Grassy Knoll 2?

You are wrong on the facts of Obama's position on guns. Not surprising given the effort by the NRA to peddle misleading stories and you guys just lap it up like thirsty dogs. I leave a link for the true facts but I doubt it will do much good.



The NRA uses deceptive claims to attack Barack Obama

I tell you what David..
Let's bet on whether Obama is the cause of any of your guns being taken away.

I am willing to put up $1000 that in the next 4 years you will not lose a single gun you currently own because of an action by Obama or the Democratic congress.

So, you willing to actually bet? Or do you realize how full of **** you are?


(A court order to have them removed because you are insane won't count as Obama taking them away.)

I am an optimist, by nature.

I 'd be THRILLED to believe that he is a lover of the freedom
of each citizen to possess defensive guns (like Condi Rice or Alan Keys).

However, its part of human nature (most of the time)
to be able to know, to feel, to intuit, when someone is your friend
or your ally, as distinct from being basicly hostile
and trying to conceal his heart-felt antagonism and ill-will,
for cosmetic purposes, on a temporary basis.

I am confident that if Obama ever met me
he 'd hold in abhorence myself and my pro-freedom ideals.



Well, that consisted mostly of QUOTING him,
and referring to his voting record in his state legislature
and in the US Senate.

I don't remember NRA ever condemning any pro-freedom candidates.






David

For the most part, I agree with what u say,
not including your gratuitous reference to excrement.

Because of:
1 ) the USSC 's holding in HELLER
(with its strongly implicit indications that it will be applied
to curtail the power of the states in the near future, and that
the right of self-defense will not be confined only to one 's house)

and

2 ) the fear of the Demos in Congress
(having been painfully burned so many times by gun control, as Clinton n Al Gore admitted)
of losing their jobs again, this will probably prove to be true;
(i.e., that I will not lose any of my guns).

However, Obama will do everything in his power
to subvert the right of the citizen to possess guns,
that he possibly can get away with;
for instance entering into treaties to interfere with private citizen
gun possession on any international lever that he can make happen.
With fiendishly perverted creative thinking,
the federal taxing powers and red-tape paperworking powers
can be used to drive gun manufacturers out of business
or have them refuse to sell to the private market.

Almost all Democrats in Congress, with a few notable exceptions,
detest the freedom of a private citizen to possess defensive guns,
as does Obama; thay merely fear the consequences of attacking
this freedom, but will try to get away with whatever thay can.

No they do not consist of quoting either him or his record; they distort both because they are against anyone who believes in safety measures when it comes to the use of personal weapons. When you guys hear anything remotely like more gun laws you automatically think of it like a slippery slope to banning guns and violating the second amendment and that is why the NRA has it out for Obama and has lied and distorted his record for their own agenda of selling guns. Your side reminds me of the extreme left side of the abortion issue. (I don't believe in abortion but don't use it as a litmus test for candidates)

Factcheck obama NRA

U mean I did NOT see what I saw during the campaign ?




I have known NRA to strongly FAVOR safety programs.
Indeed, it even runs numerous safety programs, itself,
and has instructors teaching them.

I will admit that NRA has opposed some programs
which woud have been much safer for violent criminals (e.g., burglars),
like the D.C. law requiring defensive guns to be stored
unloaded and disassembled, or with trigger locks, so that in an emergency,
the good guy coud not get ready in time to defend from the bad guy.




No; this is false,
in that some gun laws are GOOD for additional freedom
of gun possession and practice with them, whereas others
are proposed by gun-haters who wish to subvert and curtail
our right to self-defense. There are people who openly oppose
the right of self-defense from the violence of criminals
and who wish to criminalize self-defense from criminals,
as well as thay can criminalize it. I understand that thay have been
quite successful in doing so in some European countries.


The NRA has no reason to oppose obama,
except for his opposition to freedom of gun possession,
the same as of freedom of hammer possession or ax possession.
People like me, who support some part of NRA ideology,
desire everyone to be SAFE; that does not include
rendering emergency equipment inaccessible in an emergency.

It also does NOT include accepting or tolerating
USURPATION of authority by government, in this area,
nor in any other area.

I very strongly support gun manufacturers selling guns.
The same as the American public needs a continual supply of cars,
it needs a continual supply of guns, but the NRA does not sell guns.






MY side of the abortion issue
is the same as MY side of the freedom of gun possession issue, to wit:
that it is none of any government 's damned business.
It is a purely private matter that a pregnant woman
can attend to with her medical health care providers.

I dissent from your characterization of this being:
" the extreme left side . . . " of the abortion issue.

I am not aware of the Founders ever having considered
the issue of a woman 's freedom of abortion; I have not studied
this aspect of history, nor do I know whether anything was ever
recorded on this point. I suspect that thay woud hold that
government has no jurisdiction to interfere in the internal
workings of the body of any human being.

That also applies to ingestion of drugs by any citizen:
a basic right to ingest drugs or to ingest poison, if so he chooses.





David

Thanks. I just now found your response to my post or posts. Your detailed response and take on events are appreciated. You sound like a good citizen and a good American.

Tell me what seen and heart during the campaign which led you to believe Obama is after your guns and then I'll compare it to what Obama actually said.

The NRA is not known for encouraging common sense safety laws. Tell me some laws they lobbied for in congress to pass.

Perhaps it was a mistake to label the supporters of abortion as extreme left; I just meant those who seem to be focused just on that one issue they it seems some are focused on the one issue of guns. In any event the description and the comparison was a mistake on my part. The reason I don't use the abortion as a litmus test on which I support is precisely because I recognize that people see the abortion issue differently. I see life as starting at conception and to stop that life is to me murder. I realize others see as a personal choice issue for women. The very complicated nature of this issue is the reason it has remained a hot button controversy.

Omsigdavid,
I badly need to edit that post but I was too slow and ran out of time. Perhaps you can still make it out.