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Supreme Court to Decide Second Amendment Incorporation

 
 
oralloy
 
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2009 02:23 pm
Quote:
Taking on a major new constitutional dispute over gun rights, the Supreme Court agreed on Wednesday to decide whether to apply the Second Amendment to state, county, and city government laws.

. . . .

The Court had three cases from which to choose on the Second Amendment issue " two cases involving a Chicago gun ban, and one case on a New York ban on a martial-arts weapon. It chose one of the Chicago cases " McDonald v. Chicago (08-1521) " a case brought to it by Alan Gura, the Alexandria, VA., lawyer who won the 2008 decision for the first time recognizing a constitutional right to have a gun for personal use, at least in self-defense in the home (District of Columbia v. Heller).


http://www.scotusblog.com/wp/court-to-rule-on-gun-rights-terrorism-law
 
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2009 04:13 pm
@oralloy,
As dependable as the swallows returning to Capistrano, oralloy returns to A2K every time the supreme court takes a second amendment case.
rabel22
 
  1  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2009 04:47 pm
I am sure the supremes will do thier usual fine job as in corporations being individuals with the right of free speach and useing money to gain political advantage as in political contributions rather than graft.
0 Replies
 
maporsche
 
  2  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2009 07:03 pm
@joefromchicago,
For which many of us are thankful.

Soon I'll be able to move to Chicago.
0 Replies
 
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2009 08:58 pm
@joefromchicago,
joefromchicago wrote:

As dependable as the swallows returning to Capistrano, oralloy returns to A2K every time the supreme court takes a second amendment case.
For that, he earns our respect and gratitude.





David
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Wed 30 Sep, 2009 09:00 pm

Do we know which Justice wrote the question presented ?





David
kuvasz
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 05:58 am
Study Finds Gun Possession Of Questionable Value In An Assault
(Sep. 30, 2009)
Quote:
epidemiologists at the University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine found that, on average, guns did not protect those who possessed them from being shot in an assault. The study estimated that people with a gun were 4.5 times more likely to be shot in an assault than those not possessing a gun.

What Penn researchers found was alarming " almost five Philadelphians were shot every day over the course of the study and about 1 of these 5 people died. The research team concluded that, although successful defensive gun uses are possible and do occur each year, the chances of success are low. People should rethink their possession of guns or, at least, understand that regular possession necessitates careful safety countermeasures, write the authors. Suggestions to the contrary, especially for urban residents who may see gun possession as a defense against a dangerous environment should be discussed and thoughtfully reconsidered.


http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/09/090930121512.htm
oralloy
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 06:18 am
@joefromchicago,
joefromchicago wrote:
As dependable as the swallows returning to Capistrano, oralloy returns to A2K every time the supreme court takes a second amendment case.


Very Happy

I'd probably post here more often but I've never fully gotten the hang of the new site. I don't know why people have to go around changing things when the old system worked just fine.

Anyway, round two is finally at the Supreme Court.

After we secure incorporation, then we can expand the boundaries of the Constitutional protections to include the right to have semi-auto assault weapons.

And then we can expand the boundaries of the Constitutional protections to include the right to carry concealed handguns.

Then we'll all finally be free!

I wonder if this is what slaves felt like during the Civil War when Union armies were marching in to free them.....
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 06:29 am
@OmSigDAVID,
OmSigDAVID wrote:
Do we know which Justice wrote the question presented ?





David


No idea.

Gura has a few entries on it now on his website, with pending court dates:

http://www.chicagoguncase.com
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 06:32 am
@kuvasz,
Quote:
epidemiologists at the University of Pennsylvania School of Medicine found that, on average, guns did not protect those who possessed them from being shot in an assault.


The medical community comes out with bogus claims like this every so often.

I wouldn't take the claims too seriously. No one else does.
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 08:43 am
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:
After we secure incorporation, then we can expand the boundaries of the Constitutional protections to include the right to have semi-auto assault weapons.

And then we can expand the boundaries of the Constitutional protections to include the right to carry concealed handguns.

Why would incorporation bring that about? After all, even Scalia acknowledged in Heller that DC could still enact reasonable restrictions on gun ownership and usage. Why would a ban on semi-automatic assault weapons and concealed carry necessarily be contrary to the second amendment?

oralloy wrote:
Then we'll all finally be free!

I wonder if this is what slaves felt like during the Civil War when Union armies were marching in to free them.....

