The INS in action

Yes it is obvious. It is because millions of Americans want them here.

Keep in mind, au, if the documents look real, that's as far as the employer is required and permitted to go.

Brown
Millions of Americans want them here. Can you substantiate that. Our is just a figment of your imagination.

ebrown-p
I want them here, but legally. What's wrong with that? Yeah, yeah, yeah, reality is that not as many could be here, but for the reasons I stated above, it is to the advantage of the employers that they come, not the millions of Americans you claim want them here. Millions of illegals work in substandard conditions for less than mandated federal minimum wage, do you want that? Do those millions want that? And please, don't tell me that the corporations would have to raise prices on goods and services if they paid their workers, especially the illegals, what they ought to, all they would have to do in most companies is reduce the amount of compensation for the top 2% of management by 10% to pay for the differences. (Top executives in the US make about 260 -320 TIMES what their lowest employees earn. If you look at the math, one weeks pay at the 320 level would pay minimum wages for a year to 6 workers.)
A whole years income per day for the one at the top. And he gets to have that because there is no shortage of low grade workers..... but not because millions want them to be here, he and his brother and sister CFO's want them here.
Do CFO's work hard and earn their money, yes they do. Do they have any sense of fairness when it comes to compensation? What's that ? My cellphone is breaking up!!!! Hello?! Hello?? nmnmnmnmmmnnnnnn

I am visualizing thousands of workers in Latin America filling out paper work, standing in line to get if filed, and waiting for approval of work visa for the United States - watching thousands of others illegally jumping to the head of the line and, who knows, eventually being granted some sort of amnesty. They are stealing years of time from the legals.

It seems that our immigration policy is designed to reward criminality.

Obviously

Many Mexicans and Mexican Americans do not feel that illegal immigration is immoral or illegal in any sense. In fact most of them considers themselves "Reconquistadores" Reconqueror. For them California and some part of the Southwest belongs to Mexico stolen away by the United States. They are simply getting back what belongs to them in the first place.

And that's another part of the problem. Joe

Ricardo_Tizon
That being the case they should all be considered subversives or invaders from another nation and expelled or tried for treason.

JN, i understand the scams you refer to--but in Ohio, if you don't report your new hires, and your payroll taxes show employees whom you haven't reported, an invesigator shows up in person. The Department of Job and Family Services, who collect the unemployment tax, require names and social security numbers for all employees. Dept of Taxation reports payroll taxes, sales tax receipts, corporate income tax, all such revenues, to the agency which requires new hire reporting. They collect data from DJFS as well, and they collate.

When the program was first instituted, ironically, the first fraud they caught was at the Bureau of Workers' Compensation. This resulted in a clean-up there which had wildly unforeseen consequences. For the last six years, until the last reporting period, we got a 75% (no typo, think: three quarters) discount on our BWC premiums--which gives you an idea of the kind of corruption which was uncovered when the new hire program discovered payroll padding at a state agency. Entire businesses shut down and moved out of state, as a result of visits from the new hire folks. They caught literally thousands of child support dead-beats, and tens of thousands of undocumented workers. I really think it is unrealistic to expect INS, with its paltry resources, to accomplish this task. But any state government who will coordinate its agencies which collect ordinary, legitimate data on employment and taxation, could probably shake quite a few lice out of the carpet. I don't contend there are no undocumented workers in Ohio--but companies which wish to do business on a regular basis here avoid them like the plague--it's not worth the fines and it's not worth having franchises shut down (the state shut down a 16-store McDonalds franchise operating in Columbus, the state capital, just because they hadn't reported new hires, and had child support dead beats working for them--the previous owners sold the franchise, since two months of closed doors had nearly ruined them).

"Illegals" continue to work in the U.S. because its profitable for many people who have friends in government. I have little doubt that the resources of state governments are sufficient to largely eradicate the problem, but there's not only no incentive, there are many good reasons for them to look the other way.

Illegals
I would like to add further colour, sorry color, to this discussion. As a UK resident, I visited Florida many times and decided to purchase a vaction home there which I rent out, mostly to other Brits.

A conservative estimate of the dollars that we (and our guests) generate, in taxes, spending etc. into the US (Florida) economy is about
$250,000 -$300,000 per year.

Small beer perhaps. But there are 13,000 rental homes in central Florida alone, mostly owned by Brits. Doing the math, that is around $400,000,000 per year going into the US (Florida) economy.

So you might think that the US (INS) would be happy to allow me and my family to emigrate to the US, or at least to 'winter' there when we retire?

After all, we are both professionals, would not be a burden on your welfare or healthcare system, have skills which could see us both in full time employment, and probably set up a business emplying US citizens, have no criminal records, pay our US taxes (even though we don't reside there) and come from a 'friendly' country with a so called 'special relationship' with the US.

Well the simple answer is...absolutely not. As a Brit, I am not even allowed to apply in the Green Card Lottery, let alone apply for a green card to work on my own merits and skills.

Perhaps I should come over illegally with my family and get a job at Walmart!

Billy sasterd
Your problem is that you speak english. No habla Ingles aqui.

Setanta: Thank you for your, as usual, fine answer. I'm glad that Ohio is working hard at this. Here, in New York City, the abuse goes on. Warehouses full of packers go 'unnoticed' because the workers are paid in cash at the end of each day and the wholesale purchases are made in cash, except for a cover crew and enough sales receipts to make it look like you are doing some business, it is all cash.

The workers think they are getting a deal, it's cash, baby and no taxes! Yeah. but also no worker's compensation if they get hurt and if they live long enough no social security check.

But try telling that to a 22 year old Chicano kid whose best talent is loading fish into a truck.
==
Welcome Billy!
My wife and I are friends with a couple like yourselves, British, semi-retired (they are both former police detective and great fun) but they stay in Florida about six months a year and then return to England. We'll see them this Christmas and I'll ask how they do it..

Joe

Ebrown, I'm with you on this. Well stated argument. If I had a hat, I'd tip it to you.


By the way, they waited until AFTER their workshift was over to arrest them. OUCH. Thats just plain f*cked up.

Si Senior!!!

22 year old Chicano kids? You're talking about US citizens being paid cash with no workers comp. or social security, not illegal aliens, right Joe?

Invading another country to take their oil!

Both. Who knows? Everyone is a citizen if you ask them. It's just show up here, we pick you up, you work, we pay you, we drop you off. ok.

==
Wilso funny







Joe

The Chicano kid is more than likely an undocumented alien.