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'Ax Men' Star's Daughter Killed By Dog

 
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Mar, 2010 07:02 pm
It's not just the human cubs either . . . i can picture poor, long-suffering but patient Brutus lying on the living room carpet with kittens crawling all over him, chewing on his tail, hanging from his ears by their teeth . . .
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Mar, 2010 08:14 pm
@Ionus,
I am lying about being a US citizen living in south florida?

How interesting!
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Mar, 2010 08:18 pm
@Ionus,
Dogs are dogs and people are people so I am not sure what you are driving at.

We do have a very longs history with the wolf/dog and if new theories are correct dogs was a key element in our evolving into humans.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Mar, 2010 08:23 pm
@mismi,
I had to laugh as that was the case with one of my step grandson who at four was found to be mistreating two puppies his mother had purchase at great cost and then needed for their welfare to give away to a new home with older children.
Intrepid
 
  2  
Reply Wed 3 Mar, 2010 08:42 pm
@BillRM,
BillRM wrote:

I had to laugh as that was the case with one of my step grandson who at four was found to be mistreating two puppies his mother had purchase at great cost and then needed for their welfare to give away to a new home with older children.


You have, unwittingly, finally agreed with what people were trying to tell you about not leaving young children alone with animals.
Seed
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Mar, 2010 08:44 pm
@Intrepid,
Quote:
Children should also be 'trained' on how to act around animals.


That has a lot of wisdom in it.
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  4  
Reply Wed 3 Mar, 2010 10:08 pm
@Ionus,
Ionus wrote:

Men tend to have big dogs because it makes them feel a better protector. Women tend to have small dogs because it makes them feel a better carer. I have yet to meet someone who doesnt say stupid things like "my dog wouldnt do that..."
uh, oh...
Meet Drago! 3.5 pounds of pure pain!
http://img122.imageshack.us/img122/3439/drago3xy9.jpg
Green Witch
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Mar, 2010 10:20 pm
@OCCOM BILL,
I've had large dogs most of my life, my husband prefers mid-sized. I always say large dogs appeal to my inner dominitrix. My husband sometimes treats his smaller canines like throat ripping Cujos and they look at him with a mix of exasperation and pity as they wag their tails at all intruders . The worst thing my (long gone) 135lb Rottie ever did was pee on a perspective boyfriend's leg. The dog was better judge of character than I was in that particular case. Doesn't Robert G. have a little Maltese?
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  1  
Reply Wed 3 Mar, 2010 10:59 pm
@Intrepid,
Quote:
You have, unwittingly, finally agreed with what people were trying to tell you about not leaving young children alone with animals.


In this case it was for the protection of the two dogs so I do not think that help your case that dogs are a grest risk to children wellbeing.
0 Replies
 
Robert Gentel
 
  3  
Reply Wed 3 Mar, 2010 11:01 pm
@Green Witch,
Green Witch wrote:
Small children and dogs have to be supervised.



Children need to be supervised, full stop.

I agree with the gist of your post, but you can subtract the dog from each of the situations and the child still should have been supervised (e.g. you could have fallen into the pool sans dog).
Robert Gentel
 
  3  
Reply Wed 3 Mar, 2010 11:03 pm
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:
The best reason not to leave children unsupervised with dogs is that they are erratic and unprincipled little savages, and it were cruelty to expose one's pets to that.


Amen. Especially for small dogs where the children can seriously injure them. A toddler with a tiny dog is a two-way danger.
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Wed 3 Mar, 2010 11:05 pm
@Ionus,
Ionus I took in my netbook into Denny in the hope of finding out where I am living from you.

What country am I living in as it seem to be south florida but you never can be sure and you seem very sure that is not my real location.

So please tell us all where am I?
0 Replies
 
BillRM
 
  0  
Reply Thu 4 Mar, 2010 12:14 am
@Ionus,
Quote:
Is this why you lie about what country you live in ?


HELP Ionus the battery on my US netbook is running low and I am not even sure if it safe to plug it into an outlet in whatever country I happen to be in.

Where am I Ionus and does this country support 120 60 cycle power supplies?

Lord only 16 percent power remaining help help help...........................
0 Replies
 
Ionus
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Mar, 2010 03:55 am
@OCCOM BILL,
Hello Drago... Shocked ....you wont have any throuble from me, let me assure you.....
0 Replies
 
shewolfnm
 
  2  
Reply Thu 4 Mar, 2010 05:50 am
@Setanta,
Setanta wrote:

The best reason not to leave children unsupervised with dogs is that they are erratic and unprincipled little savages, and it were cruelty to expose one's pets to that.


