RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 11:04 pm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7syUHUZNP8&feature=related
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 11:07 pm
@chai2,
Quote:
The man is a chiropractor.
that's not an M.D.


He also mentions overseeing thousands of people fasting... Ever heard of a chiropractor who has those credentials?
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 11:20 pm
@RexRed,
I worked in immunology for fifteeen years. I think you are either jerking yourself off or are being done so.

You are looking at outliers of your present fancy.
0 Replies
 
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 11:24 pm
@RexRed,
I worked in immunology for fifteeen years. I think you are either jerking yourself off or are being done so.

You are looking at outliers of your present fantasy.

Apparently you need some temporary plus, or minus, as the case may be, to get wildly enthused.

I get you won't listen to me and don't care. I'm just trying, as others are, to give you information. Wrack yourself up, go ahead full force, don't listen. Reach for the will o the whisp.
0 Replies
 
failures art
 
  1  
Reply Sat 17 Jul, 2010 11:45 pm
@ossobuco,
ossobuco wrote:

Sorry, I still think of it as a dumb guideline. No, I don't have data, just personal observation.

What would you suggest is a good guideline? At what point is weight loss too rapid? At what rate are you harming yourself?

ossobuco wrote:

What, 20 pounds a month, give me a break.

That is a lot of weight. I lost about 3 per week. I looked and felt dramatically different.

ossobuco wrote:

Every single person I know who has done that has gained it back and then some.

Part of the reason people should not be starving themselves and harming their bodies with rapid weight loss.

ossobuco wrote:

I did lose a bunch of weight myself and keep it off, but not that fast.

I'm not advocating rapid weight loss. I think healthy bodies are more important than light bodies.

A
R
T
ossobuco
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 Jul, 2010 12:14 am
@failures art,
Yeh, but you were all about 5 lbs a week. I take that as too fast, past the first bit of what is said to be water loss.

The people I know who have kept it off do like 4 pounds a month, if that, sometimes less. The metabolism equilibrates. Probably what I did. That is, of course, my own observation. I have many friends who have lost great amounts of weight fairly fast and ended up, sorry, far fatter.

I am strongly distrustful of fast loss, whether it is a starvation mode or some other mode.

Jes is doing it right, very very cognisant, paying serious attention, and I've not arguments with her program but even her, I don't want to lose too fast.

I probably do have more than my own observation, years worth of health articles - but since I can't just access them, just more opinion. I do subscribe to some special med sites, but that's no argument, they are mostly annoying and I'm about to quit them.

I lost weight when I knew I had to move and pack up my house all with little money, but that wasn't a zoom down, just a behaviour change. Though money probably does have something to do with my staying down weight. I like good food, pick vegetables, meat has flown off the scope though not entirely.

At my worst I veered near 190 (I'm a 5-5.5 woman) and I gradually coned down to 148, where I've stablized. When I was young, I was in the 120's, early 130's.

I'm fine with the 148, it seems right for me now. A little heft on the ribs, stomach fat for my brain, and abdominal fat for my heart, but not all that much of each. Uh, on all that, there are new articles.

What I need is more exercise - if only I could get myself up at 6 a.m. (it's hot here at mid day, now.)
failures art
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 Jul, 2010 12:28 am
@ossobuco,
I'm about no more than 5lbs a week. As I stated before, I knew what it took to loose 3 lbs a week, I can't imagine what kind of hell I'd be putting myself through to do more than 5 lbs.

1 lb is equivalent to a 3,600 Cal debt. When I was on a 1,936 DCV budget, trying to save an additional 7,200 Cal would mean only eating less than 900 Cal per day. That is suicide. Or I would have to run (@ 100 Cal per mile) 72 miles in a week. That's a 10.4 mile run every day on top of what I already did in the gym.

The economy of 2lbs is frightening enough. The fact that I could loose 3 lbs a weeks was pretty good. I think most healthy weight loss after the initial loss of excess water weight is about 1.5 - 2 lbs per week. This is why I can't see it being healthy to go beyond 5 lbs. It's just crazy.

