31
   

Does free will exist?

 
 
htam9876
 
  1  
Tue 15 Nov, 2022 03:57 pm
Nightmare again last night: “capital punishment”. Hard landing.The First Order PRESENCE…
 http://5b0988e595225.cdn.sohucs.com/images/20190430/45b60fba0c7e47e3aec2061756729fd7.jpeg
 https://icweiliimg1.pstatp.com/weili/bl/485651829375107086.jpg

0 Replies
 
The Anointed
 
  -2  
Tue 15 Nov, 2022 06:59 pm
@Agent Smith,
Quote:
Well, Deus is part of determinism but I suppose He makes an exception every now and then. Good for Him and for us too, wouldn't you agree?

God, who is all that exists and has been evolving from the everlasting and will continue to evolve into the everlasting, may determine the structure of each of his universal generational bodies, but never the actions of his intelligent creations: He gives each and everyone a choice whether or not to obey the law that He has written in our hearts and He holds each and everyone of us morally responsible for our actions committed according to our own free will.

Do you want your children to despise and disobey you?
Are you a wilful destroyer of the environment around you?
Do you want others to harm or kill you or yours’?
Do you want others to steal what is yours?
Do you want others to have sex with your spouse, etc, etc.?

If you have answered ‘NO’ to these and yet have done this to your neighbour, then you have broken the very law that you impose on the society around you, and the very law that is written on our hearts.
Agent Smith
 
  1  
Wed 16 Nov, 2022 04:28 pm
@The Anointed,
How intriguing, isn't it, that Deus is the final authority on ethics?
bobsal u1553115
 
  2  
Wed 16 Nov, 2022 07:14 pm
Free will may not exist. However, Free Willy will live on in our hearts into the ages.
0 Replies
 
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Wed 16 Nov, 2022 07:23 pm
@Agent Smith,
Agent Smith wrote:

How intriguing, isn't it, that Deus is the final authority on ethics?


But the Deity is not the final authority. We still have free will and the last word on any action, with the obligation to atone for bad results of our actions. We have responsibility as well as free will.

Well, some of us do, at any rate.
Agent Smith
 
  1  
Thu 17 Nov, 2022 01:31 am
@bobsal u1553115,
I agree with your points more or less - we seem to be on the same page mon ami. Deus is Deus in a pantheistic sense - the merger having been succesfully completed many, many billions and billions of years ago, oui?
htam9876
 
  2  
Thu 17 Nov, 2022 03:21 am
Nightmare again last night: “capital punishment”. Hard landing. The First Order PRESENCE…
The pig at last put into the coffin box, the coffin cover put onto the coffin box…
Absolute constraint…
http://www.huizone.com/attachment/images/1/2019/11/157467312824482.jpg
 https://icweiliimg1.pstatp.com/weili/bl/482592481220493394.jpg
0 Replies
 
Agent Smith
 
  0  
Sat 19 Nov, 2022 07:51 am
I feel the so-called 4th dimension, a deeper understanding of it, is crucial to an answer to the OP's question.
0 Replies
 
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Sat 19 Nov, 2022 12:49 pm
@Agent Smith,
Agent Smith wrote:

I agree with your points more or less - we seem to be on the same page mon ami. Deus is Deus in a pantheistic sense - the merger having been succesfully completed many, many billions and billions of years ago, oui?


Non.
Agent Smith
 
  0  
Sat 19 Nov, 2022 07:51 pm
@bobsal u1553115,
So you're saying we have free will?

Proof?
0 Replies
 
bobsal u1553115
 
  1  
Sun 20 Nov, 2022 07:59 am
Just by saying it: I have free will. I said it freely and willfully.
0 Replies
 
Albuquerque
 
  1  
Fri 9 Dec, 2022 12:54 am

Counterpoint:
The desire to break our desires is also pre determined...the illusion of freedom pushed by a contract with absurdism is precisely about that.
Religions, mythological story telling, and Human narrative, thrive on that!
The true paradox is that we need the illusion of freedom to cling to our own very real desires...the very ones we couldn't chose.
To be free is to not exist, to be real to be ourselves is to be predetermined, to be natural!
Jasper10
 
  -1  
Sat 10 Dec, 2022 01:39 am
@Albuquerque,
You need to exist first to be able to claim you are an illusion.You are therefore not an illusion.

Believing one is an illusion comes from an inward only dualistic meditation that has no understanding of consciousness.

It leads on to a belief that we are nothing more than dualistic processing reactors .i.e.emotional reactors or in other words thoughts and emotions within a robotic machine.

Inward only dualistic meditation is a one sided, out of synch, consciousness meditative practice which ultimately tries to deny the very thing that decided to go inwards in the first place.

There is such a thing as outward meditation as well which balances this one sided meditative practice and brings the individual into an understanding of Consciousness and Natures science,philosophy and psychology.



Albuquerque
 
  1  
Sat 10 Dec, 2022 09:46 am
@Jasper10,
Never said I am an illusion, rather I have said often free will is an illusion.
Granting illusions have a domain of their own, just like dreams are real, but never free, as they are an integral necessary part of our existence and lives.
Its not my fault that you don't grasp what was meant with the sentence "to be free is to not exist"...
Jasper10
 
  0  
Sat 10 Dec, 2022 10:03 am
@Albuquerque,
To be free is to exist.

You exist Albuquerque and you have the ability to choose.

You don’t understand consciousness or control it.
Albuquerque
 
  1  
Sat 10 Dec, 2022 10:05 am
@Jasper10,
Yes I chose everyday what I NEED! I just don't see where the freedom is in that process...
0 Replies
 
Albuquerque
 
  1  
Sat 10 Dec, 2022 10:11 am
@Jasper10,
Moreover:

Change comes to you, you don't change anything!
Consciousness is witnessing your own unfolding within the Cosmos necessary holistic process!

In the big scheme of things there is no capital Change, as everything that could change already IS!

Now go meditate on that and the relation of Being and Truth!
Jasper10
 
  -1  
Sat 10 Dec, 2022 10:15 am
@Albuquerque,
You don’t control consciousness Albuquerque.You are controlled and are unaware of it because you don’t process awareness.If you were aware you would have recognised that you toggle between consciousness states and would learn to control it.
Albuquerque
 
  1  
Sat 10 Dec, 2022 10:21 am
@Jasper10,
Aaaah man, I want to help you but it is hard...

Let me give you an example, and please pay attention.

if it is true tomorrow is going to rain in your area then it is already true today that tomorrow will rain in your area...my epistemic uncertainty about what will happen has nothing to do with what is true!

Similarly if it is true tomorrow I will eat some more chocolate ice cream I have in the freezer just like I did now, then it is already true today I will eat the ice cream tomorrow...my lack of knowledge on what will happen has nothing to do with what is already true!
Jasper10
 
  -1  
Sat 10 Dec, 2022 10:25 am
@Albuquerque,
I’m fine Albuquerque.I have found what I need to find.I am trying to help you.
 

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