do you think any of the candidates can make a difference, if elected?

Are you on crack!?? :wtf:

You've paid taxes all of your working life. You know no other way.
The U.S. functioned without payroll taxing the citizens for nearly a hundred years. Lincoln taxed the public to pay for the civil war.

Liberal politics has caused the American people to believe taxes are normal.
Caused them to "depend" on government.
It has created a welfare state that is, if Obama is elected about to grow into an albatross that will sink the nation.
Obama is going to be the worst person who has ever stepped through the doors of the white house. He offers change. The minuscule clues he gives concerning change concern only stealing more and more from the working class and taxing industry into the ground. The government has no right to make do business unbearable for industry. That will only trickle down to the workers of industry.

Well when you get your ass stabbed or shot at don't go calling the cops, they're funded with tax dollars!

You might as well be an anarchist, taxes are what makes this country run.

I don't oppose a consumption tax. The only fair tax system possible.
Using cops as a reason for the absurd tax system we currently have is comical.
Police do not prevent crime. They are mainly revenue producers from traffic fines. They simply show up after people have been shot or stabbed.
They always take the easy arrest thus creating the situation of the wrong people being put on death row.

I don't think you are giving the police enough credit, i would know, my brother is a Lansing police officer.

I give the police credit where it is due. They have a difficult job. They are, in a sense similar to our troops at war. They have a sense of situations and how appropriately to deal with them, but their hands are tied. Made ineffective by the liberal justice system that is concocted by double speak lawyers.
Traffic control is the only area police are effective. They are a major source of revenue for the system. As far as preventing crime however, they are behind the eight ball in many ways. They do not possess ESP. The law prevents them from protecting people who have told them they are in danger. I know this to be true. My friend went to the Ottawa, Ks. police department and told them a gang had threatened his two sons. They point blank told him there was nothing they could do until a crime had been committed. He told them "if you won't deal with it, I will". They crushed his skull in with a golf club. His killer being 16, spent four years in juvy. His five killers now live normal lives. Likely committing more crime and bragging about killing that old mofo that had the nerve to git in my face.
I used to live in Toledo. Been to Lansing. Seemed like a very nice place.

1. If the news reported every time a crime wasn't committed, you'd be more thankful.

2. Yes are laws do seem to hinder crime prevention, and for good reason. to protect the rights of the individual. Our founding fathers believed it was better for a hundred criminals to go free than for one innocent man to be punished.

1. More grateful? I am adequately grateful. I pay taxes which pay the wages of the police. I feel no need to be grateful. If bad guys make the bad decision to do their deeds on my property or to myself, I am mentally and mechanically prepared deal with the issue. The police will never arrive in time to help the dying criminal or myself if fortune frowns on me. They can do what they always do. File a report.
2. I did not realize that our founding fathers were morons.
I doubt they had in mind the victims of poor police work suing for enormous settlements that American tax payers would be burdened with.
Perhaps if law enforcement were held liable for poor police work, instead of the American tax payer, I would agree with them.

1. What does that say about people unable to defend themselves or is this a tribal society we live in? what if you are outnumbered or/and out-gunned? What if you are not there when the crime occurs?
1a. Would you be happier to live with a vigilante justice system like the old American west?

2. But they realized most Americans would/were morons. At the time many Americans could not read or write, so how were we to expect illiterate people to run such a powerful government? This is the reason we have representative government.

But back to the main point. The founding fathers had just escaped an oppressive government, so they did not want to make another one, so they took extensive steps to make sure that the rights of the individual were protected even if this meant a burden to the taxpayers.

1. What that says is that the people need to arm themselves. Quit electing politicians who expect police to cater to criminals. This is not a tribal society. Simply a society where people must fear retribution from law as much as they fear the criminals who should be the only threat.
2. Actually, at the time the constitution was devised and implemented, there was no tax. Therefore, they did not foresee a nation with a lecherous form of government that employed tens of thousands of people whose main function was to devise ever more methods of taking money from the people.
Including making it possible for tax payers to bear the burden of mistakes made by officials of that government.

1. Is that a yes to you preferring a vigilante justice? We already know how that went i have no reason to believe it will be any better the second time. Also the problem is we often don't know who is or isn't a criminal thats why we have the "innocent until proven guilty" policy in place.

2. Yes, but the founding fathers left us to decide whether we wanted to implement a tax system. Remember the founding fathers only opposed taxation WITHOUT REPRESENTATION. As long as we are adequately represented then our taxes are perfectly constitutional. The founding fathers did not foresee a lot of things but they wrote the constitution so it could adapt, simply saying they did not foresee FACTOR A is no reason to ignore the constitution.

1. I don't prefer vigilante justice. I prefer better police work and real justice. Considering victims rights first. Also penalties for overzealous prosecutors who place their records over truth. These are the truly despicable people in the justice system. If it can be proven that they have ignored or manipulated evidence causing innocent people to be convicted, they should be held personally responsible for restitution and charged with a crime for allowing real criminals to remain un-prosecuted endangering others.
2. Well put.

Do you think any of the presidential candidates will make a significant difference once they are in office? Or do you think they are just saying what we want to hear so they will get elected to the position?

I personally don't know what to believe because both scenarios are really likely when it comes to making a difference. I don't think it has anything to do with the president at all, I think it's congress that needs to be changed first before the next president can make a real difference. Because really, if I'm right, congress can over ride any decisions that Bush makes and vice versa, right?

I don't want to start a mean and nasty debate, I just would like to hear the views of other people. And please, if I am inaccurate in anything I say, please correct me so that I will know the facts.

this isn't a quote but i think this is the only way someone wil see my post. People want to vote for Obama because he says he'll do all these changes. But HELLO, change isn't always good. I mean duh we can learn from our mistakes, but that doesn't mean change the world as we know it now does it? I guess what im trying to say is :Please, If Obama can't fool a child, don't let him fool you. (no offense)

this isn't a quote but i think this is the only way someone wil see my post. People want to vote for Obama because he says he'll do all these changes. But HELLO, change isn't always good. I mean duh we can learn from our mistakes, but that doesn't mean change the world as we know it now does it? I guess what im trying to say is :Please, If Obama can't fool a child, don't let him fool you. (no offense)

Well when we've reached an unprecedented level of debt, the downfall of the US dollar, failing education and increasing international tension i certainly don't think you want things to remain the same. That's if you have any sense in you.

Of corse not! Some things NEED to change. But all some people hear is change change change. They think "oh well things arent that great now so this must be good!" but only SOME change is good.

Well when we've reached an unprecedented level of debt, the downfall of the US dollar, failing education and increasing international tension i certainly don't think you want things to remain the same. That's if you have any sense in you.

Of corse not! Some things NEED to change. But all some people hear is change change change. They think "oh well things arent that great now so this must be good!" but only SOME change is good.