1
   

How many sons does God have?

 
 
Campbell34
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Sep, 2007 10:45 pm
@wvpeach,
wvpeach;36828 wrote:
You do realize campbell that "GOD " is a generic term? That the name of our creator is not GOD?

Psalm 82 God standeth in the congregation of the mighty ; he judgeth among the gods...... Notice the plural gods


John 10:34 Jesus said Is it not written in your law that I said ye are Gods? If he called them gods to whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;

Say ye of him whom the father has sanctified and sent unto the world, thou blasphemeth because I said I am the son of God.
......notice again the plural gods and these are the words of jesus himself.


And how many sons of Gods are there Campbell? No way of counting but it appears that in genesis 6:1 there are many

Genesis 6:2 the sons of God saw the daughters of men that they were fair and took them wifes all of which they chose.

Campbell you really have to do some extensive study with Gods help to learn that the English translation of the bible leaves much to be desired.

The word God is often used in our english translation where the word Lord, ruler, official would have been used in the original greek and hebrew.

So I agree Christ Jesus is Lord, is ruler, is a God , but he is not the one true God . Christ is not the Father Yewah. Christ is a son as you and I are sons and daughters of God and Christ was sanctified to die for our sins a sacrifice for many. And 1st Corinthians tells us that when Jesus finishes this task he will turn the whole thing back over to the one real God the great I am Yewah .The Father , the one who's name we probably still do not know.

Read the entire first chapter of Hebrews its a love letter to Jesus and explains that he was chosen by the creator to serve the purpose he did and that has set him above all of us. But Christ is not God.

I am sad now. It is really sad, that satan has been so able to distort the Holy word in the English language.


Funny you should say Jesus is a God. the JWs say the same thing. Only they rewrote their translation to agree with their doctrine. They took the verse which states that in the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was God. They dishonestly insereted the Word (a) to take away the fact that Jesus was God. So in their translation of the Bible it reads, in the beginning was the Word and the Word was with God and the Word was (a) God. You only find that inserted (a) in the JWs New World Translation. If your not a JW you should be, because everything you are saying here agrees with their doctrine. And that is why you cannot agree with the Father making the earth alone and by Himself. Your doctrine is more important to you than the Fathers own words. And when Christ was carried up into heaven they worshippped Him. The Bible tells us thou shalt not have any other Gods before you. Worship is for ONE GOD only. The Father said, there is no God formed before Him and there will be no God formed after Him.
He ALONE created all things by HIMSELF. Do you agree with the Fathers statement. YES or NO.
Campbell34
 
  1  
Reply Thu 13 Sep, 2007 10:59 pm
@wvpeach,
wvpeach;36830 wrote:
well Genesis 6:2 says they were sons of God who married the daughters of men.

You can't have it both ways campbell. You cannot take one verse of scripture and call it the truth and then not believe everything it says.

You are repeating the teachings of men campbell . You need to seek the truth for yourself and not believe everything you hear in church.


I don't attend church. So tell me, how do I have it both ways? Please explain?
0 Replies
 
Greatest I am cv
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2007 07:44 am
@Campbell34,
Campbell34;36814 wrote:
Yes it was ok for God to ask Abraham to sacrifice his son, because God knew He would never allow Abraham to do it. And yes it was ok to kill off the worlds population of part human's that were evil. God is the taker and giver of life. If God had not done this, you might be 16 foot tall today, and sporting a pair of horns.
Yes there was a book of Satan written back in the 60s however there are many other books that go along with such. Involving spells ect. Satan is highly thought of in certain religious circles. Apparently there are children who have been sacrificed to other Gods and this is even mentioned in the Bible. So my question was if people believe it is ok to sacrifice children in the name of their God, does this make them wrong? After all, according to you, we are all worshiping the same God. Seriously


My position is that a lawmaker, to keep the respect of his people cannot break his own law. To have God give us an example of genocide and say it is good goes against this rule. It also shows a God who has screwed up and is trying to hide His mistakes. A true God would not make a mistake in the first place. If you believe that genocide is OK then you are way out of it.