A
R
T
ossobuco
 
  0  
Reply Sun 18 Jul, 2010 12:39 am
@failures art,
I'm not sure your metabolism cares, but I have this take that it deals better with incremental change, and as ehBeth mentioned, distributed through the day. No data on that from me..
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 Jul, 2010 04:44 am
Well I gained the weight back but as I said it took over a year of gluttony to do it and also I did not gain a single lb more than what I lost. In fact I was at 210 lbs before my diet (210 is my shut off limit) and I have this time gone only to 202 lbs so I never actually gained it ALL back. That is over a year and half to gain back 30 to 40 lbs and every ounce of that was lost by starving myself every day. People say you gain it right back and you get sick when you starve your body and I am saying my body is not like that. I gain it back because i went back to my old eating habits. I didn't really hit a plateau when I was losing weight I just went off my diet. It seemed like a plateau because that was where I stopped dieting. Why did I stop? I got complacent and just quit dieting. Yet my health remained fine and I did not suffer one single adverse health effect. The only adverse health effects have come from being overweight. Being overweight is not an option for me.

I don't plan on fasting an entire day... I just make my stomach hungry before I eat then I eat good and reward my stomach. It gives me growls of approval. My stomach actually thanks me by talking to me and giving me approval. I was not aware my stomach was actually a living organism until I began to starve it then it came alive. It couldn't talk to me when its mouth is always full. Our stomachs are like an animal living within our body and we need to tame it. My body digests my food better and none of it is stored into fat. My bowels work better and I have MUCH less depression, anxiety and no loss of energy (like when I was fat). I see it that being overweight by 50 lbs is much worse for my health than cutting my caloric intake by 30%.

I have lost 7 lbs in the last two days... and I feel great! I think that starving your body actually raises your metabolism because fat has more energy stored in it than carbs or protein. So it makes your bodies metabolism furnace burn hotter and cleaner

I plan on another walk today if the sun is not too hot. I drink plenty of water and take my vitamins and minerals.

Also most immunologists say that depriving the stomach of food boosts the bodies immune system. What could be better?

I once worked for the Maine sardine council grading sardines. I washed the test tube beakers all day. I got to take naps and read the news paper while we were not grading sardines. So much for state jobs. Get paid well and work very little. Smile
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 Jul, 2010 04:56 am
For breakfast today I am going to have a couple cups of decaf coffee (No cream or sugar). That is a cup of 250 antioxidants and zero calories or caffeine. I am sure my immune system and stomach will appreciate that. Those antioxidants will protect my organs and my boosted immune system will actually use them to repair rather than be overloaded by the secondary task of digesting even more food.
chai2
 
  2  
Reply Sun 18 Jul, 2010 07:51 am
@RexRed,
RexRed wrote:

Quote:
The man is a chiropractor.
that's not an M.D.


He also mentions overseeing thousands of people fasting... Ever heard of a chiropractor who has those credentials?


Rex Red: The man is an MD! Are you an MD?

Anyone who can read: The man is not an MD.

Rex Red: The man mentions he has credentials! Yeah, that's it, credentials! Do you have credentials?


ohhhhhhh.....credentials.......sorry to have thrown inconvenient actual information into the mix.

I'm not trying to bait you Rex. What I'm doing is pointing out that if a person wants to believe something, i.e. that you can loose 7 pounds of fat in 2 days (that's burning off over 12,000 of fat in one day) they can find something, somewhere to support it.

Rex, if you have lost 7 pounds in two days, 5 or 6 pounds of it was mostly water, fecal matter, etc. some muscle, a little fat.

A 200 pound person, running a 26 mile marathon, would not burn 12,000 calories. They would burn approx 4000. Please don't think (or ask us to believe) that fasting is causing your metabolism is causing your body to burn 3 times more fat in a day than a person who runs non-stop for 5-7 hours.

I have no opinion on fasting, one way or the other.

I do have opinions, which I'll keep to myself, on someone who makes illogical, grandiose and conflicting claims.

I do have a question though, unrelated to fasting.
Why do you assume that none of us here have no knowledge on a subject, when in fact they may be more educated in a matter than you know?

