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IS THE "TEA PARTY" REALLY A POPULIST MOVEMENT?

 
 
rabel22
 
  3  
Sun 24 Oct, 2010 11:49 pm
@msolga,
When the comunists did it we called it brain washing. when politicians do it we call it political information. The us citizens have been brain washed just as sure as the communists by big business.
failures art
 
  2  
Mon 25 Oct, 2010 01:04 pm
@msolga,
msolga wrote:
I'm not asking you to defend or justify the Tea Party's actions, Art. Wink

I know you aren't. I'm sorry if I sounded like I was scolding you. Can't read inflection in text.

Smile

A
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0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  2  
Mon 25 Oct, 2010 01:23 pm
@msolga,
msolga wrote:
Are we to believe that local tea party "activists" are blissfully unaware of all this? Or that they simply don't care, whatever it takes to undermine Obama is OK with them?


That's pretty much it--for them, Mr. Obama is the socialist anti-christ. If you told them about the support for their movement, they wouldn't believe you.
0 Replies
 
msolga
 
  2  
Mon 25 Oct, 2010 09:14 pm
I've personally found the writings of correspondents from outside the US some of the most useful in helping comprehend what the Tea Party movement is about. These correspondents, as well as reporting the US news, are often also attempting explain to their (non-US) readers why things are the way they are, what motivations are behind the events which have occurred ...

This (UK) writer thinks it's instructive to look at smaller issues, for clues ...

Take this example, from earlier this month: why would attempts to remove phosphates from dishwashing detergents incite such anger, such passion amongst Tea Party supporters? Why would such an issue be a rallying call for Tea Party "activists", anyway? Why on earth would they view the prospects of a phosphate ban in detergents "an act of tyranny", for heavens sake?

I found this a very interesting & instructive read. Hope you do, too.:


Quote:
America's dish detergent wars
Guardian.co.uk, Thursday 14 October 2010 17.00 BST

The fuss over phosphate bans provides an object lesson in the paranoid politics of the Tea Party's anti-liberal backlash

http://static.guim.co.uk/sys-images/Guardian/Pix/red/blue_pics/2010/10/13/barfdetergent_460x276.jpg
Barf detergent The backlash against bans on phosphates in dishwash detergents is nauseating, says Marcotte. Photograph: David Levene/Guardian

Political observers trying to understand the conservative backlash movement in America known as the Tea Party certainly have their work cut out for them. It's a movement primarily composed of Medicare recipients who object to "government-run healthcare". Its leaders claim they're more libertarian in orientation, and yet they routinely back some of the most anti-choice politicians ever to run for such major office. One of their key leaders likes to compare himself to Martin Luther King Jr, but the issues that most reliably get Tea Partiers to hit the streets are reliably racialised to exploit their prejudiced paranoia. They are full of contradictions, often making – and then running from – position statements, and seem to be more about just being angry than listing specific grievances.

But as a long-time conservative-watcher, I think the best way to understand where reactionaries are coming from is to look at some of the smaller issues that get them all riled up. Take, for instance, the long-standing fight over phosphates in dish detergent. The parameters of this debate provide an excellent insight into the Tea Partiers, what motivates them, and why they're so paranoid.

Many dishwashing detergents use phosphates as water-softeners, but the problem with phosphates is that when they run off into the local water supply, they upset the balance of oxygen in the rivers and lakes and have the potential to kill off fish. The simple solution to this problem is simply to ban phosphates in dish soap, something numerous states have done.

It shouldn't be too controversial; the non-phosphate soaps do just as good a job at cleaning dishes, but they may not leave glasses as spot-free, which should be a small price to pay for a healthy environment. This isn't just conjecture. When I had a (relatively cheap) dishwasher in Texas, I bought non-phosphate soap and noticed no real difference. Then again, I'm not one who believes my friends investigate their wine glasses to make sure they have no water stains on them.

But for many, any price paid to keep the environment clean is too high. As soon as Spokane County in Washington banned phosphate dish detergent in response to oxygen depletion in its rivers and lakes, many residents rebelled by actually driving to Idaho to purchase the same kinds of dish detergent they'd been using before.

On its surface, this seems like illogical behaviour. Surely, getting in a car and driving across state lines just to buy dish detergent costs more time and effort than just rinsing your dishes before you put them in the dishwasher, right?

But if you see the phosphate ban as an arbitrary act of liberal tyranny imposed for the sheer joy of making Real Americans have to wash their dishes by hand, then getting into the car and driving for a few hours to buy dish detergent can become an easy, risk-free way to feel like a warrior fighting for freedom. And while the big cities in Washington often pull the elections to the left, the countryside and suburbs of the state are stuffed with embittered reactionaries who are eager to believe they're being victimised by a bunch of dumb environmentalists who are incapable of thinking through the ramifications of a policy like this
.