God has a whole universe of options. To break his own law and show us when and where to use genocide is stupid. If you cannot admit that genocide is stupid then it would show your moral degeneracy.

Your God must really be a **** up since you wait for Him to come and fix what should not have been broke in the first place, if He was a true God to begin with.

Regards
DL
0 Replies
 
Greatest I am cv
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2007 07:49 am
@Campbell34,
Campbell34;36816 wrote:
So your telling me that it is ok for man to murder, kill, and rape, because God ordained this? And why would you want to reduce evil to a minimum if this is what God ordained?


I did not say that any of evil is OK. I said that God created it.
It is a fact. I don't have to like it.

I just don't think we need as much evil as there is.
God asks us to move to a more Perfect state. This is the right position for me to take.

Regards
DL
0 Replies
 
Greatest I am cv
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2007 07:56 am
@Campbell34,
Campbell34;36819 wrote:
God did not send giants to bother earthly females, these were fallen angles that appeared as humans, it was their offspring that became giants. FREE WILL was given to us by God. You don't want to believe in free will, but it's all around us. That's why the world is in such turmoil. It is the evil nature of man that has brought us to where we are today. FREE WILL gives man the right to make choices. You can choose to do good before God, or you can choose to do evil. It's your choice.


I have not said that we do not have free will. The one exception is the ability to choose something other than Heaven at death. Heaven is our birthright.

I look about and see the Perfect works of God.

You look around and see imperfection everywhere.
You are saying that your God is not capable of creating a Perfect environment for man to thrive. Why would you follow a God who can't get it right and forces you to wait for Him to come and fix what He has screwed up?

Regards
DL
0 Replies
 
Greatest I am cv
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2007 08:00 am
@Campbell34,
Campbell34;36824 wrote:
It was God's creation of fallen angles that the Bible tells us left their first estates and inner married with human kind. The angles like humans had free will to choose good or evil. They cohabited with humans against Gods will, and this was just another part of the rebellion. The offspring was nolonger fully human and became very evil. The Bible is clear on this. To get the human race back, God had to do away with this nonhuman race, which left only noah and his family.


This would include many babies and children. I guess this is not a problem for you?

God had other options other than to allow angels to come to earth and plague man.

Why did He not use these other options? Why send supernatural beings to plague natural beings? Not a fair fight at all was it?

Regards
DL
0 Replies
 
wvpeach
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2007 09:29 am
@Campbell34,
What I meant by saying you were trying to have it both ways campbell is that you are interjecting your own words into the bible and interpreting it that way. For instance you say here in this quote of yours that fallen angels married human kind.

But the bible says it was the sons of God who married the daughters of men. So if you are going to take the stand all the bible is perfect and men have not corrupted it because God has divinely protected it and it says just what God planned like in the case of hell which you insist is real and not a mistranslation than you must take all of it seriously and literally.



Campbell34;36824 wrote:
It was God's creation of fallen angles that the Bible tells us left their first estates and inner married with human kind. The angles like humans had free will to choose good or evil. They cohabited with humans against Gods will, and this was just another part of the rebellion. The offspring was nolonger fully human and became very evil. The Bible is clear on this. To get the human race back, God had to do away with this nonhuman race, which left only noah and his family.



In the case of your quote above if we take the bible literally as it is translated .
" The sons of God looked upon the daughters of men and saw that they were fair and took them to wife all of which they chose"

I find it strange that the SONS of God did anything against or with out God's knowledge. In fact God being all knowing could have forseen that His Sons co mingling with man was going to have to cause him to wipe the worlds population out with a flood in the future.

Yet the bible tells us this happened. I would have to deduce then that it was in the plan of God from the beginning . He needed to teach his sons a lesson so he let them co mingle with humans , then all went corrupt , mostly because they went against the will of our God. And God knew it and could have stopped it but God let it happen. Interesting

Taking the bible literally and not repeating what we have heard , but instead looking at chapter and verse outrselves really does open up the debate doesn't it campbell?