Its a ha ha funny...

but it needs to be repeated.

Children loosely KNOW they are hurting animals at a certain age.. about 5 I guess.. but before then, they really just go on about their business oblivious to the rest of the world and oblivious to consequences.

Babies who are pulling on everything, biting all they can , sticking their fingers in places they shouldnt WILL hurt a dog. Just like a human, that dogs first response is to make that hurt stop. For some dogs this can be just getting up and walking away, for others especially if they are a bit scared or high strung it may be a nip, or full on bite. If you ever watch dogs in a small pack or around puppies.. when the puppies are old enough to start rough playing a pretty hard nip is what is used to correct them if need be . For a dog, this isnt going to hurt them, for delicate human skin (compared to thick skin with a layer of tough fur) this can mean puncture wounds.

Once a child gets older, some, most,hell I could say ALL kids experiment with being cruel to animals. Not always in the sadistic ways we hear about on tv. But they can do something as simple as throw a rock at a dog, pull its ear too hard, poke at its eye.. or go up the scale, kick it, hit it, scream at it to scare it... or even farther and cause it real pain. that dog , no matter how even tempered will remember that. If it happens often enough they will begin to need to protect themselves.

Why dogs and kids need to be watched is because sparky can not tell on little johnny who tried to put a stick in his butt or little sally who runs at him screaming and tries to hit him. Nor can sparky tell you that the little baby grabbed his tongue so hard he scratched it which scared him....

Its not always just because the dog is a dog that they attack... a lot of times its because kids can be little shits.
mismi
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Mar, 2010 06:07 am
@shewolfnm,
Quote:
but before then, they really just go on about their business oblivious to the rest of the world and oblivious to consequences.


When my niece was young, (my first experience with a kid) she would stay with us. She loved my kitty Levi. One day I was holding him and her in my lap and she looked up at me and smiled and went on to poke Levi in the eye and say "eyeeeeeeeee". Poor kitty. I had no clue. I kept one hand free the next time we tried that.
0 Replies
 
Green Witch
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Mar, 2010 08:13 am
@Robert Gentel,
I was just keeping on topic. I agree children should be supervised so they don't play with matches, pull down tablecloths, eat stuff they find on the floor, put the cat in the dryer, cut their own hair, etc etc. My dogs actually need a lot less supervision than young children I've had in my care. It's also nice you can tie a dog outside when they get in the way, unlike a kid.
boomerang
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Mar, 2010 10:19 am
Interesting follow up in today's paper:

Quote:
Astoria-area mauling death shows how instincts can change dogs from friendly to ferocious
By Lori Tobias, The Oregonian
March 03, 2010, 7:56PM

A tragic event in Clatsop County has many dog owners wondering how a trusted friend suddenly turns into a killer.

Animal behaviorists say it's really no mystery but rather instincts, and virtually every dog has them. But when those predatory behaviors are exhibited by the larger, more powerful breeds, such as Rottweilers or pit bulls, serious injury or even death can occur.

That cruel fact was brought home Sunday to a family in Svensen, near Astoria, when 4-year-old Ashlynn Anderson was mauled to death by one of the family's Rottweilers.

Clatsop County Sheriff Tom Bergin said Ashlynn was playing in the front yard of the family's rural home about 1 p.m. and two Rottweilers were in a separate area divided from Ashlynn by a 4-foot fence.

But when Ashlynn's mother, D'ette Browning, looked out to check on her daughter, she saw the girl on the ground and one of the dogs standing nearby. Ashlynn's stepfather, Jesse Browning, called 9-1-1, and medics responded quickly, Bergin said. But it was too late. A helicopter rushed Ashlynn to OHSU Hospital in Portland, but she was pronounced dead on arrival.

No one may ever know exactly what happened, but animal behaviorists say it is likely something triggered the dog's prey drive. It's the same drive found in all canids, such as foxes and wolves, said Heather Toland, director of the DoveLewis Animal Assisted Therapy and Education Program.

"They scan, they alert, they target, they chase, they grab, they might shake, they kill and they dissect," Toland said. "A 4-year-old child moves and looks a lot like prey, and dogs are first and foremost predators. When a 4-year-old squeals, in delight to us, to the dog that may sound like an injured rabbit, as it's running around flailing its arms and legs."

