Are You Fed Up Of Us Philiforum Refugees Yet?

Well, there are some extremes in both 'cultures', including the ebulliantly rude - unless I have mistaken who is who from where - to the never ever impolite in both groups. I've read plenty of straightforward folks among the phils, plenty who enjoy the back and forth - the camaraderie of negating another poster's or posters' ideas, and plenty who can get into the spirit of tossed bon mots, some who get that all digressions aren't evil. I'll agree that earlier a2kers are heartier in impoliteness, including myself. Not all that many phils have sweet sense sign off words.

I think I'll go with having Mark be Mark, whether I personally like the signoffs or not. (That's not a natter at you, Reyn. I get what you are saying.) I am presuming he'll go with letting me be me, whether I actually am so "impolite" as to clear some of his threads from my New Posts lists (at the same time I read and participate in some of them). Many of us steady posters at a2k have liked the ability to clear our lists down to what we are still interested in reading, while even some of the earlier a2kers never thumb down a thread or post. Now Robert has given us other ways to handle that besides thumbs, but some version of that selection process will still go on (I think there is a modification in the plans), as not everyone will want a noise filter, even one of our own devising.

When Robert gets the Groups thing going, that will probably take care of some of the angst about losing the old and treasured ways of the phils forum (I don't say that sarcastically).

i've noticed a few who thank responders in every (or almost every) post, i think this is a hold over from a function of the original site if i remember correctly, i think i've run across it on other sites, like our thumbs up/down, but with an identifier if i'm not mistaken

Ah, now I remember reading that.

it is too bad that we have not as of yet had a debate on the probable success and moral appropriateness of trying to buy a2k members by buying other forums, feeding their content into a2k, and then destroying them. Corporations can do this kind of feeding but even they can't do it very often, it is too disruptive and too much work to successfully merge two cultures, so can it ever work with virtual cultures on the internet where people tend to be much more independent minded than corporate employees are?

I dont think so, but it would make for a good debate.....

I think it was explained that the phil forums were facing some financial issues RE: hosting. I think that's considerable in the debate as well.

"Destroy" is a bit of a strong word.

I do think that some identity is lost in the branding though. How long are these people the Phils before they are simply a2kers? I think ultimate success is when philosophy posters no longer identify as "refugees."

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Refugee camp fire-side chats about the meaning of life
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Yes, in that case all of the content could have vanished, and now it is here. If Robert only buys distressed properties he might be able to insulate himself from the charge that he is a killer of forums.

interesting, there are people here i think of only in terms of politics (okie, ican, oralloy), and while i realize they are a2ker's i don't think of them as part of the regular group, they're political posters almost exclusively

fortunately we have H2Oman to balance us out.

Sure. I do the same thing, but this is always a subcategory of being a A2Ker political poster.

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That reminds me dys. Didn't you say Robert was working on a Solve et Coagula filter?

Yeah, that's what signatures are for anyway (which come with an option to turn them off here).

who?

The curate when asked how he had enjoyed his egg, said that "It was good, in parts."

I don't really see much difference, I can't recall any of the topics started by the newcomers to have not been addressed prior in some fashion or other. Have fun newbies and not-so-newbies!

If a forum sells, it was in distress. Forum owners never value their forums according to market value (which is why I'll never sell a2k, it'd take orders of magnitude more than it's worth to even make me consider parting with it) and if they are selling the forum they generally are done with it themselves from an emotional standpoint.

As an example, the next forum we are importing is currently hacked and has been since May. The only posts it gets in a day, if any, tend to be members asking what is happening to the site and why it's not being cared for or more spam being untended (I'm trying to keep up with it now to prepare it for the merge).

Nevertheless, some of them (hopefully not too many, given that the forum as it stands is completely dead) might not like it when they come over here. Such is life. You can't please everybody, not everyone was happy in the previous forum incarnations either, but now there is a single person to blame for the forum unhappiness in a single transformative event.

But you know what? For all the claims of unhappiness, the activity grew. The previous activity from philosophy forum carried on here. So I'll keep listening to objective user feedback and not the ones who merely predict doom with the greatest, and most misplaced, strength of conviction. Merging forums is not without attrition, but it's being done here in a way that is producing demonstrable community growth. The angst is not necessarily indicative of what is really going on, even if it tends to dominate a forum's narrative while it's ongoing.

