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The Republican Nomination For President: The Race For The Race For The White House

 
 
H2O MAN
 
  -1  
Reply Fri 22 Apr, 2011 02:21 pm
@mysteryman,
mysteryman wrote:

Donald Trump, IMO, has no business running for president.


Agreed... it's a publicity stunt.
realjohnboy
 
  2  
Reply Fri 22 Apr, 2011 02:57 pm
@H2O MAN,
I think you are (gasp) right about Trump. But I think he will stay in during the early caucus/primary season (Iowa, New Hampshire, South Carolina, Nevada and particularly Florida).
He is a zillionaire and will be funding his own campaign however long that goes. I think he will grow weary of the spending, though.
The 1st four are, I believe, "winner takes all." Florida, however, will allocate Repub delegates on a proportional basis.
H2O MAN
 
  0  
Reply Fri 22 Apr, 2011 03:13 pm
@realjohnboy,
realjohnboy wrote:

I think you are (gasp) right about Trump.


I know that took a big pair to admit I was right, but all I really did was agree with you.
realjohnboy
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Apr, 2011 05:11 pm
@H2O MAN,
I started this thread at the beginning of this year, expecting there would be Repubs diving into the pool. I even got my buddy Mysteryman to sign on as a cohost. He is a conservative but not necessarily wedded to the Repub party, I believe. And Irishk, a fellow political junkie.
Four months have passed and there are no major Repubs officially in the race, 18 months until election day but only 8 months until the 1st Repub event.
Not much to talk about thus far.
I did note a poll out from Dartmouth in NH, one of the early primary states. A small poll with a rather high MOE.
It showed Romney beating Obama 47% - 37%. Against other possible Repubs, Obama wins by double digits.
Cycloptichorn
 
  0  
Reply Fri 22 Apr, 2011 05:13 pm
@realjohnboy,
realjohnboy wrote:

I started this thread at the beginning of this year, expecting there would be Repubs diving into the pool. I even got my buddy Mysteryman to sign on as a cohost. He is a conservative but not necessarily wedded to the Repub party, I believe. And Irishk, a fellow political junkie.
Four months have passed and there are no major Repubs officially in the race, 18 months until election day but only 8 months until the 1st Repub event.
Not much to talk about thus far.
I did note a poll out from Dartmouth in NH, one of the early primary states. A small poll with a rather high MOE.
It showed Romney beating Obama 47% - 37%. Against other possible Repubs, Obama wins by double digits.


And even HE hasn't declared yet!

It's hard to believe that things have gone this long without anyone really coming forth. Can't be confidence inspiring for the other team.

Cycloptichorn
H2O MAN
 
  0  
Reply Fri 22 Apr, 2011 06:04 pm
@realjohnboy,
I think conservatives are waiting to see what liberal(s) will jump
in and run against Barry before they lay their cards on the table.

I don't know if this is a good strategery or not, but that's what it looks like.

Romney has no chance - his version of healthcare is almost
as bad as Obamacare and this will come back to haunt him.
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Apr, 2011 06:11 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:
And even HE hasn't declared yet!

It's hard to believe that things have gone this long without anyone really coming forth. Can't be confidence inspiring for the other team.


it seems that neither team is feeling particular confidence

definitely interesting to watch


(Cdn elections are called/campaigned and completed in six weeks - we just don't have the enormous lead-up time you do - entertaining for sure)
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Sun 24 Apr, 2011 05:33 pm
@ehBeth,
http://nymag.com/daily/intel/2011/04/this_week_in_fake_presidential_1.html

this week's list

Ron Paul going up 87%

John Bolton down to 0.8%

Quote:
* Ron Paul * 87%

Paul said in Florida yesterday that he hasn't decided yet whether or not to run, but he'll make up his mind sometime in May. When asked if the candidacy of Paul-ish libertarian Gary Johnson will have an effect on his plans, Paul said “Probably not. It seems like he is making his own decision and I’ll make my own.” Johnson may eat a bit into Paul's base of support, but let's be honest, Paul isn't worried about actually winning anyway.


Quote:
* Rick Santorum* 84%

Santorum made a couple of hires in Iowa this week, and is making his twelfth visit to the state next week. The guy apparently thinks he has a chance.



Quote:
* Newt Gingrich * 78%

One sign that Gingrich is running: He's not backing Paul Ryan's Medicare plan — the one with the Medicare cuts that will be really unpopular with old people once they understand them.



...