Good luck with your weight loss Rex.
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  3  
Reply Sun 18 Jul, 2010 08:51 am
@chai2,
Yes.

The old "it's easy to quit smoking, I do it all the time."

EhBeth has made some very good points about metabolism.

You're making your poor body freak out, Rex. Slow and steady. (I've lost 30 pounds that way, and kept it off.)
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 Jul, 2010 07:35 pm
@sozobe,
I cleaned my whole apartment and I have not been depressed once today.

Didn't eat until about 4:00 gonna have spaghetti with home made meatballs tonight. almost back to my 10 lb. I have required less sleep too.

I don't mean to be
0 Replies
 
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Sun 18 Jul, 2010 07:59 pm
@sozobe,
I cleaned my whole apartment, did my laundry and I have not been depressed once today.

Didn't eat until about 4:00PM had a light meal gonna have spaghetti with tiny home made meatballs tonight around 10pm will probably go to bed around 1 or 2 AM. Almost back to my 10 lb loss. I have required less sleep too.

I don't mean to be one bit ungrateful or insulting to Ehbeth I cannot fault her for looking out after me and everyone's best interest. Thank you all. I will not being doing the 5 t0 7 meal a day thing because I simply do not have the will power to not eat after I have eaten in the AM.

I am too addictive a person. It was the same when I quite smoking cigarettes over 12 years ago. Each time I had to quit at night and if I had a cigarette in the AM I would smoke all day. I could not relegate my smoking to incrementally less cigarettes per day. It was cold turkey for me or not quit. If I quit at night before I went to bed I had a better chance of not smoking the next day, eventually I kicked the habit. Been over 12 year and I have not smoked a single cigarette since (other than the one puff in Amsterdam 6 years ago) Smile But I had to quit cigarettes over 100 times to finally kick the habit.

I just know if I eat in the AM it is all over and I eat all day like a pig. So it is either do it this way or not succeed. Ehbeth has a probably better way IF one has the will power to follow it. I know myself and I can't sustain my hunger once awakened. When I let my stomach shrink all day I am incapable of eating as much when I finally do eat. I may get stomach pangs during the day but I am not hungry. Food is also much more satisfying almost religious when I finally do eat, and my stomach thanks me. To me it seems logical, for me it works and I get immediate results so I am encouraged by the approach. I am not disagreeing with Ehbeth (bless her heart). I just know with my addictive nature I can't quite eating once I start. I am feeling more stable and I am less negative. If I crash you will all be the first to hear about it for sure. Smile
0 Replies
 
shewolfnm
 
  3  
Reply Sun 18 Jul, 2010 08:45 pm
get your greens!!!
make the smoothie as your drink with dinner. But get those body cleaning greens.
RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Jul, 2010 05:41 am
@shewolfnm,
What are the best greens? Fiddle heads (which I LOVE) and swiss chard come to mind. Though I don't put margarine or butter on them anymore just plain. I have successfully cut out all butter and margarine for several months now. Not even a tiny bit. I use vegetable oil (several kinds) for making grilled sandwiches or cooking eggs. I usually settle for broccoli but I like cooked beet greens and beets which are actually red (sometimes with a little vinegar) too and I usually cook greens but they are probably better raw in a salad of field greens and raw veggies. Eight hours before I can eat. eeek!

Smoothies are great too. We have a Mexican restaurant here in town that makes them but they probably use raw table sugar. I have had some disasters with smoothies. I once tried some banana and strawberries I blended them and the banana was a bit under ripe and it tasted terrible. So I guess very ripe fruit and veggies is the key. I have cut out most all sugar I figure I get enough naturally from fresh foods. I love cider but the new fangled ciders acai berry etc are quite pricy and I wonder if the whole fruit is better.

A friend of mine went shopping yesterday and came back to their apartment with a whole case of mountain dew I as grossed out. I have no love whatsoever for, err, soda or "energy drinks..."

I have some cherries and some sour seedless green grapes in the fridge now. The cherries are perfect for eating and ripe but the grapes are a bit tart as I am too honest to try one at the supermarket before I buy them. They will ripen in a day I hope.

