My husband denies an emotional affair.

We didn't have any agreement not to bring it up but he never talked about it with me. that is the one thing that he could use to say that a divorce is justified. but according to our faith reconciliation is always the best way. i was very remorseful for what i had done and i have never done anything like that ever again. if he told me he had forgiven me and still wanted to be my husband then i don't see how it makes sense to go back on that word 7 years later. it's not fair. i know that it hurt him and that there has been a lot of fights and disrespect towards him on my part, but i still want my marriage to be saved. i want him to acknowledge his feelings about the past but to not take it to the extent of breaking up our family. what he is doing right now is wrong. no matter what i've done in the past it does not excuse his behavior. this is what is making me feel hopeless. i know that marriages can overcome ANYTHING because i've seen so many overcome things that are worse than this. i just wish he really wanted to be my husband and didn't have this "friendship". using my past against me seems to be his angle with this whole thing. i just really want reconciliation. i want to move forward together and to live in truth and raise our kids together. i don't think divorce is the answer in our case. i really don't. and i know that our marriage is valid. it is nonsense for him to say it might not be. so i don't know. i don't want to make his heart harder towards me i want to soften it. but it seems that will mean i will have to take his abuse for now. which doesn't seem very fair. but life isn't fair i guess. maybe i'm just a fool. maybe i do deserve for my marriage to be wrecked to hell and never to be restored. atleast, that is how he makes me feel.

Of course your marriage was valid, unless you were forced into it. You are being taken for a ride.

Hello Tinkerbell,
it's unfortunate that you have to endure such emotional turmoil while you're
pregnant and need much more support than you're getting right now from your husband. He is trying to justify his "girlfriend" through manipulating
God's words in his favor and blaming you for things that have happened prior to your marriage and for an ONS that was long forgiven.

Him bringing up all these things and intimidating you, should buy himself a guilt free relationship with another woman.

You certainly can sit that one out and hope for your husband to end his relationship with the other woman, or you can be proactive, don't accept
the way he treats you and go back to your family until your baby is born
and you're in better emotional shape to address the problems of your
marriage.

so in the last 6 months you two have been through 1) a job change 2) a prolonged separation 3) a pregnancy and a baby is due in two months.....that is a lot of marriage strain.

Best thing to do right now is to figure out where to park this marriage for a spell, so as the deal with the birth and to give you both time to figure this out. See if you to can reach an agreement for the next six months that you both can live with, a cooling off period if you will. I suspect that you cant do a divorce for awhile anyway, given that you have just now changed residency.

Just wanted to ask you all that replied to me if you think that there is a very good chance he is having sex with this woman? Many people have told me that he most likely is. He denies it. I know he's never done anything like this before, being so close to a woman and not wanting to give her up. (you all know the reasons he thinks he is justified for this emotional affair-and maybe physical as well.) The fact that he has NEVER done anything like this to me just makes me even more suspicious of him. It's like I can't believe ANYTHING he says. I've already caught him in lies so why should I believe him when he says he hasn't slept with her? Funny thing he told me last night. We share a cell phone right now b/c I haven't set mine up yet. Both of us have ALWAYS had unlimited access to all calls and texts. Now he suddenly keeps the phone on him at all times, unless he needs to charge it. He doesn't want me to leave the house because i ask for the cell phone in case i need it. He doesn't want me to see texts or calls coming through that he usually deletes. I ask him about tihs and he gets all defensive and says that he believes i shouldn't be checking his texts and that he deletes ones that he doesn't want me to see b/c it's none of my business. (you all know that he is saying he doesn' t know if our marriage is "valid" or not and that i don't have authority as his wife) so he says that as long as he is not physically cheating on me then he has a right to only tell me what he feels like telling me about his relationship with this OW. He tells me that there is stuff he won't tell me because it is "none of my business". now, tell me, what does THAT mean? i want your opinion. i already have mine. i just want to know if what i'm thinking is right. please respond!

Tinkerbell,
you have a very unhealthy situation right now: you don't trust your husband
and he keeps secrets from you. The deeper you get into this, the less likely
you get out of it. That's why it would be best if you go to your family and let
them take care of you and your children. This will give the both of you time
to think and reassess what you want out of life and if you both want the same.

To answer your question: there is no such thing as having an emotional affair
for this long. I am pretty certain they also have an intimate relationship.

I agree with CJane re your parents or some other safe harbor. No, not the pastor..

I think, in this whole thing with the woman, that it is nearly irrelevant re whether or not he is having sex with her. He might not be. He very likely is. He has certainly has worked up a whole planet of things against you, throwing arguments like a pile of slippery eels.