Personally I have a lot more questions about why God would allow his sons to do this knowing it was going to cause so much death and misery in the future? But I will have to wait till God reveals this to me. I am certain he had a good reason.
0 Replies
 
wvpeach
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2007 09:55 am
@Campbell34,
Campbell

I am posting with you in the spirit of study between us. Let me just say first off that if you are just trying to argue with me, I will stop.

I happen to know that no man can understand the scriptures unless God opens his eyes and mind to them. I believe God works in wonderous ways and he uses opportunities any time people talk to reach people he wants to learn . I certainly know he does that with me. I now know only what God has allowed me to know and I used to think a whole lot like you. But God has taught me some different things than he has you at this moment in time.

Christ says in the bible that Christians are fed different foods that prgress in strength as they are able and needful to receive them .

Water, milk, wine, bread, and meat are the foods Christ said all christians receive . And he warned us not to try to feed meat to babes in christ who should be on milk and bread.

So if you want to study together fine. But this seems to be taking a argumentative tone with you and your slurrs about other denominations of christians and I won't go that route with you.




Campbell34;36967 wrote:
The Father said, there is no God formed before Him and there will be no God formed after Him.
He ALONE created all things by HIMSELF. Do you agree with the Fathers statement. YES or NO.



Okay Campbell here again you are adding to the words of the bible.

God said there was no God before him..... This is a complete and true statement per the bible.

BUT

I have never seen it in the bible where he says no God will be formed after him, I know that you will look that up, and post it if you find it please. I could be wrong.

Then answer me this question because it appears others are called gods in the bible. Let me give you a couple of examples of where this happens in scripture.

In Psalms 82

God standeth in the congegation of the mighty he judges among the gods.

Now notice that KJV capitalizes the first God meaning it is the one true God , then in the KJV the second gods, is in lower case and plural meaning gods ( more than one) and the lower case meaning not the one true God.

Who are these gods campbell?


John 10: 34 Jesus answered them and said: Is it not written in your law , I said ye are gods?

If he called them gods unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;

Say ye of him whom the Father has sanctified, and sent into the world, thou blaspemeth because I said, I am the Son of God



Now again campbell we see that we have capital God and small case gods which the translators used to denote a proper name or title from a not specific name or title.

Also note that the KJV translators capitalized SON to show it as a proper name of a specific person.

So again here campbell who are the gods jesus himself is speaking of here if there are not other gods who obviously were created after the one true God the father of all men, heavenly beings and gods per the bible in lower case?
markx15
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2007 09:57 am
@Greatest I am cv,
Many beings are Gods compared to regular men.
wvpeach
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2007 10:03 am
@markx15,
The bible seems to agree with you Mark x

I like your tag line quote very much. Shows a analytical mind. Bravo!:headbang:



markx15;37029 wrote:
Many beings are Gods compared to regular men.
wvpeach
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2007 10:09 am
@wvpeach,
Campbell

My post above is the first in study to answer the question you have posted as to if Jesus created the world and indeed all of us.

It is needful to understand all the different gods spoken of in the bible to receive a answer to this question and understand it.

I am happy to talk with you about this and look forward to it in the future.

Got to get the God versus gods thing clarified first for it to be productive.

Peace and love my brother

Paula
0 Replies
 
Campbell34
 
  1  
Reply Sat 15 Sep, 2007 12:42 pm
@wvpeach,
wvpeach;37028 wrote:
Campbell

I am posting with you in the spirit of study between us. Let me just say first off that if you are just trying to argue with me, I will stop.

I happen to know that no man can understand the scriptures unless God opens his eyes and mind to them. I believe God works in wonderous ways and he uses opportunities any time people talk to reach people he wants to learn . I certainly know he does that with me. I now know only what God has allowed me to know and I used to think a whole lot like you. But God has taught me some different things than he has you at this moment in time.