Quote:
*Rand Paul* 1%

Paul has already filed for reelection to the Senate for the race that won't happen until 2016.


more links within the article
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Apr, 2011 12:58 pm
Here's a good article on USA Today on Donald.

Quote:
Poll: What kind of president would Donald Trump make?
By Susan Page, USA TODAY

WASHINGTON — Republicans may be ready for a fling with Donald Trump, but a USA TODAY/Gallup Poll shows they have reservations about installing him in the White House.

The real estate developer and reality TV star, who scores at the top in polls of the GOP field these days, falls to fourth when Republicans are asked to rate who among the contenders would be a “good” or “great” president in office. Fifty percent of Americans, including 31% of Republicans, predict Trump would make a “poor” or “terrible” president.

His candidacy faces broad resistance: 63% of Americans, including 46% of Republicans, say they definitely will not vote for Trump for president
. In comparison, 46% of Americans say they definitely will not vote for President Obama — significantly lower but itself a hurdle to winning the 2012 election.

Still, Trump has managed to command center stage in the race, garnering enormous attention as he weighs whether to form a campaign committee and schedules trips to Iowa and New Hampshire, states with early contests.
0 Replies
 
roger
 
  2  
Reply Mon 25 Apr, 2011 01:23 pm
@ehBeth,
I give you fair warning about Gary Johnson. If you don't like what he says, don't vote for him. He will not change his line once elected. Our state house politicians in Santa Fe just hated that man. Not that he had any trouble winning a second term as governor.
0 Replies
 
realjohnboy
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Apr, 2011 01:34 pm
Flash! Haley Barbour drops out of the race for 2012 nomination.
Cycloptichorn
 
  -1  
Reply Mon 25 Apr, 2011 01:35 pm
@realjohnboy,
realjohnboy wrote:

Flash! Haley Barbour drops out of the race for 2012 nomination.


Awwwwwwwwwwww, I had a whole stable of jokes ready to go for him, that I've been waiting to use! ****! I'm going to stop hoarding them for the other Republican candidates.

Cycloptichorn
realjohnboy
 
  0  
Reply Mon 25 Apr, 2011 01:40 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

Awwwwwwwwwwww, I had a whole stable of jokes ready to go for him, that I've been waiting to use! ****! I'm going to stop hoarding them for the other Republican candidates.
Cycloptichorn


Fear not. There are still a lot of jokes in the race.
0 Replies
 
djjd62
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Apr, 2011 01:41 pm
not really paying attention to you guys, apparently we're having an election of our own up here these days

just curious, have the democrats picked their candidate yet
0 Replies
 
realjohnboy
 
  0  
Reply Mon 25 Apr, 2011 01:53 pm
@realjohnboy,
Nate Silver at 538 had this nifty graphic back in early February. It looks like Barbour's withdrawal benefits Gingrich the most.
realjohnboy wrote:


Cycloptichorn wrote:



http://www.538host.com/gopchart.png

http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/02/04/a-graphical-overview-of-the-2012-republican-field/

Quote:
One can certainly debate exactly what it means to be a moderate or a conservative, and exactly where any particular candidate falls along this spectrum. Likewise, the insider/outsider dimension is somewhat blurry: is a potential candidate like Senator Jim DeMint of South Carolina, who aligns himself with the Tea Party but is also an influential senator, a part of the Republican establishment or an opponent of it? So my placement of the candidates is necessarily approximate.

With that said, it is exceptionally important to consider how the candidates are positioned relative to one another. Too often, I see analyses of candidates that operate through what I’d call a checkbox paradigm, tallying up individual candidates’ strengths and weaknesses but not thinking deeply about how they will compete with one another for votes. If you like, you can think of the circles on my chart as stars or planets that exert gravitational forces on one another, seeking to clear their own safe space in the galaxy while at the same time stealing matter (voters) from their opponents.

There are two more kinds of information embedded in the chart. First, the area of each candidate’s circle is proportional to their perceived likelihood of winning the nomination, according to the Intrade betting market. Mitt Romney’s circle is drawn many times the size of the one for the relatively obscure talk-radio host Herman Cain because Intrade rates Mr. Romney many times as likely to be nominated.

(I should note that there are several cases in which I am in considerable disagreement with the bettors at Intrade about the viability of each candidate. But using their figures as the basis for drawing the circles at least lends some objectivity to the assessment.)

I have excluded candidates like Gov. Chris Christie of New Jersey or Jeb Bush of Florida who have strongly denied any interest in running in 2012, even though some of them trade at nonzero values on Intrade.