You are not the crazy one here. IMO I would feel safer going home and having the baby there with your family to help you and love you. If he decides to put his big boy britches on he can come crawling back to you and and ask forgiveness.

Anything that happened before y'all were married really shouldn't be up for debate. I didn't see in your posts what religious views you have, but frankly if you have done something you feel is sinful and have come to your own terms with it or have taken it to your church and been given forgiveness there, then who the hell is he to fuss over it? The incident that happened after y'all were married should be hands off since you already confessed it to him and he FORGAVE you for it. There are no take backs on forgiveness in most Christian religions. If you want to beat him at his own game just throw that in his face and call him a sinner for lying to you about forgiving you, but that would probably be a bit petty.

The debate about whether your marriage may be invalid in the eye's of God doesn't really matter in the legal arena. The state of Iowa and the state of California most deinitely see your marriage as valid and I would begin looing into the legal means at your disposal.

Does he claim that his children r bastards ?

The moral of the story IS:
DON 'T GO AROUND MAKING DAMAGING ADMISSIONS about yourself.





David, Esq.

About 8 weeks after he started his job he started calling me less and less and was acting very distant.

I thought it was just because we were miles and miles apart. Then when I finally moved out here 8 weeks later I find that he has a lot of text messages from another woman, named "Cat...Then I find that for the past 2 months they called eachother almost 100 times and talked for an hour each night. I ask him how often they talked and he said "once a week". Then i showed him my evidence and he said, "well, i guess I didn't realize how much we actually talked. but we're just friends. ".

He was very caring and called me and emailed me continually up until he started talking to her.

Any decent counselor would ask him why he started calling you less as he started calling this woman more.

Then they would ask why he started to go distant as he talked to this woman more.

They would ask what it is about this woman that lead to him 'suddenly, at this precise point in time' start seeing things differently about your marriage.

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on top of all this he is telling me that he is doubting our relationship
and that he feels our marriage may be "invalid" because i had not told him the truth about something i did in college (drunken sexual act with another guy, but not intercourse) before i was dating him. he says that means our whole relationship started out in deception since i didn't tell him the whole truth about that and that our marriage might not even be valid in God's eyes or in his.

So deception invalidates marriage in the eyes of God? he'll probably say, no, only deception about sex.

He says he owes me nothing because of all the stuff i've done in the past and because he says i was always the selfish one so he doesn't owe me ANYTHING.

Well, he doesn't OWE you anything.

What he does need to consider, is whether or not he wants to contribute to a growing relationship, or not contribute and let the relationship (slowly or otherwise) die

He tells me all about my past sins against him and says that he "suppressed" his feelings over the years

So he's been dishonest with you for years?

Now he's thinking about leaving me but says he hasn't "made up his mind yet".

And those years of dishonesty has lead him to blindside you?

He thinks that God will show him whether or not he is supposed to be with me and expects me to wait around until he gets his "revelation".

He tells me I need to stay here with him and "love" him and "show" him that he has a reason to be here.

You do see how those two statements directly above contradict one another? One he says 'show me and I will', and in the other he says 'it doesn't matter what you show me, if 'God' says for me to leave, I will'

That is a no win situation for you. It's also very manipulative.

He says it will be over and hell to pay if I leave.

Here he says 'it doesn't matter what God ends up saying to me, you leave and I'll put you through hell' (which of course, isn't Christian at all)

He has made me feel like absolute CRAP and has made me feel very crazy.

Do you feel it's okay for him to break his vows about loving you, because you broke yours? Is that how it works 'my bad behaviour justifies your bad behaviour? And your bad behaviour justifies mine?
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In the mean time he continually texts with "Cat" and they get together just to "talk". He says that he cares about her, loves her as a "friend", and that there is nothing I can do about it.

He said maybe if I do what i'm supposed to do to get closer to him then "maybe" this other woman will just go away.

These two above statements directly contridict each other. In the first he says 'she's my friend and nothing you do will change my friendship with her', and in the next he says 'if you love me like I want you to, I'll leave her"

That is a no win proposition for you

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I really don't want a divorce. I guess I'm just trying right now to get all the evidence I can against him-hard proof so he can't deny it- and then I'll go from there.

In this paragraph you directly contradict yourself. You say you don't want a divorce, but you are actively working towards one. What do you think will be the outcome of gaining your 'proof'? There's little point in going in this direction if you don't see where it's heading. He may engage is self deception, but so do you here.

If he is truly sorry and realizes what he has done I MIGHT give him a 2nd chance.

Seriously? After he says 'hang around for me until I decide whether you're worthy to be my wife any more. I won't make any effort, but I demand you do, and hey, even if you do, I'm reckoning God will tell me otherwise, but it'll be fun to see you grovel about how much you love me, and how worthy I am.

