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A POLITICICAL WEREWEASEL - ARLEN SPECTER

 
 
slkshock7
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 11:10 am
@joefromchicago,
??? What world are you in?

For over 100 yrs no SC nominee appointed by a Dem president has failed to be confirmed...there have been four Republican appointees rejected.

ebrown p
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 11:12 am
@slkshock7,
Clearly the Democrats are better at nominating good Judges.

((The fact that Clarence Thomas... a man who by any but the most biased observer is utterly incompetent... was confirmed is astonishing))
0 Replies
 
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 11:14 am
@slkshock7,
slkshock7 wrote:

??? What world are you in?

For over 100 yrs no SC nominee appointed by a Dem president has failed to be confirmed...there have been four Republican appointees rejected.



You're quite wrong.
Cycloptichorn
 
  0  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 11:15 am
@slkshock7,
slkshock7 wrote:

The kicker is going to be how Specter votes on Souter's replacement and any future SC replacements. In the past, he's faithfully voted to confirm pro-life judges despite his own pro-choice views. Now that he's joined the Dem hordes, I would expect him to vote in accordance with his new party and own beliefs. Therefore, republican filibuster of supreme court nominees could be now considerably more difficult....

Of course, its always been the Dems that have held for a litmus test for SC judges...and enjoyed periodic success at sabotaging a president's nominees. The usual (and very frustrating for me) position of Republicans is to honor the wishes of the sitting president and basically confirm them with little opposition.

To me, this is the most troublesome aspect of Specter changing parties.


I'd say what makes the prospect of a judicial filibuster unlikely is a combination of Youtube and the extremely vociferous arguments top Republicans made a few years ago against the entire concept of judicial filibuster. Many of your Senators cannot participate in a filibuster due to their previous statements on the matter - at least, not if they don't want to get completely and totally destroyed by the DNC and the media.

Cycloptichorn
slkshock7
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 11:36 am
@Cycloptichorn,
Cyclo, I'm afraid you may be right...but a guy can hope...hypocrisy among politicians is not exactly unknown (see Specter's remarks of a month ago for case in point).

Interesting take here that indicates that Specter's defection may even help Republicans defeat the nomination of extremely left judges in commitee, vice on the floor. This gives me some hope...

Quote:
But ironically, Specter’s defection may give Republicans the ability to filibuster judicial nominees at the Judiciary Committee level, so the nominees never get out of committee.

Huh, you say. Here’s the explanation, from Professor Michael Dorf of Cornell Law School at his excellent blog, Dorf on Law, written two days ago before Souter’s retirement was in play:

Does Arlen Specter’s defection from R to D strengthen the President’s hand in Congress? Perhaps overall but not on judicial appointments because breaking (the equivalent of) a filibuster in the Senate Judiciary Committee requires the consent of at least one member of the minority. Before today, Specter was likely to be that one Republican. Now what?

The link in Dorf’s post is to Congress Matters, which has the Senate Judiciary Committee rule:
IV. BRINGING A MATTER TO A VOTEThe Chairman shall entertain a non-debatable motion to bring a matter before the Committee to a vote. If there is objection to bring the matter to a vote without further debate, a roll call vote of the Committee shall be taken, and debate shall be terminated if the motion to bring the matter to a vote without further debate passes with ten votes in the affirmative, one of which must be cast by the minority.

Now this is interesting. Specter could allow a nominee out of committee if Specter was a member of the Republican minority, but as part of the majority, he’s just another vote. Here are the other Republicans: Orrin Hatch, Chuck Grassley, Jon Kyl, Jeff Sessions, Lindsey Graham, John Cornyn, and Tom Coburn.

The weak link is Lindsey Graham, who was a member of the Gang of 14. If Graham says the course, the Republicans may not be able to stop runaway spending, military retrenchment, and an interrogation witch hunt. But Specter may have handed Republicans a gift.

slkshock7
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 11:37 am
@joefromchicago,
Abe Fortas was on the Supreme Court...I'm talking folks nominated and rejected under Senate votes. Get with the program....
joefromchicago
 
  0  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 11:40 am
@slkshock7,
slkshock7 wrote:

Abe Fortas was on the Supreme Court, you idiot.