Does anyone know if you lose weight generally from head to toe or from toe to head? That might account for the mild headaches when first starting a diet. Also people say they diet and lose all the weight from their face and the rest stays. (lol) Which has only slightly happened to me I don't have my plump cheeks but they are more chiseled. That was a main reason why I started dieting was my face looked puffy and I couldn't stand it.

When I am at the gym running they have TV's for each running machine and I usually change the channel to the food network. Is that a sin? Smile

Thanks SW for getting me thinking about a better variety of fruits and vegetables when I plan meals, many kudos! Smile
shewolfnm
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Jul, 2010 06:03 am
The ones i suggested always make a great base and will help clear out all pollutants in your body.

dandelion - liver and kidney cleaner. Vitamin a c e , and something else.. dunno. Probably d as well.

Red Chard. Same thing!

Spinach same thing

Get your sugar from fruit . One piece a day is honestly enough. 2 is a treat.

Get your fruit in the smoothie.
1 dark brown or black spotted banana
Handful of spinach
1 big red leaf kale
2-4 leaves of dandelion
vanilla almond milk.

Thats my breakfast every morning. Smile I ate at Dans hamburgers yesterday. I regretted the decision before I even finished my burger . I felt horrible.
I had a smoothie last night with heavier dandelion and I added parsley. Yes it was good!! Smile
But I dont look to the smoothie to be a perfect sweet treat. Thats my 'medicine'. with the heavier dandelion, I was helping clear out all the junk I just ate. Worked wonders. I dont have the fast food hang over this morning like I would normally have.

Good rule of thumb when it comes to greens.. the darker the better.

If you still like to season your greens, or any food in general, and are not yet to the unseasoned taste pallet.. Go to the store and get some Spike seasoning. Calorie free, chemical free, it does taste pretty good. Some of Emerils seasonings are ok to use too, but he has that hidden MSG in them . Pisses me off. SO watch out for that.

As for refined sugars, if you want something sweet, SADLY your white table sugar is one of the easier on the body choices. Or, you can try turbino sugar. Really, for a sweetner, just use over ripe bananas. But for the most part, you are not eating anything that most people would want to add sugar too anyway right?
Dont fall for the fake sweetner stuff. Splenda, Equal.. etc. Those things are toxic to the liver, the kidneys and are one of the biggest contributors to diabetes out there. Just dont go there.
If you have a real heavy sweet tooth ( Like I do ! ) Keep little fruits on you at all times.
Older blueberries, when they get soft.. put them in a zip lock baggie and freeze them! Want something sweet, just take a hand full of those and suck on them one at a time. Excellent for your body, GREAT sweet stuff, and by the time you finish that hand full ( Less than 35 calories) you wil have sedated your sweet tooth and had a load of vitamins and anti oxidants.

The easiest way to take care of your body is to stop eating out of packages. Plain and simple. And if you have to have something from a package, the ingredient list should be super short, and easy to read. No chemicals should be added.

And no. It isnt that expensive to eat that way.

If you need microwave dinners , Kashi brand has some that are pretty free of everything, taste wonderful, and at least HERE can be found for under 3.00
Amys brand is the same way.

ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Jul, 2010 06:51 am
@RexRed,
RexRed wrote:

For breakfast today I am going to have a couple cups of decaf coffee or sugar). That is a cup of 250 antioxidants and zero calories or caffeine.


decaf coffee does not mean it has no caffeine

it has less caffeine
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Jul, 2010 06:55 am
@RexRed,
generally speaking - food with colour is best

green veggies

all those lovely deeply coloured fruits

stay away from the white bread/white rice/white pasta etc

whole fruit is better than processed - even if it's processed to juice

the fibre from the whole fruit is important - you don't want the sugars from the fruit to just be able to zoom into your system as they do when they're juiced

RexRed
 
  1  
Reply Mon 19 Jul, 2010 11:33 pm
I'll be on tomorrow morning to respond to all the great posts I have been busy today.
0 Replies
 
 

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