy who goes from one short term fling to the next to the next - which ignores the fact that the OP had been engaged in a long term 'relationship' with this guy, and did have time to build expectations (whether those expectations were flawed, hypocritical, or otherwise). You are trying to build your 'case' on what is not the case here, and only comparable in some ways, not others. You would have to ask yourself why you keep doing this, rather than using the already given specifics as a starting point for your views.

It's interesting how you take so many things in the negative. No where here have I suggested this.