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What is the purpose of life after death ?

 
 
Alan McDougall
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jun, 2009 07:21 am
@aussie mark,
The puropse of the afterlife is to progress and learn to become like God and merge into the great oneness, while still retaining your own unique awareness and personality.

Read my account in the in the Mellen Thomas Bennett thread

My account is one of the last posts


Peace

Alan
0 Replies
 
Extra Gravy
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jun, 2009 08:53 am
@aussie mark,
The concept of life after death is not founded on verifiable information. It does not have its origin in first hand reports or observable data achieving anything close to adequate scientific veracity. Resist the temptation to quote your holy book, cultures much older than yours have also held beliefs similar enough to be called life after death. Man has long entertained an idea consisting primarily of continuation after death. We have entertained this idea under the cover of numerous rationales, each replaced after sufficient generations by a new rationale. None of these afterlife rationales represent the folding in of new information, rather they are themselves folded into new religions, co-opted as it were into new cultural expressions.

The original question had me asking these questions:
Why do humans entertain the hope of a life after death?
What are the origins of this peculiar hope in an afterlife?
What benefits, for society or individuals, promote the maintenance of this belief?

After more thought I have begun asking these as well:
What does the nature of an afterlife tell us about its adherants?
What does an afterlife tell us about the needs, and societal stressors of its origin societies?
xris
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jun, 2009 10:17 am
@Extra Gravy,
Extra Gravy;68546 wrote:
The concept of life after death is not founded on verifiable information. It does not have its origin in first hand reports or observable data achieving anything close to adequate scientific veracity. Resist the temptation to quote your holy book, cultures much older than yours have also held beliefs similar enough to be called life after death. Man has long entertained an idea consisting primarily of continuation after death. We have entertained this idea under the cover of numerous rationales, each replaced after sufficient generations by a new rationale. None of these afterlife rationales represent the folding in of new information, rather they are themselves folded into new religions, co-opted as it were into new cultural expressions.

The original question had me asking these questions:
Why do humans entertain the hope of a life after death?
What are the origins of this peculiar hope in an afterlife?
What benefits, for society or individuals, promote the maintenance of this belief?

After more thought I have begun asking these as well:
What does the nature of an afterlife tell us about its adherants?
What does an afterlife tell us about the needs, and societal stressors of its origin societies?
Are these questions or answers?
Zetetic11235
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jun, 2009 12:39 pm
@xris,
Of course they are questions, but they are questions with certain assumptions behind them that circumvent discussion of assumed results. Of course that is true of every question, its just that the assumptions here are very strategic. Overall, I would probably agree with them, but I would not say this of many of the people in this thread.
xris
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jun, 2009 01:49 pm
@Zetetic11235,
Zetetic11235;68593 wrote:
Of course they are questions, but they are questions with certain assumptions behind them that circumvent discussion of assumed results. Of course that is true of every question, its just that the assumptions here are very strategic. Overall, I would probably agree with them, but I would not say this of many of the people in this thread.
the assumptions are very strategic..sorry but it sounds like gumbley gook..you will have to be it just bit clearer.I could not work out if you required a debate or you where making a statement of fact.
Krumple
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jun, 2009 02:12 pm
@aussie mark,
Quote:
Understanding that time might not exist as we know it might be one explanation


If there is no time, then there can't be movement. Time is the line between two points. Movement is the change of one point with another point. So if there is no time then there is just a single snap shot event that does not change or move.

This is what I mean by people rarely ever give it enough thought. You can't just toss out ideas and think, "Yeah this is how I would like it to be according to my belief." That doesn't work, it is nothing more than living in a fantasy land of make believe.

Quote:
constructing the ability to exist without form is that so hard to visualise?I am not flesh and blood to you


That's why I asked if you become a brain or intellect which would be formless. But saying formless is not easily written off. It means that there still has to be something that is you or not you, right? What I mean is, if we have no form then does our mind expand and fill up ever thing equally? So do all our minds overlap? How would you recognize anyone without form? You just hear their thoughts?

Or do you mean formless in an apparition? So a ghost that mimics your previous form but it is just a non-physical thing? But you still have arms, legs, head, hair, clothes, teeth, shoes and so on?
xris
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jun, 2009 02:44 pm
@Krumple,
Krumple;68607 wrote:
If there is no time, then there can't be movement. Time is the line between two points. Movement is the change of one point with another point. So if there is no time then there is just a single snap shot event that does not change or move.

This is what I mean by people rarely ever give it enough thought. You can't just toss out ideas and think, "Yeah this is how I would like it to be according to my belief." That doesn't work, it is nothing more than living in a fantasy land of make believe.



That's why I asked if you become a brain or intellect which would be formless. But saying formless is not easily written off. It means that there still has to be something that is you or not you, right? What I mean is, if we have no form then does our mind expand and fill up ever thing equally? So do all our minds overlap? How would you recognize anyone without form? You just hear their thoughts?