Rightwing bloggers gleefully seized on this story of dish detergent smuggling, gloating that Washington residents were sticking it to the environmentalists by using more gas to buy detergent and using more water to wash dishes. Of course, the ugly reality is that wastefulness has a larger impact than upsetting environmentalists – it means fewer resources for the future and a dirtier environment, of course – but the sheer glee of potentially inflicting stress on demonised environmentalists was enough to distract from these facts. Erick Erickson of Red State, alarmed by the possibility that a wine glass might have a spot on it that some red-blooded American would have to wipe off with a towel, said, "At what point do they get off the couch, march down to their state legislator's house, pull him outside, and beat him to a bloody pulp for being an idiot?"

The commenters at Free Republic also enjoyed gloating over the possibility that this would lead to more water use, showing those dirty hippies (their term) how stupid and short-sighted they were. In a telling exchange, one commenter asked, "I'm not exactly sure what the greenies are trying to accomplish, here…", and another replied, "It feeeeeeeeels good, and it demonstrates their 'concern'. That's all that really matters with the libs, not actual results."

Except, of course, that a short Google search would have resulted in immediate knowledge of what the "greenies" were trying to accomplish: reducing the amount of oxygen depletion in Spokane rivers and lakes that was killing off the fish. But the first rule of reactionary politics is: don't learn about the issues, or else you might find your kneejerk anti-liberal reactions weren't as smart as you thought they were.

Large parts of America have been primed through little issues such as phosphate bans to believe they don't need to know the actual facts behind an issue because they can simply substitute their paranoid hostility towards liberals for understanding.

Worse, they've given up any sense of responsibility as citizens towards the common good. Once people have absorbed the idea that wiping off an occasional glass is too much of a sacrifice to save the environment for the good of everyone else, it's not much of a leap for those same people to think that it's a travesty if someone poorer than themselves has decent access to healthcare, that they should have to take public transportation rather than leave the next generation with a planet wrecked through global warming, or that it's worse to raise the taxes on the richest Americans by 3% than have widespread unemployment.


http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2010/oct/13/phosphate-ban-dishwash-detergent
JPB
 
  1  
Mon 25 Oct, 2010 09:24 pm
@msolga,
Is that supposedly a news report or an opinion piece?
msolga
 
  1  
Mon 25 Oct, 2010 09:36 pm
@JPB,
I guess you'd call it a "opinion/commentary/reporting piece" from the Guardian UK newspaper online, JPB. It's written by their US correspondent. (I don't know if it's their only US correspondent.). But the Guardian regularly publishes lots of quite detailed articles on any number of issues in the news (including detailed commentary/opinion articles, to which its readers respond), both from within the UK & abroad ...

I've also read quite lengthy & serious articles in Oz attempting to explain the Tea Party in the Oz media, too, particularly on the ABC NEWS (national broadcaster) online site.

There is a lot of interest in what the Tea Party is about, from many of us people who don't live in the US.
failures art
 
  2  
Mon 25 Oct, 2010 10:00 pm
@msolga,
msolga wrote:
There is a lot of interest in what the Tea Party is about, from many of us people who don't live in the US.


I just thought of something. When the first tax day Tea Party events were taking place, I remember feeling like they were bastardizing a particular piece of American history. But it's not American history, it's world history. The original Boston Tea Party was a response to the British.

We glamorize so many things about the Revolutionary War. This particular act of defiance is particularly iconic. However, we didn't throw tea in the harbor for fun. It seems to me that not only is this a gross exploitation of revolutionary icons, but also it seems like a really huge and unnecessary insult to the UK (our closest modern day ally).

I'd like to know if any English feel like this at all.

A
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msolga
 
  2  
Mon 25 Oct, 2010 10:07 pm
@failures art,
Quote:
When the first tax day Tea Party events were taking place, I remember feeling like they were bastardizing a particular piece of American history


I felt exactly the same (from a long, long way away) about the Washington rally, on the anniversary of Martin Luther King's speech, art.