Christ says in the bible that Christians are fed different foods that prgress in strength as they are able and needful to receive them .

Water, milk, wine, bread, and meat are the foods Christ said all christians receive . And he warned us not to try to feed meat to babes in christ who should be on milk and bread.

So if you want to study together fine. But this seems to be taking a argumentative tone with you and your slurrs about other denominations of christians and I won't go that route with you.




Okay Campbell here again you are adding to the words of the bible.

God said there was no God before him..... This is a complete and true statement per the bible.

BUT

I have never seen it in the bible where he says no God will be formed after him, I know that you will look that up, and post it if you find it please. I could be wrong.

Then answer me this question because it appears others are called gods in the bible. Let me give you a couple of examples of where this happens in scripture.

In Psalms 82

God standeth in the congegation of the mighty he judges among the gods.

Now notice that KJV capitalizes the first God meaning it is the one true God , then in the KJV the second gods, is in lower case and plural meaning gods ( more than one) and the lower case meaning not the one true God.

Who are these gods campbell?


John 10: 34 Jesus answered them and said: Is it not written in your law , I said ye are gods?

If he called them gods unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;

Say ye of him whom the Father has sanctified, and sent into the world, thou blaspemeth because I said, I am the Son of God



Now again campbell we see that we have capital God and small case gods which the translators used to denote a proper name or title from a not specific name or title.

Also note that the KJV translators capitalized SON to show it as a proper name of a specific person.

So again here campbell who are the gods jesus himself is speaking of here if there are not other gods who obviously were created after the one true God the father of all men, heavenly beings and gods per the bible in lower case?


The Gods in question are all who have been born into the family of Christ. God has given us the power to become the Sons of God. The verse in question is Isaiah 43:10 Before me no God was formed, nor will there be one after me. This verse is not talking about Christians who have become the Sons of God, it is talking about a God the would be greater in power than Jehovah. God is simply pointing out that there is only one true God.
wvpeach
 
  1  
Reply Sat 15 Sep, 2007 05:16 pm
@Campbell34,
Campbell34;37291 wrote:
The Gods in question are all who have been born into the family of Christ. God has given us the power to become the Sons of God. The verse in question is Isaiah 43:10 Before me no God was formed, nor will there be one after me. This verse is not talking about Christians who have become the Sons of God, it is talking about a God the would be greater in power than Jehovah. God is simply pointing out that there is only one true God.




That is a verse I was not thinking about. How strange acontradiction in the bible. But due to translation errors there are many.

I will look it up in my greek hebrew program when I get time to see if its a mistranslation.

I have been meaning to study the Gods , Lords and such anyway for clarifty when the spirit gives leave.
Campbell34
 
  1  
Reply Sun 16 Sep, 2007 05:52 am
@wvpeach,
wvpeach;37354 wrote:
That is a verse I was not thinking about. How strange acontradiction in the bible. But due to translation errors there are many.

I will look it up in my greek hebrew program when I get time to see if its a mistranslation.

I have been meaning to study the Gods , Lords and such anyway for clarifty when the spirit gives leave.


Christians have no problem with this verse, nor do we see any translation error. It only appears as a counterdiction to some because it does not agree with their doctrine. When your doctrine is in error, the Written Word will
look as if it is filled with errors. Yet the truth is, correct doctrine compliments the Bible.
wvpeach
 
  1  
Reply Sun 16 Sep, 2007 09:46 am
@Campbell34,
Campbell you and I are on a completely different page.

And I have found after a long and active life that you cannot talk to all people rationally.

So I give up where you are concerned.

Let me know if you ever feel led to have a rational discussion about the bible.

Because I am sure the Holy Spirit will have to rap you on the head to make that happen.

Peace and love my brother.

Paula
Greatest I am cv
 
  1  
Reply Sun 16 Sep, 2007 10:02 am
@wvpeach,
wvpeach;37496 wrote:
Campbell you and I are on a completely different page.