You need to get help from a marriage councilor not a pastor. Your husband may be just friends with her. Ask him if you can all go out for dinner and you can meet her. If he says no or hesitates, then you have a problem. I had a friend of the opposite sex for many years. My husband asked who he was and I arranged for them to meet. We all became friends. He even moved in when he got sick (and died). I was wild when I was young and my husband was not. He knows all and we have been married 34 yrs and I love him still. What did your husband do before he got married? Your married is valid. You have children. God has united you both. Ask him THE question and you will get your answer.

Sorry I can't spell. See a counselor not a pastor. Don't leave yet. He can say you abandon him in court (my dad tried this). It's hard, but sometimes you have to wait it out for a little bit. I don't understand why he wants you to stay (even for the kids) if he wants to have an affair. You DO NOT LEAVE. If it is him, he should leave you.

Things to consider...
If your husband doesn't "Feel" your marriage is valid now, then why do the attorney, judge, & court system? Key word-Child support

That's true - there's no reason at all to hide a friend.

Thank you for your input. I understand what you are saying. I really do not want a divorce. I want him to wake up and realize that what he's doing isn't worth losing his wife and children over. He just seems to not care at all about what the consequences are. What would you suggest I do? Should I leave? I really do want to reconcile with him. I want our marriage more than anything. I really do. I thought if I got the proof then I could back him into a corner where all he could do was be honest with me. that's all I'm asking for. I told him I would forgive him if he could just be honest and make a change and actually fight for our marriage. I am willing to do that. I just need him to break down his pride and just tell me the truth. He's angry with me right now because I told him I want him to take a polygraph test and I told him taht the tester told me that it is obvious he wants a sexual relationship with this woman and that the test is only to see if he's already started that or not. now he's mad at me for demanding an answer from him about what he's really doing. does he want her or me. he says it's ridiculous. i told him i'd call cat and ask her and now he's saying i'm manipulating him. and he got real defensive when i said i was going to use software to retrieve all of their texts. he was real mad about that so i told him well, you wouldn't be so mad if there was ntohing to hide. i just want TRUTH. he is real good at using everything i did against me and saying that this now justifies him thinking that our marriage is not even valid. this is warped and twisted thinking on his part. this whole situation is absurd. we just need to work on our actual marriage issues. he says to forget about cat and that we need to work on OUR relationship. well, how the hell am i supposed to do that while he's out with her when he wants to be and he's at work with her all the time? how does that help me to be stable and to feel secure? oh that's right, it doesn't. but he thinks that i have no right to set boundaries. he claims i have manipulated him so much over the years that now he is done with it and he can do whatever the heck he wants to do. he is being an arrogant prick.

do nothing until and unless he either decides that he wants to work on the marriage, or else files for divorce. If he does neither over a reasonable period of time them you should file for divorce.

Talking and thinking about how the marriage can be fixed is pointless at this time.

Hi Tinkerbell,

It’s sad to hear the path your husband is taking.

What do you do if he doesn’t care about the consequences? That’s a truly difficult thing. When police deal with imminently suicidal people (say someone about to jump off a building or bridge), they are taught not to talk about ways to help the person...because the problem is all the persons coping mechanisms have already failed " they’ve tried everything they can to cope, and it all failed. What police are taught to talk about, is the consequences of that suicidal person committing suicide...the affects on : family (they may hate their family), their pets, the police in front of them, the people who have to clean his/her body up, their friends etc etc. If they don’t care about those consequences any more....

Even though you believe marriage is more important than anything, tThere are a few things more important I should think :

-Do you want your marriage more than your self-respect?

- what about personal happiness " are you prepared to sacrifice a lifetime of it for a marriage with an abusive husband (and make no mistake, that is exactly what he’s doing to you)? One of the side-effects of living in an abusive relationship, is your loss of self respect (see above), self esteem, and therefore, personal happiness.

-Do you want your children to be exposed to an unloving marriage...growing up believing that your relationship is normal? How they form their relationships, and treat their partners will in large degree be based on their primary relationship model " you and your husbands.

As for obtaining proof so that you could back him into a corner where all he could do was be honest with you. There’s a very intelligent pedophile on this forum, who occasionally posts under the philosophy section, attempting to justify his sexual inclination. Many raise arguments against it, and guess what " he still manages to justify himself in a way that sounds reasonable to him...and is quite articulate to others. I posted a number of times to people writing into his thread ‘it doesn’t matter what you say, he will find a way to justify it to himself’...and it’s true...people manage to justify their behaviour in a way that is perfectly reasonable to them.