23 minutes to make that reply. Now we can calculate the speed of stupid.
Cycloptichorn
 
  0  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 11:43 am
@slkshock7,
slkshock7 wrote:

Cyclo, I'm afraid you may be right...but a guy can hope...hypocrisy among politicians is not exactly unknown (see Specter's remarks of a month ago for case in point).



Yup. But we'd be talking about Hypocrisy on a massive, party-wide scale. That is unsupportable in the media today. What more, as your article noted, Lindsay Graham is extremely likely to vote whatever candidate out of committee.

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
slkshock7
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 11:45 am
@joefromchicago,
yes, the speed of your stupidity is far greater than mine
joefromchicago
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 11:48 am
@slkshock7,
slkshock7 wrote:

yes, the speed of your stupidity is far greater than mine

So then you admit that you're stupid.
slkshock7
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 12:03 pm
@joefromchicago,
Sticks and stones...

I'm glad to see that Obama doesn't cornered the market on immature and stupid people from Chicago.
joefromchicago
 
  3  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 12:21 pm
@slkshock7,
slkshock7 wrote:

Sticks and stones...

I'm glad to see that Obama doesn't cornered the market on immature and stupid people from Chicago.

Get help for that.
0 Replies
 
kuvasz
 
  2  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 12:43 pm
@Finn dAbuzz,
Kuvasz said

Quote:
I don't think a lot of you Republicans understand what is happening right now...


finn said

Quote:
I think many conservatives know precisely what is happening right now. The recent corrupt idiots in the GOP as well as the fruits of Wall Street greed run rampant have combined to damage the Republican brand.



Your remarks remind me of a guy who gets constantly rejected by women yet blames it on his cologne instead of his personality.

The American voter did not massively reject the Republican Party and its candidates in 2008 simply because they perceived them as corrupt. In 2008, the voters rejected their rhetoric and policies, aka “ideas.”

I assume that you are smart enough to require proof. Such proof comes in post election polling of actual voters, so these are the folks who actually show up to make the decision, and the most important nationally because of it.

http://mediamatters.org/rd?to=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.democracycorps.com%2Fdownload.php%3Fattachment%3Ddcor110508fq1.pdf

For several important issues where the Democrats and Republicans hold positions of distinct difference, the American voter sides in greater numbers with the positions held by the Democrats, sometimes by strong majorities.

So when you dismiss this fact, viz., that it is the ideas promoted by the Republican Party that is the primary cause for the Republican party losing 54 Reps and now 15 Senators in three years (and Republican Party will likely lose between 5-7 Senators in 2010), you are making it even worse for yourselves. You are simply refusing to deal with the actual problem, bad ideas, not good ideas implemented badly.

You sound like a die-hard Communist who defends Communism by stating that the problem with Communism is that it actually has never been tried


finn said

Quote:
As you should remember, something similar happened to the Democrat brand (or more precisely the Liberal brand) not that long ago. Obviously some of you Libs didn't give up on your brand, and yet you now suggest conservatives should give up on theirs. I can appreciate why you would want conservatives to go off and hide in a corner, but spare me this shite about how the world has changed forever.

Better yet, don't. The more cock-sure you are of ideological dominance, the sooner we can expect a correction.


Still more stupid piled higher. I don’t quite know what it is with you Finn. Did your parents place plastic bags over your head as an infant?

If you want to look at “political dominance", please do so in a historical context. Go ahead, and you will note that in 1933 the Democrats took over both houses of Congress and held them until 1995. 62 years, where even I admit encroaching hubris and corruption finally caught up with them. Notice too that the Republicans held control of both of those until 2007. 12 years, again, “where encroaching hubris and corruption (and bat **** craziness) finally caught up with them.”