Finally, the color of each circle reflects the region the candidate is from:
blue for the Northeast, red for the South, green for the Midwest, and yellow for the West.

Does this matter, by the way? I suspect it is somewhat overrated as a factor in the race — the notion, for instance, that voters in Iowa will have any special affinity for a candidate from South Dakota seems tenuous to me — but for parts of the country that have a strong sense of regional cohesion, like the South and perhaps New England, it is worth considering.

Let’s proceed to consider the candidates by working through the four quadrants of our “galaxy.”

Conservative Insiders
These are mainstream, conventional conservatives who will typically have jobs as governors or, especially, senators. Emblematic of the group is Senator John Thune of South Dakota. There is nothing especially distinct about Mr. Thune, whose chances I consider to be somewhat overrated. To some extent, though, that may be the point: he can excel at the areas that establishment candidates are typically good at, like fundraising and garnering endorsements, while at the same time being inoffensive to both moderate and conservative voters. An analogy can be drawn to John Kerry in 2004, an establishment liberal senator who won his party’s nomination under similar circumstances, while other candidates imploded.

The Washington establishment, of course, has not been popular of late — and Mr. Thune has cast some votes that he will have to answer for, like the ones on the federal bailouts. Still, the space surrounding Mr. Thune is not terribly crowded.

The other candidate who clearly seems to fit into his quadrant is Gov. Haley Barbour of Mississippi, but Mr. Barbour may have difficulty appealing to voters outside the South, especially after his recent comments about the civil rights era.

I have also placed Newt Gingrich in this quadrant, but there is a fair amount of distance between him and Mr. Thune, both stylistically and ideologically. Mr. Gingrich is a difficult case, a former Speaker of the House (it’s hard to get more establishment than that) who has more recently aligned himself with Tea Party groups.

Conservative Outsiders.
Central to any discussion of this group is, of course, Sarah Palin, the former Alaska governor. But Ms. Palin, if she runs, may find herself in a crowd. There are several potential candidates in her orbit, like Mr. DeMint, Representative Michele Bachmann of Minnesota, Rick Santorum of Pennsylvania, and perhaps Mr. Gingrich; these candidates may compete with her for voters whether or not they are viable themselves.

Meanwhile, there is Mike Huckabee of Arkansas, an old-fashioned populist whom voters see as more moderate than Ms. Palin, especially on economic issues. The constituencies of Mr. Huckabee and Ms. Palin are not exactly the same — she cannot match his appeal to evangelical conservatives, while he may not match hers to the Tea Party. But polls nevertheless suggest that voters who have Ms. Palin as their first choice often have Mr. Huckabee as their second, and vice versa. If either were to stay on the sidelines, the other would become a much more formidable candidate.

Moderate Insiders.
This quadrant may also become quite crowded. Two years ago, I placed Mitt Romney, a former governor of Massachusetts, slightly more to the conservative than the moderate side of the spectrum. But between his restraint in latching on to the Tea Party and some of the other causes of the conservative movement, and his having signed a health care bill while in the governor’s office that bears some resemblance to the one passed last year by the Democratic Congress, Mr. Romney seems likely to be branded as a moderate, whether he likes it or not. With that said, Mr. Romney is not so far removed from Mr. Thune, and the two candidates may compete with one another for support in the Republican establishment.

Perhaps of more immediate concern to Mr. Romney is a former Utah governor, John Hunstman, who may run for the presidency now that he is resigning from his post as ambassador to China, effective April 30.

Mr. Huntsman faces some significant hurdles — his name recognition is not terribly high outside Washington and his home state, and if he cannot begin to concentrate on his campaign until May, he may not be able to put together a strong campaign team or raise enough money. Also, his having served in Barack Obama’s administration could make his positioning awkward on a number of levels.

Still, he is similar to Mr. Romney in a number of ways, including policy positions and more superficial attributes like his Mormon faith and his good looks. One nightmarish scenario for Mr. Romney is that Mr. Huntsman takes enough votes away from him to keep him from winning an important early primary like New Hampshire, Nevada or Florida, even though Mr. Hunstman is not likely to win the nomination himself.

Another candidate in the general vicinity of Mr. Romney and Mr. Hunstman is Gov. Mitch Daniels of Indiana, who has more explicitly embraced his moderation. He has called for a “truce”, for instance, on social issues, and expressed a willingness to consider tax increases to rectify a budget deficit.