Actually, that is a case that reminds me to do flood control on topics (differentiated from posts) that is longer.

I don't really have much to "get off my chest", Mark.
I think most of us here approached the merger in pretty good faith & were a little taken aback about how "stand-offish" you philosophers appeared to be at the start. I mean, here were we, welcoming you like mad (!), inviting you to join in on our discussions, & the response from your members was to start a whole new bunch of what appeared to be "philosophers only" threads!

So I think some of us here went through a "peeved & feeling rejected" stage. I know I did. What are we, chopped liver? How many times could I ask you folk to dance & be knocked back?

But, in retrospect, I do understand your initial reactions. (I think I understood them pretty well at the time of the merger, actually.) Many of you were in a state of shock at the sudden loss of your (obviously much-loved) forum & were indeterminably holding onto your group identity.

If, as you say, you've only retained 10% of your forum members, I'm sorry to hear that. Where do you think they've vanished to? Simply dispersed & given up? You never know, though, a few of them might begin to trickle back. These ties, built up over a long time, can be pretty binding, I've found. It's the people at A2K, some of whom I've gotten to know over the life of 3 forums (including Ravens Realm) that keep me returning through the peaks & troughs. Also, of course, more recent A2Kers I've grown to care about. Not just the old timers.

So OK, back to your question. I really, really welcome the fresh input, the fresh perspectives, you folk have provided here. As I said a few times earlier, A2K was getting a wee bit stale & predictable, quite set in its ways ... I am seeing your group members much more as individuals now, not so much members of a group. The personal interactions I've had with members of your group (including you, Mark) have been really positive. And friendly, too. I particularly welcome the fresh input into the more "political" threads. Prior to the influx of your members (from the UK & other countries) our discussions were pretty much the US perspective (both progressive & conservative) & the rest of us (smallish numbers from other countries) arguing against those US perspectives. (As most A2kers are from the US) It is wonderful to have a more balanced, more "international" feel, the different perspectives, to our debates & discussions. That has been the biggest plus for me, anyway.

Sorry my post has become so long. I don't quite know how that happened. But you are not to feel under an obligation to respond to everything I've said, OK?

One of the reasons I like it here, past the bracing blast of views way different than mine, is the bracing blast of views from outside of my own country. I know my own country moderately well. Still, I hang on or come up short re words from nimh; the rare poster from Russia, started with S - I want to say, Serto, but that's not it; Saab, Quincy, Raphillon, Dagmaraka - woman many of us love, J_B from China, always Fbaezer, Clary the travel writer extraordinaire, Pitter (u.s. american in colombia).

I am skipping some screen names, but they are a good part of why I am here.

Interesting thread, a few comments if I may.

Moving On: I think many of the regular posters have moved on, though a good number have stayed. As someone mentioned before, its to be expected.

The Philforum Disconnect: Justin couldn't run the PhilForum any more; he had to sell. We knew it, we saw it coming but were told it would be sold. I think for most of us, the worst we figured would happen would be the appearance of some ads. I seriously doubt anyone thought a complete changeover to another (completely different) forum was going to be the result. This likely spawned some soured feelings and that's likely the biggest source of any mirth y'all are seeing (just my guess).

Destroyer?: Robert's not to blame; he bought something that was offered (the only alternative is that NO ONE would have bought our messages and user records). Obviously a lot of time and effort's put into A2K. But as he's already admitted, attrition is an inevitable part of such transactions. But because there's no other "face" to put on the dissatisfaction some feel and can't let go, he'll unfortunately catch it. I think that those who've thought it through don't really bear ill will.

My Take: I personally still don't feel at home; the reason being, this kind of set up simply isn't one I would have joined had my user record and posts not been brought here. Don't get me wrong, this is a fine place with some outstanding folks! But whether or not I move my philosophy interests elsewhere, I think I'll be happy to remain a member and chime in here and there. Also, familiar faces like Salima, Mark, Jeeprs, Fido, Gosh and more all remain welcome sights I'd rather not lose.

But a HUGE thanks to all who've taken a lot of effort to help make this merger work and welcomed us in. Several of you have an obvious stake in keeping your A2K home hospitable and cordial - it's not gone unnoticed.

Thanks again

Well, Khet, rest here from time to time. I've paid attention to your posts, and so what. But you have ears here.