izzythepush
 
  1  
Mon 23 May, 2016 08:21 am
@revelette2,
Is this deal reached in the spirit of détente or because America is concerned about China flexing its military muscle in the South China Sea?
engineer
 
  5  
Mon 23 May, 2016 08:26 am
@izzythepush,
Why can't it be both? There is nothing wrong with a win/win deal. Ties have been improving for a long time and if China makes this deal happen a year or two earlier than it might have otherwise, I don't see a problem. That said, I think President Obama sees his time coming to an end and wants to tie up loose ends. His detractors might howl, but everything he spends political capital on now is something his successor doesn't need to worry about.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Mon 23 May, 2016 08:40 am
@engineer,
It could be, but I suspect that improving ties with Vietnam wouldn't even be on the agenda if it wasn't for China's resurgence.
farmerman
 
  4  
Mon 23 May, 2016 10:20 am
@izzythepush,
Clinton made normalization of relations with Vitenam in 1995. So, if China is one reason, then we were not being shortsighted 20 years go.
farmerman
 
  4  
Mon 23 May, 2016 10:22 am
@farmerman,
It seems that Vietnam is not a client state of China, like N Korea.
0 Replies
 
engineer
 
  5  
Mon 23 May, 2016 11:27 am
@izzythepush,
The Trans Pacific Trade deal is another factor, but President Obama is normalizing relations with Cuba and it would be hard to point to China on that one. President Obama just has another view of who we should be willing to talk to than some of his predecessors.
Foofie
 
  0  
Mon 23 May, 2016 11:44 am
@snood,
There's no combat with B-52's. All Americans return safely. No glory, just winning a war with the least casualties to Americans. A military career is not a civil service job like the post office. Even post people get to deliver real letters and parcels. And, get promotions for jobs well done.
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  0  
Mon 23 May, 2016 11:49 am
@snood,
snood wrote:

Yup, my father was the same way about WWII and Korea. Whenever we'd ask him about it, he would get very quiet and say something like "Don't ever go to no war."




Doable advice, unless there's a draft. I guess you don't remember that, being your age?
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  0  
Mon 23 May, 2016 11:51 am
@roger,
roger wrote:

Foofie wrote:



Pshaw! In my opinion, drones are akin to Intervention Interruptus. Boots on the ground can require more than the nation is willing to commit. Do we have a third choice? Twenty-four hours for everyone to vacate a village that's occupied by an enemy, and then bring in the B-52's. As LBJ might have said (a great Democrat), "Let's stop pussyfootin' around."


Excellent plan! Send them a message for the good guys to get out of town and make sure the enemies stay. Brilliant.

I'm sorry, I only give Americans the title of good guy. Sort of like Sherman's March To The Sea. War is not a Sunday school picnic.
snood
 
  2  
Mon 23 May, 2016 12:01 pm
@Foofie,
So I take it you think terrorists' families and the neighborhoods terrorists use for cover (modern warfare by definition is waged amongst non-combatants, not in pristine theatres of conflict) are just fair game?
izzythepush
 
  0  
Mon 23 May, 2016 12:18 pm
@farmerman,
Normalising relations is a far cry from selling them state of the art weapons technology.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Mon 23 May, 2016 12:19 pm
@engineer,
I never said anything about Cuba, we were discussing Vietnam.
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  4  
Mon 23 May, 2016 03:40 pm
Say what you will about Katie Couric - she didn't back down from asking tough questions, and I believe her when she says she would've handled the whole trump thing differently.

Couric: Media Enabled Donald Trump


excerpt:
Instead, she argued that news outlets seemed to back down from Trump "either because of his railroading or because there was a lack of willingness to ask really tough questions for fear of cutting off access."
At the same time, Couric noted that there has been "a huge groundswell" behind Trump, one that she wishes the media would spend more time covering.
"One of the things that wasn't done as well was really examining the forces at work that were making him rise to the top and making his candidacy much more viable than people predicted," she said. "And I think if we'd spend a little more time every election (focusing on) less horserace and more context, more depth, more information, and more issues."

http://www.cnn.com/2016/05/23/politics/katie-couric-axe-files-axelrod/
0 Replies
 
Foofie
 
  0  
Mon 23 May, 2016 03:43 pm
@snood,
snood wrote:

So I take it you think terrorists' families and the neighborhoods terrorists use for cover (modern warfare by definition is waged amongst non-combatants, not in pristine theatres of conflict) are just fair game?


"Fair game" implies you are making a value judgement of my ethics. And, that value judgement seems to be pejorative, since "fair game" implies a lack of caring. We are not on the same page, possibly, as to how we see the U.S.. I subscribe to American Exceptionalism. My thoughts matter little. I do not want to be the drum majorette MLK talked of as some people's desired persona. Nor, do I want to convert you to my thinking. Have a nice summer.
Foofie
 
  1  
Mon 23 May, 2016 03:45 pm
@izzythepush,
izzythepush wrote:

Normalising relations is a far cry from selling them state of the art weapons technology.

It might be called fighting fire with fire?
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  2  
Mon 23 May, 2016 03:53 pm
@Foofie,
Thinking, huh? Well that's one word for it.
0 Replies
 
RABEL222
 
  1  
Mon 23 May, 2016 05:33 pm
@Builder,
She tried to share them with you in 2003 when she tried to get universal health coverage for every one but the republicans and, drug companies, and insurance companies shot it down. Remember, or are you too young?
0 Replies
 
RABEL222
 
  1  
Mon 23 May, 2016 05:35 pm
@izzythepush,
What difference does it make if its good for both sides?
0 Replies
 
snood
 
  4  
Tue 24 May, 2016 08:37 am
I don't know about anyone else, but I'm happy to see Trump resorting to re-stirring the Vince Foster stuff. To me, it smacks of desperation.
engineer
 
  2  
Tue 24 May, 2016 08:45 am
@snood,
He's just testing the waters, looking for what has traction and what doesn't before settling on an attack plan.
 

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