27
   

Alright Republicans, We Give Up

 
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 05:57 pm
@mysteryman,
mysteryman wrote:

Since nobody has read the bill yet, and since it has not been made public, how can you say with 100% certainty that there arent any provisions like this in the bill?

Really? No one has read the bill? So then that chain email that lists page number 425 of the bill showing where the bill will euthanize old people is garbage? Wow...

Actually, the bill is HERE
http://energycommerce.house.gov/Press_111/20090714/aahca.pdf
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 05:58 pm
@parados,
Is that the final bill, or just one version of it?
parados
 
  2  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 06:00 pm
@mysteryman,
Since the bill hasn't passed both houses, of course it isn't the final bill.

Any other silly questions?
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 06:04 pm
@parados,
So it is subject to change?
And it is possible that some rather despicable things could still be included?
parados
 
  2  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 06:06 pm
@mysteryman,
mysteryman wrote:

So it is subject to change?
And it is possible that some rather despicable things could still be included?


So, those people are making up stuff that COULD be in the bill when it finally passes? Please MM. You can't really think that is what they are doing or it would be sane if it was.
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 06:08 pm
@parados,
I dont know what they are doing.
I cant read minds.
However, until the final bill is passed and enacted we really wont know what it consists of.

So, the doom and gloomers (while IMHO idiotic) could be right, but I seriously dont think so.
soozoo
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 06:17 pm
@Centroles,
I trust Snopes just slightly more than I trust Al Gore. Or is it slightly less?

0 Replies
 
DontTreadOnMe
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 06:35 pm
@roger,
really?? i thought it was white out.

oh, wait. my bad... that was Kathryn Harris. Laughing
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  3  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 07:16 pm
@mysteryman,
Except they are not claiming it COULD be in the bill. They are claiming it is in the bill. There is a difference. Then add to that their tactics of not letting anyone dispute them because they shout them down it is NOT an honest debate, let alone a debate at all.

It is a group that wants only their false position put out there. They refuse to let anyone else talk.
0 Replies
 
rabel22
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 07:34 pm
I was on vacation last week and stopped in at a state facility for a map and information and one of the state employees was telling anyone who would listen that the bill contained a provision to deny care to older people and he futher stated that anyone who was 65 had to have a doctors appoiment with a government doctor to determine wether one was healthy enough to live. Stupidity seems to run rampent with government employees.
georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 08:53 pm
@rabel22,
rabel22 wrote:

I was on vacation last week and stopped in at a state facility for a map and information and one of the state employees was telling anyone who would listen that the bill contained a provision to deny care to older people and he futher stated that anyone who was 65 had to have a doctors appoiment with a government doctor to determine wether one was healthy enough to live. Stupidity seems to run rampent with government employees.


I don't think that stupidity is rampant among them. However, bureaucrats and the organizations they serve are not know for obsessions with customer satisfaction and service. In any event, they will be the folks running your health care and spending your tax dollars.
Brandon9000
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 09:11 pm
@parados,
parados wrote:

Quote:

Anyone can check anything in the public domain. The author is providing guarantees, albeit facetiously, that he doesn't know to be true and probably has no authority to make true. The article is merely intended to mock, and has no value whatever as an argument.


So rather than show how the author is incorrect, you decided to attack him rather than his satire? Good for you Brandon.....

By the way, I guarantee that "facetiously" is not used in the bill.

I didn't attack him in the slightest. I attacked the content of his satire.

Once again, he posted a list of assertions which he has no knowledge are true (or at least presents no evidence) and no ability to influence. It's a valueless article and richly deserving of negative commentary.
0 Replies
 
ebrown p
 
  3  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 09:16 pm
This fear of rationing thing is idiotic.

Health care is already being rationed-- except now it is a big freakin' lottery run by and for people whose primary interest is making as big a profit as possible.

Cancer patients who happen to be "pre-existing" conditions are currently denied life-saving treatment, even if they have insurance, if the insurance company can just find a loophole. (We won't even talk about what happens to you if you happen to be laid off at the wrong time).

The only answer you hear the tea bagging conservatives chanting (when they aren't comparing Democrats to Nazis) is "Just say NO!"

This is conservative hypocrisy at its finest.
0 Replies
 
Diest TKO
 
  1  
Reply Sun 9 Aug, 2009 11:23 pm
@Centroles,
Centroles wrote:

This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US department of energy. I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility. After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to see what the national weather service of the national oceanographic and atmospheric administration determined the weather was going to be like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the national aeronautics and space administration. I watched this while eating my breakfast of US department of agriculture inspected food and taking the drugs which have been determined as safe by the food and drug administration.

