14
   

"In the 21st century, nations don't invade other nations"

 
 
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 04:15 am
Quote:
Mikheil Saakashvili started this war with his barrage attack and occupation of South Ossetia. Russia's war of retribution was far less violent or excessive than the U.S. bombing of Serbia for 78 days over Kosovo, or our unprovoked war on Saddam Hussein's Iraq, which has brought death to scores of thousands, or Israel's 35 days of bombing of Lebanon for a border skirmish with Hezbollah.

Yet, declared John McCain of Russia, "In the 21st century, nations don't invade other nations." Even Dick Cheney must have guffawed.


From an opinion piece by Pat Buchanan

He goes on to say something I wholeheartedly agree with, that NATO is making a dangerous bluff that it can't afford to carry through.

Quote:
If the United States intends to bring Georgia and Ukraine into NATO and arm them to fight Russia, why should Russia not dissolve the Treaty on Conventional Forces in Europe and move her tank armies into Belarus and up to the borders of Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania?

Would we send U.S. troops into the Baltic republics to signal that we will fight Russia to honor our NATO war guarantees? Which NATO allies would fight alongside us against a nuclear-armed Russia?

If we bring Ukraine into NATO, what do we do if Russified east Ukraine secedes and Russia sends troops to back the rebels? Do we send warships into Russia's bathtub, the Black Sea, and commit to fight as long as it takes to restore Ukraine's territorial integrity?


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Type: Discussion • Score: 14 • Views: 6,388 • Replies: 64

 
joefromchicago
 
  4  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 06:54 am
It has finally come to this. The Bush administration's foreign policy is so absurd that even Pat Buchanan is starting to sound rational.
rosborne979
 
  2  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 07:55 am
@joefromchicago,
This is what happens when the american people vote for president based on "who they most want to have a beer with". We don't even choose our Dentist on that criteria.

0 Replies
 
mysteryman
 
  1  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 08:00 am
@joefromchicago,
Are you saying that Bush controls NATO?
I thought you were one of the ones saying he wasnt smart enough, yet now you are saying that he is smart enough to control NATO and make all of NATO's decisions.
dlowan
 
  2  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 08:09 am
@Robert Gentel,
"Yet, declared John McCain of Russia, "In the 21st century, nations don't invade other nations." Even Dick Cheney must have guffawed."


He really, actually said that?

That's pretty scary.
old europe
 
  2  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 08:12 am
@dlowan,
He did...

0 Replies
 
joefromchicago
 
  3  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 08:39 am
@mysteryman,
mysteryman wrote:
Are you saying that Bush controls NATO?

No. How in god's name did you make that idiotic assumption?

mysteryman wrote:
I thought you were one of the ones saying he wasnt smart enough, yet now you are saying that he is smart enough to control NATO and make all of NATO's decisions.

Speaking of people who aren't smart enough ...
rabel22
 
  2  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 09:27 am
@joefromchicago,
I think that americas citizens should lose thier right too vote because they use it so badly. Oh, hold on, they will probebly elect Mccain and the republicans will continue Bushes policies and we will automatically lose that right along with the others he has already taken from us.
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  2  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 11:02 am
@Robert Gentel,
Robert, have I become so cynical with Bush-McCain et al that I could imagine that the Georgia fiasco was cooked up to help McCain's campaign?

Nah! Nobody would do that, would they?

BBB

mysteryman
 
  3  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 11:41 am
@BumbleBeeBoogie,
So Bush or McCain ordered russia to invade a sovereign country, just to help win an election.

You ARE paranoid, arent you?
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 11:46 am
@mysteryman,
That's what 8 years of Bush-Cheney abuse will do to a formally sane woman.

BBB
0 Replies
 
old europe
 
  2  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 12:32 pm
@mysteryman,
mysteryman, I think there's quite a number of people who believe that the United States supported Georgia (not Russia) in the initial attack on South Ossetia...
0 Replies
 
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 12:42 pm
@mysteryman,
It's not impossible. Remember the film Wag the Dog?
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0120885/

BBB
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  4  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 12:44 pm
@mysteryman,

As OE pointed out, Russia's invasion of Georgia was triggered by Georgia's attack on South Ossetia.

And as stated, many people think the USA was involved in that. Whether that (if true) was partly to help Bush and McCain, I couldn't say. But it will.
BumbleBeeBoogie
 
  1  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 12:56 pm
@McTag,
Of course the U.S. helped Georgia as part of Bush's democracy projects. The U.S. armed Georgie to justify installing it's missile defense project in Poland. Then there's the oil pipe line, too. The U.S. fingerprints are all over this event.

BBB
0 Replies
 
Ramafuchs
 
  -1  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 12:59 pm
@McTag,
Decency seek elsewhere.
Democracy as well.
death is natural.
Influencing with Marshal plan and projecting the corporate culture is not saleable.
I feel pity for this plight.
My language is not English
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 01:14 pm
@Robert Gentel,
What do you suggest as an alternative? Should we set a policy that essentially gives Russia the Green Light to reclaim the countries of the Soviet Union?
rabel22
 
  2  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 01:21 pm
@OCCOM BILL,
If we hadent throwen away so much of our military power and good will in a stupid war in Iraq we might be in a position to point out the Russian moral position as being wrong, but we cant with a straight face because they are only doing what Bush did in Iraq. I think the E.U. should show some leadership here instead of pointing the finger at us even though I admit we are probebly responsible for the problem. With the way our present government spins everything it will be 100 years before we discover wether they had anything to do with it. Remember we encouraged the Iraq government to go after Iran in the 1990's.
CalamityJane
 
  2  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 01:24 pm
@rabel22,
rabel22 wrote:

I think that americas citizens should lose thier right too vote because they use it so badly. Oh, hold on, they will probebly elect Mccain and the republicans will continue Bushes policies and we will automatically lose that right along with the others he has already taken from us.


Are you actually believing what you're saying?

rabel22
 
  1  
Reply Sat 30 Aug, 2008 01:27 pm
@CalamityJane,
Yes. About the loss of rights. I hope no to Mccain being elected. We cant stand another 4 or 8 years of a republican government.
0 Replies
 
 

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