But it also may have been nothing the child did and any number of triggers in the environment, said Tanya Roberts, Training and Behavior Department manager at the Oregon Humane Society. The dog might have become excited by a squirrel or by the other Rottweiler. It might have simply smelled something or seen someone passing the home.

"It's very, very common," said Roberts. "It's why dogs chase balls, kids on bicycles. It's just something that dogs do.

"We have to respect that it is something they do and put in safety perimeters for children. I don't think it is a good idea to leave young kids and animals in the home unattended. Guards go down; you think everything is fine. You don't know what the environment is going to do. It only takes a second for something to happen."

And when it involves a large, powerful dog, such as a Rottweiler, the ending is potentially tragic.

That's one of the reasons Rottweilers are often labeled as dangerous or aggressive. But in fact, they really are no different from other dogs, said Toland. What can be different, however, is breeding and training.

"I've had a fabulous Rottweiler in my therapy program," she said, but "any dog can be ill bred."

"There is a lot to be said about careful breeding, not breeding for looks but for temperament."

Training from a young age is also key, as is early socialization, adequate exercise and attention.

Dog owners also need to remember that not every dog can be in every situation successfully, said Jacqui Neilson, veterinarian and board-certified veterinary behaviorist.

"All animals come with some risks," Neilson said. "When you know there are certain situations your dog is not good in, you may need to take steps to avoid those situations or manage those situations so he can't put others at risk.

"Some of the nicest dogs I've ever met are Rotties. You can't take a broad brush and paint it. But you do have to be more careful with large breed dogs just because they can inflict more damage."

chai2
 
  0  
Reply Thu 4 Mar, 2010 11:04 am
I keep thinking of something that happened while I was living in Fla.

Rotties are bred to herd. This man was jogging down the street, and 2 Rotties that were somehow not in their yard saw him.

They started after him, tag teamming each other, maneuvering the guy off the street and into a corner in someone's driveway. Can remember how badly he was hurt, but he did survive.

It wasn't like the guy could just stop running. They had their interest and instincts up, and when he tried to stop, they started biting at him, forcing him to move on/flee. With 2 of them, I doubt having pepper gas or something to that effect would have made any difference. I don't know if the man had that or not, it was so long ago.

Of course one could say joggers need to be aware of their environment. However, I don't think it's reasonable to expect someone jogging along, minding their own business, to be prepared for something like this. Otherwise, everyone would just stay locked up in their houses.


******

Just remembering stuff here...

SOMEtimes I think it is a little of "I'm tough, I have this particular type of dog"

There was/is this guy in my neighborhood who had/has 2 Rotties. One day I was taking a brisk walk in my neighbor. and this man and his 2 leashed dogs turned a corner and started walking just as briskly behind me. Like close.

This made me very uncomfortable, so I slowed down so they could pass me.

He slowed down, staying behind me.

I crossed over to the other side of the street on a diagonal.

After a few yard he "let" the dogs drag him over to the other side, behind me.

I glanced back, giving him a look, and crossed back over.

Once again, he "let" the dogs lead him over behind me.

That's when I stopped dead, turned around and point blank said "you see I'm trying to not be right in front of you and those 2 rottweilers. Why do you insist on staying right behind me?"

He hurumphed, but was busted, and moved on.

This woman around the corner has a chow, another breed I'm leery of. We have a strong leash law in our community, but she would always step outside holding a leash, which was not connected to the dog.

Again, walking down the street, seeing her standing off to the side, with the chow now closer to me than her, I stopped. I called out "I'm very uncomfortable having your chow off its leash when I'm trying to go by."

She was like "Big Sigh" and leashed him.

**** you lady, I don't need to test your ability to pull your dog bred to be a watch dog off of me.

You might ask if I'd feel the same if it were a golden retriever. I used to jog before the sun came up, and this one retriever type dog (can't say for sure, it was dark, but it was that type) realized I came by every day at the same time, and would start barking at me. Then, 2 days in a row, it got itself out of it's yard, and what I considered aggressively approached me at a run.

First day I yelled at him, and he backed off, but continued testing me.

He got a sharp rock chucked at his head for his trouble.

AIEEE - YIP YIP yip yip...



Linkat
 
  1  
Reply Thu 4 Mar, 2010 11:25 am
@Intrepid,
One other item to note - this survey does not include dog bites only deaths. I would also want to avoid maiming and even a "small" dog bite.
 

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