And I have found after a long and active life that you cannot talk to all people rationally.

So I give up where you are concerned.

Let me know if you ever feel led to have a rational discussion about the bible.

Because I am sure the Holy Spirit will have to rap you on the head to make that happen.

Peace and love my brother.

Paula


I would have thought that since both of you believe in and have encountered demons and angels, that you could find common ground.

Go figure.

Regards
DL
Campbell34
 
  1  
Reply Sun 16 Sep, 2007 11:53 am
@wvpeach,
wvpeach;37496 wrote:
Campbell you and I are on a completely different page.

And I have found after a long and active life that you cannot talk to all people rationally.

So I give up where you are concerned.

Let me know if you ever feel led to have a rational discussion about the bible.

Because I am sure the Holy Spirit will have to rap you on the head to make that happen.

Peace and love my brother.

Paula


Well thats usually the responce I get from people who have connections with the Watch Tower Society. You are right, we are on a different page, especially if you have bought into the New World Translation. Even though most scholars have condemnded this translation as more of a perversion than a translation, those who follow the Society faithfully ignore those scholars. And of course, anyone who does not agree with the thinking of the Society is simply not rational.
wvpeach
 
  1  
Reply Sun 16 Sep, 2007 01:14 pm
@Campbell34,
Well campbell its clear if you read the bible that most of those who think they belong to God and are perfectly following his will will be told by the Lord Jesus depart from me ye workers of eniguity I knew you not.

I will take my chances that those who think like you will be the ones the Lord does not know.

And that those who have been taught at the knee of the holy spirit likje myself are the ones who will be welcomed into the kingdom of heaven and hear well done good and profitable servant.

But be sure that I will praying for mercy for the likes of you while I recieve my welcome and reward into Gods blessings.

Good luck to you and I really mean it, you will need it.:thumbup:

I;m pulling for people that are stubborn and bullies like you, I have many such people in my own familiy.


Campbell34;37537 wrote:
Well thats usually the responce I get from people who have connections with the Watch Tower Society. You are right, we are on a different page, especially if you have bought into the New World Translation. Even though most scholars have condemnded this translation as more of a perversion than a translation, those who follow the Society faithfully ignore those scholars. And of course, anyone who does not agree with the thinking of the Society is simply not rational.
wvpeach
 
  1  
Reply Sun 16 Sep, 2007 01:20 pm
@Greatest I am cv,
Sorry greatest.

I was willing to believe you were a brother in Christ then a servant of you real father the devil.

But your posts make no sense and are NOT OF GOD.

So I have a problem with you as those that serve Satan do niot serve my Lord and your posts are off the wall and not in agreement with the words of God .

So you had a friend and somebody who was willing to listen to what you said, but you squandered that with your silliness.



Greatest I am;37507 wrote:
I would have thought that since both of you believe in and have encountered demons and angels, that you could find common ground.

Go figure.

Regards
DL
Campbell34
 
  1  
Reply Sun 16 Sep, 2007 02:24 pm
@wvpeach,
wvpeach;37548 wrote:
Well campbell its clear if you read the bible that most of those who think they belong to God and are perfectly following his will will be told by the Lord Jesus depart from me ye workers of eniguity I knew you not.

I will take my chances that those who think like you will be the ones the Lord does not know.

And that those who have been taught at the knee of the holy spirit likje myself are the ones who will be welcomed into the kingdom of heaven and hear well done good and profitable servant.

But be sure that I will praying for mercy for the likes of you while I recieve my welcome and reward into Gods blessings.

Good luck to you and I really mean it, you will need it.:thumbup:

I;m pulling for people that are stubborn and bullies like you, I have many such people in my own familiy.


Well I might be one of those in need of mercy, but if Jehovah should ask me who was the one that created the earth alone and by himself ? I will say it was you Jehovah and no one else. What would you tell Him?
 

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