And as for wanting him to give up his pride and be honest with you...Telling you the truth has nothing to do with it " he cannot tell himself the truth " see above. This is why I originally said ‘it’s sad that your husband has gone down this path’

The polygraph " that’s understandable thing to ask. Why don’t you offer him a compromise " you take the test with questions I want to ask you, and I take the test with question you want to ask me.

He said that you calling cat and asking her is you manipulating him? This is really troubling, because there is no manipulation present in such a thing. If this is an accurate account of how it’s brought up, that that comment I find disturbing.

You can buy text readers off ebay I've heard. I believe it’s an actual piece of hardware, though I’ve never seen one.

You already know the truth, you just haven’t heard it with your own ears, or seen it with your own eyes.

Regarding his continual statement that your marriage isn’t valid - you must realise how disturbing this is, because where does it place your kids in his heart? What does it mean for them? Does he not want to be their father anymore?

By the way - I find your husbands behaviour rather disturbing overall. It doesn't seem quite sound of mind. It appears wrapped up in warped religious beliefs (which is often a sign of mental illness...mild or otherwise). His logic faculty doesn't seem to be functioning quite properly. His treatment of the marriage, you, and because of his 'arguments' by extension the kids, seems...odd. His insistence of the 'invalid in the eyes of God because you deceived me' argument, despite his years of deception, and ongoing deception, is nonsensical.

As a last note - this is all of course, from what you've posted. Often the 2nd party perspective changes such views, but it is disturbing as presented.

no he won't say they are bastards but he doesn't believe that he necessarily has to be with me just cuz he has kids with me. he believes children are a blessing but i guess he thinks that if he doesn't want to be with me then it's just going to be fine and dandy. maybe he doesn't realize he'll NEVER see his kids if he leaves me and runs off with this woman. i will move back to iowa to be with my family and i will take him for all he has. he wouldn't move to iowa to be with his kids. if it comes to that i know he wouldn't. he would be a full out devil to me at that point and i would be done with his ass.

yeah, i know. i wish i could go back and just not tell him about that stupid thing from college. but the thing is, even if i never would have told hima bout that,.....would this still be happening? i just can't believe that this is MY fault. ya know? it doesn't matter what i've done or said in the past. that doesn't mean it's okay for him to do this and to lie to me. i think he would have done this regardless. at some point this would have happened. he gives himself away when he is always talking about how i was manipulative and controlling during our relationship. he claims i controlled him throughout our ENTIRE relationship and not as much now. it is absurd. i know that i was manipulative at times and i tried to control him at times, but it was not ALL the time. so i guess he feels that he needs to run off and have whatever type of affair this is that he is having just so he can feel like i'm not "controlling" him. it is freaking absurd and not at all of GOD. this WOMAN is the problem and his irrational FEELINGS are GOD to him. he can't even see straight. he "doubts" everything about our relationship as he so lovingly put. i wonder why? well let me guess...it's b/c of this woman and i think he met her and started liking her and thought, damn...if only i had met her before i met my shitty wife. then i would be happy. my wife is just a piece of **** who lied to me and cheated on me (one night stand....drunken....never happened again....he forgave me....) and tried to control me all these years. maybe i never really should have been with her. hell, maybe God never saw our marriage as valid so therefore i don't really have to honor my vows. wow, but this woman is so amazing...she understands me and fills my emotional needs. she is wonderful and my wife sucks. all he can see right now is everything BAD to do with me and our relationship. i say this is because of this stupid woman he is coddling like a little precious baby doll. it makes me sick. he wno't tell me things about her and what they talk about b/c he says i don't deserve to know since i have no "authority" as his wife right now. and yet he tells her countless things about me (most likely) and hides their little texts and emails. yet tells me that she's just a friend and that there are no prospects of them being together if he ends up leaving me. HAHA. what the hell? and he also tells me to not worry, he doesn't want a divorce and he isn't even thinkinga bout that. well, i wonder why? is it because he is having his cake and eating it too? will he choose me or her.....i told him i will stay until i have the baby and if by that time he has gotten closer to her and has chosen her then i will be on the first flight the eff out of here with all 3 of our sons. how about that. he better man up in the next 7 weeks or it is done. not divorce, no. i won't do that. but i will leave him to sit in his own pile of **** if he doesn't snap back to reality and get out of his relationship with this addiction...this woman. and you know what. i KNOW that SHE is not BETTER than ME. I am still a woman of God and HE validates me. not my husband. and this is his problem. not mine. i'm not the sick one right now. it is him. i made my mistakes and i was REMORSEFUL. something he is yet to be. i have always loved him and i will continue to do so. being loving to him right now makes me want to hurl but i know that i am doing the right thing. i can't make good on leaving right now. i'm not strong enough yet. i'm waiting.......