Or do you mean formless in an apparition? So a ghost that mimics your previous form but it is just a non-physical thing? But you still have arms, legs, head, hair, clothes, teeth, shoes and so on?
Time exists in a material world and yes i have thought about it friend, your not the first to travel this road.Because you cant imagine , because its beyond your comprehension, it does not exist?Lets tell the world, lets tell the angels.
Can you imagine these other dimensions QM tells us exist? tell me how do they exist in parallel to our existance?Do question science when they inform you of parallel universal existences? do you?
If you have not discovered heaven ,will it cease to exist? If i could say such a thing did you hear that tree fall.
0 Replies
 
hue-man
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jun, 2009 05:37 pm
@aussie mark,
aussie mark;5354 wrote:
:confused: Can any one explain to the forum why there is supposed to be a life after death and what would the purpose of that life be ,

Thank you Very Happy


I take it that this question is sarcastic.

The only purpose for the idea of a life after death is in this life. The purpose is to make us feel more comfortable about our fear of death, and the desire to reunite with loved ones when we die.
William
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jun, 2009 06:16 pm
@hue-man,
hue-man;68637 wrote:
I take it that this question is sarcastic.

The only purpose for the idea of a life after death is in this life. The purpose is to make us feel more comfortable about our fear of death, and the desire to reunite with loved ones when we die.


Hello Hue,
I am curious why you think it was sarcastic? It seemed like genuine to me?

William
Neil D
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jun, 2009 07:23 pm
@William,
Hello,

This question is basically the same as "What is the purpose of life?", and to me, the answer is: There is no purpose. It just is. I think all life comes from a fundamental source(a godforce), and it is the most basic thing that has always existed from which life is possible, and to ask if it has a purpose, would be like implying that there was something before it, or along with it, and there isn't.

Instead of asking your question, think of it this way instead: Either you have always existed, or you came into existence at some time in the past(possibly before the life you are living now). The latter seems reasonable, so lets look at that. Now at one time you did not exist, and now you do. What this means is that there was a particular configuration of matter and energy that made you a unique being(personality), perhaps your conciousness emerges from your DNA somehow, or is a division of this godforce i mentioned, or whatever. The point is that at one time you did not exist and now you do, so over an infinite amount of time, after you die. The same set of circumstances that arouse to make you what you are now, could arise again. Also, when you are dead, time ceases to exist, so being dead for 100 billion years and then being re-born would seem instantaneous.

So anyways, aside from the godforce. The purpose of any life, whether it be after death or not, to me, would be to experience. In this reality, as sentient beings we experience through are 5 senses, and i suppose other experience such as feelings.
0 Replies
 
Alan McDougall
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jun, 2009 08:44 pm
@Extra Gravy,
Extra Gravy;68546 wrote:
The concept of life after death is not founded on verifiable information. It does not have its origin in first hand reports or observable data achieving anything close to adequate scientific veracity. Resist the temptation to quote your holy book, cultures much older than yours have also held beliefs similar enough to be called life after death. Man has long entertained an idea consisting primarily of continuation after death. We have entertained this idea under the cover of numerous rationales, each replaced after sufficient generations by a new rationale. None of these afterlife rationales represent the folding in of new information, rather they are themselves folded into new religions, co-opted as it were into new cultural expressions.

The original question had me asking these questions:
Why do humans entertain the hope of a life after death? Hope
What are the origins of this peculiar hope in an afterlife? Primordial
What benefits, for society or individuals, promote the maintenance of this belief? People might live more carefully and righteously because they will account to a deity

After more thought I have begun asking these as well:
What does the nature of an afterlife tell us about its adherants? Question makes no sense

What does an afterlife tell us about the needs, and societal stressors of its origin societies? Belief in an afterlife makes accepting death much easier



My responses in blue

Alan
hue-man
 
  1  
Reply Fri 12 Jun, 2009 09:28 pm
@William,
William;68645 wrote:
Hello Hue,
I am curious why you think it was sarcastic? It seemed like genuine to me?

William


Because he put big smiling faces everywhere.
0 Replies
 
Extra Gravy
 
  1  
Reply Sat 13 Jun, 2009 08:52 am
@Alan McDougall,
Thanks for responding Alan :-)

Quote:
Q1: What benefits, for society or individuals, promote the maintenance of this belief?
A1: People might live more carefully and righteously because they will account to a deity

I can definitely see that. I could see the "carefully" as a benefit to the individual and "righteously" as a benefit to the society.

Quote:
Q2: What does the nature of an afterlife tell us about its adherants?
A2: Question makes no sense

I was just thinking that many different societies have formed notions of the afterlife and that there is some variety in what they came up with, which led me to wonder if there was some difference in the people originating the afterlife conceptions that could account for the differences in their ideas about the afterlife. Did that help the question make more sense?