Mr. Daniels’s position is interesting. While he has a reputation for being a policy wonk, a quality that we would ordinarily associate with an “insider” candidate, his willingness to take controversial stands in some ways credentials him as a critic of the party establishment. Also, to the extent that geography matters, there aren’t very many Midwesterners to directly compete with him, apart (to some extent) from Tim Pawlenty.

Moderate Outsiders.
Except for Mr. Daniels, whom I place right at the insider-outsider threshold, this space is quite vacant, with only two potential libertarian candidates, Rep. Ron Paul of Texas and former gov. Gary Johnson of New Mexico, as well Donald Trump, who is considering a presidential run but who — oddly for Mr. Trump — has not attracted much publicity for it. One thing to consider about Mr. Paul and Mr. Johnson is that the votes they attract may come from people who would otherwise cast no vote at all in the race, considering how few other candidates are positioned anywhere near them.

The sparseness of this quadrant may be no accident: centrists of both political parties tend to work within the establishment rather than outside it. One who might have been an exception, Mr. Christie of New Jersey, has repeatedly denied any interest in running.

Tim Pawlenty I had trouble placing him in any of the four quadrants. As Jay Cost of The Weekly Standard points out, — Mr. Pawlenty enjoys something of a reputation as a moderate even though his positions are fairly conservative: he has pledged to reinstate the military’s “don’t ask, don’t tell” policy, for instance. Likewise, Mr. Pawlenty seems to keep Washington at arm’s length while having supporters within the Republican establishment.

I have been skeptical about Mr. Pawlenty’s candidacy, in large part because his personality is not terribly dynamic and he has had some trouble creating a strong brand for himself; sales of his book “Courage to Stand”, for instance, have been quite weak. Still, he can be credited with a viable strategy: stay a safe distance off the lead lap, and hope for a multicar pileup ahead of him.

That Mr. Pawlenty has been among the first Republicans to build out his campaign infrastructure fits with that strategy — it would be valuable in the car-crash scenario, which implies a long, drawn-out nomination process. So does the fact that Mr. Pawlenty could plausibly position himself as conservative or moderate, insider or outsider, as the situation dictates.


Cycloptichorn


John Thune is out while Jon Huntsman has apparently taken a small step closer to running.

JPB
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Apr, 2011 02:29 pm
@realjohnboy,
I still like Huntsman. I'd vote for him today over Obama. Of course, he hasn't actually opened his mouth and said anything worth voting for yet. I reserve the option to decide he's a pandering wannabe and leave my support for him in the dust.
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Mon 25 Apr, 2011 02:41 pm
@realjohnboy,
Considering he only raised about 50k last quarter, Ginrich needs the help.

The fact that he's something like 300k richer thanks to the Ethanol lobby will doom him, if nothing else does.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
JPB
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Apr, 2011 04:29 pm
Impact on Barbour saying no.

Quote:
*** Mitch Daniels is now on the clock: With Barbour’s decision not to run, the Beltway speculation now turns to Indiana Gov. -- and Barbour friend -- Mitch Daniels. This actually gives Daniels more time to wait past Memorial Day. On “Meet the Press” back in March, he didn’t flinch when asked if he could wait until the summer to make up his mind. Why Daniels might run: He believes that no other candidate is addressing the deficit/debt, and he now has an opening (in fundraising and establishment support) with Barbour’s no-go. Why he might not run: His national name ID/support isn’t any higher than Barbour’s, and his family is rumored to be against a White House bid. As the Washington Post's Balz wrote yesterday, "Asked about family considerations — friends say his wife has been opposed — Daniels goes quiet. 'I don’t have much more to say about that,’ he said. ‘It’s just a very important factor.'” We might get clues from Daniels when he addresses the American Enterprise Institute on May 4 More
realjohnboy
 
  1  
Reply Tue 26 Apr, 2011 04:54 pm
@JPB,
JPB wrote:

Impact on Barbour saying no.

I have been reading a lot today about Barbour. It is true that he only attracted 1% or 2% support for getting the Repub nomination. But as a big time lobbyist and one time head of the RNC he has accumulated a lot of contacts - and perhaps - political iou's. He also has attracted some very veteran and talented Repub advisors who will now need to hop on another horse. Romney already has his team lined up, so the gurus will be talking to other folks but will only sign on if the potential candidates commit, privately at least, that they intend to run.
I am betting that Daniels will not. And, if forced to bet, I think Huckabee won't either.
0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  0  
Reply Wed 27 Apr, 2011 06:01 am


A short list of bad bets:

Obama will win a second term if any of these
Republicans are running for President or VP.

Huckabee

Palin

Gingrich

Romney

Trump

0 Replies
 
 

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