As for what the British think. I'm not sure you'll find out. I haven't seen any (as best that I can recall) on this thread.
msolga
 
  1  
Mon 25 Oct, 2010 10:21 pm
@JPB,
Quote:
Is that supposedly a news report or an opinion piece?


I'm curious to know what you thought of that piece, JPB.
Would you consider it a fairly accurate (or otherwise) assessment?
JPB
 
  1  
Mon 25 Oct, 2010 10:38 pm
@msolga,
I think it's extremely biased and slanted. I don't want to pick it apart point by point, but the authors choice of a name for her detergent expresses her opinion quite clearly.
msolga
 
  1  
Mon 25 Oct, 2010 10:41 pm
@JPB,
OK.
I figured you had some strong thoughts on the article, JPB. And wanted to know more about why.
Thanks for responding to my request.
msolga
 
  1  
Mon 25 Oct, 2010 10:51 pm
@msolga,
Just thought I'd check, JPB, to make sure that the information I gave you on the source of article (& the type of article) was correct.
It was from the "comment is free" section of the Guardian.
Here's a link to that section of the newspaper today:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree
failures art
 
  1  
Mon 25 Oct, 2010 11:30 pm
@msolga,
msolga wrote:

Quote:
When the first tax day Tea Party events were taking place, I remember feeling like they were bastardizing a particular piece of American history


I felt exactly the same (from a long, long way away) about the Washington rally, on the anniversary of Martin Luther King's speech, art.

As for what the British think. I'm not sure you'll find out. I haven't seen any (as best that I can recall) on this thread.

The extra sting on the DC rally (rallies actually, they come to town fairly often and never in the numbers they claim) is that in channeling the Boston Tea Party ("No Taxation without Representation"), they do so in the one American city that is both taxed and doesn't get to vote (and very much wants State's rights). They treated the locals (and local businesses) really badly when in town. It was as if in their Fed-rage, they forgot that some people in Washington, simply live here. This isn't a jab at all conservatives either. The CPAC conventions never creates these local conflicts.

A
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0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  4  
Tue 26 Oct, 2010 04:10 am
@msolga,
The tea party embodies a type of "anti elitist and xenophobic" creed.
The rhetoric by such teabag spokesmen as Glen Beck has celebrated the fact that "we dont need no advice from the French or Germans, what the hell do they know?" and , as far as the phosphates in detergents, Im afraid that any progress weve managed to make as far as environmental cleanup is all being questioned (and is being ridiculed savagely), from pesticide use to water quality. The environmental movement has been labeled as "Environmentalist whackos" by guys like Limbaugh, and these names have been embraced by the teabag members who, as I have found from just my personal contacts, are pretty much pissed off, and mostly retired white folks.
In another mode of hypocrisy,The teabaggers always will gather up whatever black folks show up and try to cluster them together so that when they take pictures , the density of the non white races will look greater than they really are.

Teabaggers are hysterical , they are basing their entire credo on simplistic slogans, and they are choosing candidates who are usually, not the brightest bulbs in the pack. WHile many candidates may win, I feel that the coalitions that they try to establish will probably fail miserably because theyve alienated their own party. Unless the teabaggers are planning for a third party , I feel that they will crash and burn within two years in office when their fickle supporters will have moved on to some other slogan which they can worship.
msolga
 
  1  
Tue 26 Oct, 2010 04:44 am
@farmerman,
Quote:
Unless the teabaggers are planning for a third party , I feel that they will crash and burn within two years in office when their fickle supporters will have moved on to some other slogan which they can worship.


Is it possible, do any of you believe, that the powers behind this "movement" aren't actually thinking long-term at all? That maybe the real the purpose of the tea party is maximum short-term damage & disruption to particular liberal interests?
I am (obviously) not nearly as close to the action as you people are (so could have this quite wrong), but it seems to me that many of the broad aims of the movement aren't exactly deliverable, anyway.

edgarblythe
 
  1  
Tue 26 Oct, 2010 04:55 am
@msolga,
I believe hysteria is their motivating force and that they will simply transfer the lunacy to other political movements.
msolga
 
  1  
Tue 26 Oct, 2010 05:03 am
@edgarblythe,
... or possibly they just might have to accept that the old, "better" version of America, of their nostalgic dreaming, has vanished forever, edgar?
No political party or movement can return your country (or any other, for that matter) to some supposed golden past age.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Tue 26 Oct, 2010 05:38 am
@msolga,
You give them credit for learning ability. I don't.
msolga
 
  1  
Tue 26 Oct, 2010 05:42 am
@edgarblythe,
Well, you'd know much better than me, edgar.
You're living with it.
Me, I'm reading heaps about it & trying to figure it out! Wink
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Tue 26 Oct, 2010 05:55 am
@msolga,
msolga wrote:
Is it possible, do any of you believe, that the powers behind this "movement" aren't actually thinking long-term at all? That maybe the real the purpose of the tea party is maximum short-term damage & disruption to particular liberal interests?


I think that is obviousy the purpose. No long-term advantage accrues to the Republicans from tolerating the teabaggers. In fact, long term, they are a net detriment to that party.
0 Replies
 
 

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