Quote:
Q3: What does an afterlife tell us about the needs, and societal stressors of its origin societies?
A3: Belief in an afterlife makes accepting death much easier

I can definitely agree that modern, esp. Christian, conceptions of the afterlife could provide some comfort when contemplating death, but what about ancient Greek notions of the afterlife? They did not make it sound appealing at all.

The Norse and Muslim conceptions of the afterlife give a prime place to those dying in combat. That may speak to the stress that those societies were under as well as giving motivation and comfort to those engaged in battle...
Alan McDougall
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Jun, 2009 08:17 am
@Extra Gravy,
Extra Gravy;68777 wrote:
Thanks for responding Alan :-)


I can definitely see that. I could see the "carefully" as a benefit to the individual and "righteously" as a benefit to the society.


I was just thinking that many different societies have formed notions of the afterlife and that there is some variety in what they came up with, which led me to wonder if there was some difference in the people originating the afterlife conceptions that could account for the differences in their ideas about the afterlife. Did that help the question make more sense?


I can definitely agree that modern, esp. Christian, conceptions of the afterlife could provide some comfort when contemplating death, but what about ancient Greek notions of the afterlife? They did not make it sound appealing at all.

The Norse and Muslim conceptions of the afterlife give a prime place to those dying in combat. That may speak to the stress that those societies were under as well as giving motivation and comfort to those engaged in battle...


Thank for the nice response I said knowing there is an afterlife might make one more acceptable to death , that if if you are going to end up in heaven, but what about a really evil person like Hitler, if I were him I would be unspeakably terrified to die, where is he know his soul I mean hell??

Check out my website it revolves around much of this, note I am in the process of building it and hope to put all my work onto it soon

http://christianmystersim.yolasite.com/

Peace from Alan
0 Replies
 
Khethil
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Jun, 2009 09:49 am
@aussie mark,
In my opinion: Life after Death, the concept, is humankind's response to trying to reconcile in its self-aware, sapient consciousness, the knowledge of its own end. I believe its the very same horror many lifeforms have instinctively. The only difference, is that we're aware of it through our intellect.

Another way to say it is simple: A charming possibility that helps quell the fear of nothingness.
xris
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Jun, 2009 10:05 am
@Khethil,
Khethil;69114 wrote:
In my opinion: Life after Death, the concept, is humankind's response to trying to reconcile in its self-aware, sapient consciousness, the knowledge of its own end. I believe its the very same horror many lifeforms have instinctively. The only difference, is that we're aware of it through our intellect.

Another way to say it is simple: A charming possibility that helps quell the fear of nothingness.
Khethil,it may be problem for certain people the thought of that enormous void of death, but for me even though i can and do prescribe to its possibility,i dont fear the possibility of that nothingness.I think many see my belief in the possibility as a security blanket,wishful thinking but not in least.It is either the final adventure or oblivion, either way I wont be disappointed.
Khethil
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Jun, 2009 10:13 am
@xris,
xris;69126 wrote:
Khethil,it may be problem for certain people the thought of that enormous void of death, but for me even though i can and do prescribe to its possibility,i dont fear the possibility of that nothingness.I think many see my belief in the possibility as a security blanket,wishful thinking but not in least.It is either the final adventure or oblivion, either way I wont be disappointed.


Yea, on a personal level I'm with ya.

Assuming such a thing doesn't exist (and I've no reason to believe it does), then I was trying to come up with a "Where'd this idea come from?"-answer. Such was my musing...

Cheers
xris
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Jun, 2009 10:19 am
@Khethil,
Khethil;69133 wrote:
Yea, on a personal level I'm with ya.

Assuming such a thing doesn't exist (and I've no reason to believe it does), then I was trying to come up with a "Where'd this idea come from?"-answer. Such was my musing...

Cheers
It does not always come from the need for salvation as many suggest with their smug comments.Experiences may drive the need to know.
Khethil
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Jun, 2009 01:05 pm
@xris,
xris;69136 wrote:
It does not always come from the need for salvation as many suggest with their smug comments.Experiences may drive the need to know.


Sure, I could see that possibility. Like near-death experiences? That kind of thing?

Thanks
xris
 
  1  
Reply Sun 14 Jun, 2009 01:37 pm
@Khethil,
Khethil;69180 wrote:
Sure, I could see that possibility. Like near-death experiences? That kind of thing?

Thanks
Mentioning, that does not suppose that is the experience.I sense a reticence to involve your views and by the partial replies a certain annoyance that you should even consider being involved in such a subject.You appear worn out by the fatigue of debate.If im wrong i applogise but there appears a certain sarcasm in your replies.Thanks xris...
 

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