It is if you have a particularly vivid imagination.
OmSigDAVID
 
  0  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 09:14 am
@oralloy,

Thank u; I got a lot of good reading from the website.





David
0 Replies
 
oralloy
 
  0  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 09:41 am
@joefromchicago,
joefromchicago wrote:
oralloy wrote:
After we secure incorporation, then we can expand the boundaries of the Constitutional protections to include the right to have semi-auto assault weapons.

And then we can expand the boundaries of the Constitutional protections to include the right to carry concealed handguns.


Why would incorporation bring that about?


It wouldn't. It is just best (in my view, and in Gura's also it seems) to secure incorporation first, and then work at pushing at the boundaries of the right.




joefromchicago wrote:
After all, even Scalia acknowledged in Heller that DC could still enact reasonable restrictions on gun ownership and usage. Why would a ban on semi-automatic assault weapons and concealed carry necessarily be contrary to the second amendment?


Strict scrutiny.

There is no compelling government interest in banning a pistol grip on a rifle.

All an assault weapon really is, is a regular gun with cosmetic features like pistol grips.

Even if someone made a case that there was a compelling interest in prohibiting large ammo magazines (a case I'd personally be highly skeptical of), the fact that assault weapons laws also ban cosmetic features like pistol grips means that the laws aren't narrowly tailored.

Plus, the nation's most restrictive assault weapons laws are in Hawaii. Suing Hawaii is a great opportunity to spend some time on a very nice beach.


I'd imagine the case against concealed carry bans would also be based on the argument that the government had no compelling reason to prevent it. But I've just been told it's on the target list. I haven't seen the logic behind the planning.
joefromchicago
 
  2  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 10:47 am
@oralloy,
oralloy wrote:
Strict scrutiny.

There is no compelling government interest in banning a pistol grip on a rifle.

All an assault weapon really is, is a regular gun with cosmetic features like pistol grips.

Even if someone made a case that there was a compelling interest in prohibiting large ammo magazines (a case I'd personally be highly skeptical of), the fact that assault weapons laws also ban cosmetic features like pistol grips means that the laws aren't narrowly tailored.

In a constitutional republic, the legislature acts as the fact-finder on behalf of the people. The legislative branch, therefore, is accorded wide latitude in determining whether a particular regulation is desirable or not desirable. Are you suggesting, then, that, when it comes to gun regulations, the courts should overrule the judgment of the legislatures and act as a kind of "super-legislature" to determine what is a reasonable regulation and what is not?
Cycloptichorn
 
  3  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 10:50 am
@joefromchicago,
But Joe that would be Judicial Activism, and we know everyone on the right totally hates that, totally.

Cycloptichorn
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 10:58 am
@kuvasz,
Here come the anecdotes, denial, and rationalizations....
DrewDad
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 10:58 am
@oralloy,
Yup. Right on time.
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 10:59 am
@DrewDad,
DrewDad wrote:

Here come the anecdotes, denial, and rationalizations....


Why not call it what it is: verbally and metaphorically stroking their penises for reassurance.

Cycloptichorn
OmSigDAVID
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 01:20 pm
@Cycloptichorn,
Cycloptichorn wrote:

DrewDad wrote:

Here come the anecdotes, denial, and rationalizations....


Why not call it what it is: verbally and metaphorically stroking their penises for reassurance.

Cycloptichorn
U repressionists are obsessed
with always pretending that it is sexual,
as if I were going to say:
"O, no! Thay 've figured me out; -- now thay know.
O, I 'm so ashamed.
Therefore getting killed by a violent predator, man or beast, no longer matters!"

When sex is the concern, Cyclo: its time for my girlfriend.

When a predatory emergency arises,
then u need to be ABLE to CONTROL the situation
and have more power than the predator has.

That 's not too hard to understand, is it, Cyclo ?
Can u handle that ?





David
OmSigDAVID
 
  -1  
Reply Thu 1 Oct, 2009 01:50 pm
The question presented is:

" Whether the Second Amendment is incorporated into the Due Process Clause
or the Privileges or Immunities Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment so as to be applicable to the States,
thereby invalidating ordinances prohibiting possession of handguns in the home."

I do not yet know which Justice wrote it (I suspect Scalia or the Chief Justice),
but I called Alan Gottlieb of the Second Amendment Foundation,
who informed me that it was adopted verbatim from the
language submitted by the Second Amendment Foundation.

I see a good momentum here.
I am further encouraged by the Court being so quick to grant cert.





David
0 Replies
 
 

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