At the appropriate time as regulated by the US congress and kept accurate by the national institute of standards and technology and the US naval observatory, I get into my national highway traffic safety administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads build by the local, state, and federal departments of transportation, possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level determined by the environmental protection agency, using legal tender issed by the federal reserve bank. On the way out the door I deposit any mail I have to be sent out via the US postal service and drop the kids off at the public school.

After spending another day not being maimed or killed at work thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the department of labor and the occupational safety and health administration, enjoying another two meals which again do not kill me because of the USDA, I drive my NHTSA car back home on the DOT roads, to ny house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state and local building codes and fire marshal’s inspection, and which has not been plundered of all it’s valuables thanks to the local police department.

I then log on to the internet which was developed by the defense advanced research projects administration and post on freerepublic.com and fox news forums about how SOCIALISM in medicine is BAD because the government can’t do anything right.

Consider this post stolen. I cut and pasted it an sent it to a friend.

Too funny.
K
O
0 Replies
 
marsz
 
  0  
Reply Mon 10 Aug, 2009 12:52 am
ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Aug, 2009 05:36 am
@marsz,
Marsz... Why then, do you suppose, that the UK has a higher life expectancy than the US (meaning people on average life longer lives)?

0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  2  
Reply Mon 10 Aug, 2009 05:48 am
Goddamnit . . . somebody needs to kill Palin's baby . . .
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  3  
Reply Mon 10 Aug, 2009 07:37 am
@marsz,
marsz quote wrote:
The American people deserve better.


Well, no-one forces you
a) to life in the UK under the NHS
b) not to get an additional health insurance
c) not to look how our mandatroy health insurance systems work.

However: the English, Welsh, Scottish and Northern Irish people (=all of them) are better health insured than the US-American people.
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Aug, 2009 08:21 am
Reality Check

Quote:
If you've tuned into the news in the past few days, it's clear that the debate about health insurance reform has heated up as Senators and Representatives return to their home states and districts. A troubling trend has also emerged: as more people become engaged in the issue, defenders of the status quo have responded by muddying the waters with more wild rumors and scare tactics.

It's time for a reality check.

Today the White House is rolling out a new website that focuses on what reform really means for you and your family, debunks some common myths along the way and provides you with online tools and content to share the facts with friends, family and anyone else in your social network.

The first set of videos addresses a wide scope of topics and debunks some of those common myths:

CEA Chair Christina Romer details how health insurance reform will impact small businesses.

Domestic Policy Council Director Melody Barnes tackles a nasty rumor about euthanasia and clearly describes how reform helps families.

Matt Flavin, the White House's Director of Veterans and Wounded Warrior Policy, clears the air about Veteran's benefits.

Kavita Patel, M.D., a doctor serving in the White House's Office of Public Engagement, explains that health care rationing is happening right now and how reform gives control back to patients and doctors.

Robert Kocher, M.D., a doctor serving on the National Economic Council, debunks the myth that health insurance reform will be financed by cutting Medicare benefits.

In a video first released last week, Linda Douglass from the White House Health Reform Office addresses fears about the end of our private insurance system and reiterates that if you like your current plan you can keep it.

There is also a handy FAQ about health insurance reform.

Moving forward, we'll use this platform to provide you with the latest "Reality Checks" and tools to combat misinformation.

We also want to hear from you. If you have questions about health insurance reform or suggestions on what topics we should address next, please let us know.

The road ahead will surely reveal more aggressive efforts from defenders of the status quo to confuse and scare Americans with half-truths and outright lies. We're all too familiar with the time-tested tactics that opponents of reform have used for decades to prevent the meaningful change our health insurance system needs.

Now, with what the President calls "the best chance of reform we have ever had," it’s time for citizens across the country get the facts about reform and work on the grassroots level to add a healthy dose of reality into the national discussion on health insurance reform.



georgeob1
 
  1  
Reply Mon 10 Aug, 2009 08:47 am
@revel,
Interesting to note that the Administration's term of art for this issue has morphed from "Health Care Reform" to "Health Insurance Reform". Apparently they are trying to alter the focus of the issue away from the elements of their rhetoric (and of some of the draft legislation in the House) that have provoked such outrage.
 

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