Racial stereotypes

I dont care if something is a stereotype or not, I care about truth. So when I deal in stereotypes, I'm talking truth!

Liar. I said directly that the degree of truth in stereotype must be determined. Being a stereotype is neither here nor there

I didn't say it, Hawk, you did.

hawkeye 10-- It is a matter of culture. I have read reports from teachers in the inner city schools in Chicago many years ago who have noted that the black children they taught in the twenties and thirties of the last century were much more amenable to learning and better behaved than the black children of today.

What happened? There is a vast literature:

l. Poorer Blacks from the deep south came up to work in the North -World War II era.

2. Welfare and unmarried mothers proliferated wildly in the sixties, seventies, eighties and nineties, when black leaders, looking for their share of the pie began the mantras which said--"black is beautiful"( and it is); Blacks do not have to go to school with whites( and they don't) black children should learn more about Black History and BlackPride ( and they should) .

3. Bill Cosby speaks about Black boys in the ghetto who are fond of telling others -_Why do you want to be like whites and study those books?
The Anti-Intellectualism of the ghetto is all pervasive.

firefly wrote:


MASSAGAT, I don't have to rely on tv news, as you apparently do, for all my information about what people think or how they behave. I actually interact with the people who live in poor black neighborhoods--I know first hand what the problems are and how the residents perceive and deal with them. It's one thing to view these things on tv, from a comfortable, detached distance, and quite another thing to actually confront the harsh reality of people's lives and to listen to what they have to say. I find little of the apathy or denial, or externalization of blame, which is apparently all you have gleaned from your tv set.
And, when I speak with the black professionals and college professors I also know, some of whom grew up in such blighted neighborhoods, it is clear that the problems are quite complex, as are the possible solutions. Things should only be as overly simplified as you and Hawkeye are trying to make them out to be, but they aren't, because real life just isn't like that. Turn off your tv and go out into the real world and find that out.
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Black Professionals? How many do you know? Be specific? Do you know that there are very few Blacks who have PHD's in the Sciences? Do you know that Asians are heavily overrepresented by PHD's in the Sciences? Why do you think that is? Culture, firefly. the black culture--the "victim" culture--the "blame society" culture--

Asians don't do that!

I don't know how old you are but I know much more about the inner city than you will ever learn. When I was twenty one, I worked as a teacher in the inner city. When I was twenty nine, I was a principal of an all black school in the inner city.

The problems are not complex! The problems are rather easy to solve--Change the culture. All blacks have to do is to model themselves on Asians.

Our politicians are also to blame. Politicians, looking for votes and support, created a welfare culture. We crippled people and made them dependent into the first, second, third and fourth generations. In some housing projects, the great grandmother went on welfare years ago and all of her progeny followed the same path!

No apathy? No denial? How many parents in the ghetto buy their children books? How many read to their children? How many give strong support to all of the teachers in the schools?

You are very naive--You should try to teach in an inner city school for more than a couple of years. You would learn a great deal about a people's culture and how a deficient culture can ruin them.

firefly wrote:

Africans have the highest educational attainment rates of any immigrant group in the United States, with higher levels of completion than the stereotyped Asian American model minority.Estimates indicate that a significant percentage of black students at elite universities are African or the children of African immigrants, a notable example of this is Barack Obama.
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You proved my case, firefly. Black skin does not disempower black people. A culture which is destructive does.

When a study was made of Harlem in New York, it was found that MOST of the black shopkeepers in Harlem were from Jamaica--Had gone to school in Jamaica.
These blacks were educated in schools that had the British imprint on them.

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EXACTLY! It is a problem in black culture, not a problem caused by abuse of the blacks by the rest of us. But the blacks refuse to talk about it, refuse to deal with it, they put their heads in the sand and then get Irrate when whites try to point this **** out.

That is why I say "**** them", when they care enough to want to fix things Ill make time, till then there are more than enough people who actually want to help themselves.

Here is what Professor Henry Louis Gates( Chairman of the Department of African-American Studies at HARVARD had to say about immigrant blacks who beat out American Blacks.


quote
"This is about the kids of recent arrivals beating out the black indigenous middle-class kids," said Professor Gates, who plans to assemble a study group on the subject. "We need to learn what the immigrants' kids have so we can bottle it and sell it, because many members of the African-American community, particularly among the chronically poor, have lost that sense of purpose and values which produced our generation.

end of quote

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Note-firefly-HAVE LOST THAT SENSE OF PURPOSE AND VALUES WHICH PRODUCED OUR GENERATION.