So while you are challenging the effectiveness of my side’s ideological dominance, if past is prelude, your side won’t be controlling the Congress until 2069, which seems to most folks to be some damn, fine ideological dominance. Especially when your party continues to move from a national party to a regional one.


finn said

Quote:
Maybe Liberals, this time, can restrain themselves and adhere to their actual principles, but I'm doubting it. They couldn't in the past but neither could the Conservatives, which is why these cycles are assured.


I hate to point this out, but if the conservatives were unable to adhere to their principles then people were likely more disgusted with what they were doing than simple corruption as you said earlier.

finn said

Quote:
Please, please, please...assume that either conservatism is dead or that you can kill it. The more arrogant you are, the less time in power you will have. Please don't heed the recent lesson of the GOP.


One does not kill a man intent on committing suicide, but in the spirit of the free market you love so much, one might sell him the gun to do it.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 04:38 pm
@ebrown p,
I don't buy this notion of Specter being in some sort of larval or even pupal stage as a Democrat.

He has to curry favor with the Dems. They're not going to support him as a Party just because he may have stopped currying the favor of Republicans.
0 Replies
 
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Fri 1 May, 2009 04:43 pm
@kuvasz,
Thanks for the give and take, but we've reached the "We'll see" impasse.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Sat 2 May, 2009 09:20 pm
Bruce Bartlett...
Quote:
Eventually, Republicans will tire of being out of power just as Democrats did, and they will do what it takes to win. But I fear that Republicans will have to at least lose in 2010 and again in 2012 before they start to come to their senses. Perhaps by 2014, some leader with maturity, resources, vision and discipline will find a way of leading the GOP out of the wilderness. But I see no one even in a position to start that process today.

http://www.forbes.com/2009/04/30/specter-future-gop-opinions-columnists-bartlett.html
Likely.
revel
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 07:32 am
Quote:
He has to curry favor with the Dems. They're not going to support him as a Party just because he may have stopped currying the favor of Republicans.


If anything since his defection to the democrat party; he has been going out of his way to appear more republican than he was when he was a republican. I guess in an effort to distinguish himself from democrats.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 05:11 pm
@blatham,
I'm sure there are thousands who will now lay claim to recognizing Barrack Obama as the Democrat's savior when they were wandering the wilderness and Karl Rove was promising Republican dominance, but there are always more lying bandwagon jumpers that actual prophets.

I don't know who the next GOP savior will be, but there will be one. Because we can't see who he or she may be 100 days after Obama took office is hardly cause for concern or celebration.

For a group of folks who considered hubris second only to hypocrisy as the greatest of sins, you sure are preening early on.
Finn dAbuzz
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 05:15 pm
@revel,
Quote:
If anything since his defection to the democrat party; he has been going out of his way to appear more republican than he was when he was a republican. I guess in an effort to distinguish himself from democrats


Wait until there's an important vote.

hawkeye10
 
  1  
Reply Tue 5 May, 2009 07:45 pm
Quote:
By Paul Kane
The Senate dealt a blow tonight to Sen. Arlen Specter's hold on seniority in several key committees, a week after the Pennsylvanian's party switch placed Democrats on the precipice of a 60-seat majority.

In a unanimous voice vote, the Senate approved a resolution that added Specter to the Democratic side of the dais on the five committees on which he serves, an expected move that gives Democrats larger margins on key panels such as Judiciary and Appropriations.

But Democrats placed Specter in one of the two most junior slots on each of the five committees for the remainder of this Congress, which goes through December 2010. Democrats have suggested that they will consider revisiting Specter's seniority claim at the committee level only after the midterm elections next year.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/capitol-briefing/2009/05/senate_democrats_deny_specter.html?hpid=topnews

OK, maybe the Dem's are not complete morons....there is even talk of the Dem's breaking with the white house promises and trying to unlodge Specter in the primary.
 

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