Atheism

@spendius,

I think it's ok to look for the truth as long as necessary. If a God prefers a ritual to a person, then what kind of God is it/him/her?

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Quote:

Germlat said: I think it's ok to look for the truth as long as necessary. If a God prefers a ritual to a person, then what kind of God is it/him/her?

Right, some people think baptism automatically gives them the holy spirit, but it ain't so-
"The holy spirit hadn't come upon the Samaritans as they'd simply been baptised" (Acts 8:16)

And the holy spirit can come even WITHOUT being baptised-
"The Caesareans have received the holy spirit, so let's baptise them" (Acts 10:47)

That's why Jesus and others had to remind people not to take baptism too seriously-
Jesus said:- "You're already clean through the word I spoke to you" (John 15:3)
"Jesus saved us by the washing of re-birth" (Titus 3:6)
"Jesus sent me not to baptise, but to preach the gospel" (1 Cor 1:17)

Anyway, TRUE baptism is not with water-
Jesus said "For John baptized with water, but in a few days you will be baptized with the Holy Spirit.” (Acts 1:5)

Like I said earlier, baptism is fine for those who want it to try to strengthen their faith, but there's certainly nothing 'magical' about atoms of H2O.
In fact I once asked a Baptist Minister at an open air meeting whether I'd be going to hell because I haven't been baptised, and he replied with a smile- "No you won't", so full marks to him.. Smile

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@Germlat,

Don't you admire my forbearance for not taking advantage of--

Quote:

Any dictionary clIming accuracy, should have a picture of you next to the word arsehole.

I had a lot of scope don't you think with an invitation of that nature.

I don't believe in God mate. Rituals are human artefacts. They are subject to evolutionary exigencies.

I presume you don't wish to be rid of them all.

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god? The cruelest joke ever played on man. The gulibility is staggering and incredibly sad. What a freakin waste.

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@giujohn,

giujohn wrote:

god? The cruelest joke ever played on man. The gulibility is staggering and incredibly sad. What a freakin waste.

Amen!

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@Wilso,

Wilso wrote:

giujohn wrote:

god? The cruelest joke ever played on man. The gulibility is staggering and incredibly sad. What a freakin waste.

Amen!

So are you and John asserting you know that there are no gods involved in REALITY?

If "yes"...I have the same question for you two that I have for people who assert they know there is a GOD involved in REALITY...

..."How do you know that...or is it just a guess?"

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@giujohn,

Quote:

god? The cruelest joke ever played on man. The gulibility is staggering and incredibly sad. What a freakin waste.

The human race is 2 million years old. Which part of it would you have preferred to exist in if the joke had not been played?

If you have no answer you have nothing to say.

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@spendius,

I hope you don't think I wrote that quote....not my style. I definitely agree about rituals....

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@Germlat,

That's another weakness of religion; why rituals? When anyone gets married, they just say "I do," and that's all that's needed! The relationship lasts through a lifetime by their devotion to each other. They don't need weekly rituals to promise they'll stay married.

Rituals are only required by control freaks.

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@cicerone imposter,

You're defining "married" the way you need to.

In a proper marriage banns are read out three weeks running and the vows, including the unambiguous death escape clause, are pronounced in front of witnesses which guarantees or, at the least, increases the chances of them being kept.

If the vows are not intended to be kept it is a sham.

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Incidentally I've never liked the "til death us do part" bit in the wedding vows.
I mean, a Christian man and wife will NEVER be parted by death, so if I was getting hitched me and my wife would refuse pointblank to say that bit.. Smile

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@spendius,

I would have preferred to live in a time where knowledge wasnt destroyed forever by religious fanatics and in a time where if it were not for religious fanatics we would have had the internet 500 years ago and in all probability would have already cured cancer.
I would have also preferred to live in a time where religious fanatics werent responsible for the death of billions of people.
I would have preferred to live in a time where peoples attitudes torward sex and marriage were not forged by such narrowly provincial tenets. (after all, it's just skin)

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@Frank Apisa,

How can you be sure that you really exist? What proof do you have? Whre does your reality exist? Do you have proof? Are you sure of anything? Do you know anything? If so how?
It seems to me that before you question others you should identify if you are in a position to do so...because if you're unsure or have no proof of your existance or reality, maybe we should'nt really be answering you. After all, we could be just talking to ourselves as you may not even exist!!!

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@giujohn,

Quote:

I would have preferred to live in a time where knowledge wasnt destroyed forever by religious fanatics and in a time where if it were not for religious fanatics we would have had the internet 500 years ago and in all probability would have already cured cancer.

It is most amusing to see fantasy brought to bear on the argument. There is a school of thought that claims that all the pursuit of knowledge ever achieved was to drop us further and further into the ****.

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@spendius,

Quote:

There is a school of thought that claims that all the pursuit of knowledge ever achieved was to drop us further and further into the ****.

Not much of a school and even less of a thought.

Yes, scoff all you want. But let us not forget the atom was theorized in 400 bce. What knowledge then was destroyed in the library at Alexandria? What of all the scientists who were silenced, jailed tortured, or killed from Galileo to Turning in the name of religion?
Where would we have been technologically if science was the driving source of humanity instead of superstition? Would we have maybe eliminated hunger, or found a renewable cheap form of energy? What science was lost or stunted in the relm of medicine? Would we have been farther along if we realized that illness was not caused by evil spirts but by pathogens? Fantasy? I think not.

Your retort is ill concieved and brings nothing useful to the argument.

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@giujohn,

All I said is that there is a school of thought which claims that. And there is.

Everybody who searches for unspoiled holiday destinations is expressing such a thought in action.

Knowledge has given us the power to destroy all life on earth. Superstition could never do that.

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@spendius,

superstition provides the justification For the destruction.

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@spendius,

Quote:

Knowledge has given us the power to destroy all life on earth. Superstition could never do that.

True. So do you think religion had anthing to do with us not blowing ourselves up?

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@farmerman,

farmerman wrote:

superstition provides the justification For the destruction.

That's unfair. Historically, the total destruction of the human race has been made possible by the fight between two ideologies, capitalism and communism, which are not religious in nature. In fact, one of them is anti-religious.

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@Olivier5,

Quote:

That's unfair. Historically, the total destruction of the human race has been made possible by the fight between two ideologies, capitalism and communism, which are not religious in nature. In fact, one of them is anti-religious.

uh...when were we totaly destroyed?

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