Their CULTURE is deficient!!!

Hawkeye wrote:
about Koreans and recent Asian immigrants:

They had three things the blacks don't have, the willingness to work hard, they have kept their families strong, and they make sure that their kids take advantage of every education opportunity available. Until the Asians got far enough ahead to get out they where in the very same horrible schools that the blacks are, however unlike the blacks, the Asian kids did not let that stop them....they learned outside of school if they had to. The blacks need to stop complaining, look around at those who do it better than they do, and learn something. None of the key ingredients of success are being kept from them.

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Percisely!

Gargamel wrote:

And now, a preemptive Shut the **** Up for Massagat
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It is apparent that gargamel has learned some of the key elements of the dysfunctional Black culture in the USA.

Let's take a look at SAT scores. in 2009!

Bob Schaeffer, spokesman for the National Center for Fair & Open Testing, a critic of standardized tests, says that what stands out to him "is widening gaps of all sorts " race, gender and income " at a time when the nation is spending billions of dollars allegedly trying to close those gaps. The promise of No Child Left Behind and of many high-stakes state testing programs is that testing is going to improve educational quality. That's not what the data show."

The differences in total SAT scores by ethnicity was most extreme between Asian students (who had an average total score of 1623 out of a possible 2400) and black students (who averaged 1276, a four-point drop). Puerto Rican students averaged 1345. The national average was 1509. Top score is 800 in each of the three SAT sections.

Total scores also dropped two points for white students (who averaged 1581) and Mexican and Mexican American students (who averaged 1362). They increased two points for American Indian or Alaskan natives (average score 1448).
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I am so happy to learn that Gargamel tutors black children and that some of them are "crazy smart". Those "crazy smart" students obviously will help raise the depressingly low SAT scores for blacks!

It is significant that Asians scored 41 points higher than whites. Why? Culture! hard work, determination, pride and will to succeed.

the sad/scary thing is that this dysfunction has spread the the wider society. We keep battling this here at a2k for instance. With blacks it is "you are not part of my family clan, so you have no right to speak to me" and here it is "you are not part of my political clan, so you have no right so speak at all".

That's OK, hawkeye. There are some people on these threads who note the reactions of such persons. Those reactions affect their crediblity immensly!

THat is one of the things I like most about a2k...IE that the thugs have not won yet here. We are a oasis of sorts, a place of liberty in a world were little liberty remains, except behind closed doors between people who trust each other enough to be honest.

You mean telling racist old bitches to shut the **** up? Then call me Nat Turner.

The truth is that your lazy point of view is simply an easy way of arguing against any kind of significant social or governmental effort--which might require the smallest contribution, monetarily or otherwise, on your part-- to improve the standard of living for impoverished black people. I would say for impoverished people in general, but it's clear you just don't like blacks. As a racist people do, you suggest there is something in the fabric of black people that prevents them from "bootstrapping," another favorite term among assholes. Here's your problem: when you say "black people," you don't have a specific person in mind. At best, you imagine a montage of forensic sketches from the local news. I can give you names. I see faces. Which is why I'm so pissed off.

As for picking a "small" topic to deconstruct. That would be possible if you actually provided a detailed, nuanced argument. But stereotypes and sweeping generalizations, like yours, lack such details by definition.

You know that "Close/Open BBCode Editor" you asked about, Massagat. You can use it to put quotes around material you want to mark as quoted.

Instead of "firefly wrote",




...

Which part of Gargamel's statement do you suggest is a key element of the dysfunctional Black culture in the USA?

What Bullshit, I am not presenting an argument, I am painting a picture with words which describes what the lay of the land looks like to me. If you see something different then speak up, tell me what looks wrong to you. We could then see who can come up with the most facts or corroborating opinions. Who ever gets the most wins.

why is this a problem? This is not about individuals, it is about systemic problems and culture. You can not even begin to see and analyze systemic problems or culture when you focus your vision on individuals, this is called not being able to see the Forrest for the trees.

Until you learn the difference between collage debate and conversation, and until you learn some basics about how to come to a personal understanding about what the culture is and where it has gone wrong, talking to you is useless in expanding the understanding of where blacks have gone wrong. You are not prepared to participate.