Help! What can I do for my daughter?

Mame:

What can you do for your daughter? I think you can help her to understand that SHE deserves much better in life than what she received from a person who was supposed to be her partner. You have to walk a fine line while you reach for ways to build her up. After all, her current husband is the father of your grandchildren and your daughter will have to deal with him for many years to come. While she will have a duty to facilitate his relationship with the children, and she will want things to be cordial between the two of them, she also needs to attain awareness. If this man was truly a person worthy of the precious commitment that she made to him, then he would not have allowed himself to be swayed away from the marriage by the beckoning wiles of a 23-year-old co-worker. Even if his crush on the other woman runs its course and he decides that he wants to come home, he has proven himself to both unworthy and untrustworthy.

Of course, she will need time to mourn the loss of her marriage, but she will be so much stronger in the aftermath. She will know that she deserves better than the instability and heartache that her husband offered. And, this painful experience will make her wise and shape her future choices. Someday, without a doubt, she will find a worthy person with whom to share her life. That worthy person will be the icing on her cake. He will like her for who she is. He will laugh with her, enjoy spending time with her, and be in love with her. He will grasp her hand and hold it in the bad times as well as the good. In the meantime, she has her children, she has her friends, and she has you. She has everything that is important. Although your daughter is hurting today, it is the first day of the rest of her life--and what a glorious, happy life it will be.

Debra

Try listening to country music, spendi - it's all men wailing about losing their d-o-g and their woman

Thank you hamburger. Yes, when she's ready, she'll enlist our help for those legal, financial, etc matters. I just want to reiterate, and I hope it doesn't come back on me, that he's a decent guy. I haven't spoken to him so I am only getting hearsy, but I don't think he would do anything to hurt them. Of course, who knows, really, what anyone would do?

Wise words, Debra.

I'm just giving her some adjustment time while offering support. I'm sure in a couple of months, maybe sooner, she'll be ready to talk about these things. Right now she's still hurting too much.

Thank you, that was beautifully expressed.

Well said Debra. Mame, I truely feel for you and your daughter.

I'd be interested in hearing the point of view from the man who has left in a similar way and where he is emotionally 5 years later. In other words, I'd love to know if my ex ever has feelings of regret.

Mame, your daughter sounds like a much stronger person than I was

Wow, Mame, so sorry. Don't know what words of wisdom I have for you that haven't already been so eloquently given. She's lucky to have you for support, and you know you can come here for support any time. We care.

mame wrote :



CAUTION is the word ! people can do crazy things when they are stressed .
(just watched portion of suzy orman show )
hbg

Mame-

I don't care for country music precisely because of the whining self-pity most of it expresses. The women do it too. Hank Williams being the worst.

I know a number of women who give men the go-by.

I did once know a guy who worked voluntarily (why I can't imagine) for an national organisation which specialised in minimising the damage of failed relationships. He told me that the very first thing before any advice is offered is to familiarise oneself with both sides. He said it was difficult to do with men because they were very reticent of giving their real reasons. They considered it ungallant. They prefer to take the blame. Like Arthur did in the movie.

It gives the shark's teeth something to chew on as a bonus.

I still challenge those who have undermined Christian beliefs and discipline to show how they have not made a contribution to these situations and that unless they cease attacking Christian thinking they are contributing to a growth industry which they themselves may benefit from in some way. Not being a Christian is no reason to attack Christianity. One can keep one's thoughts to oneself on the matter but if you go public you need to answer the question.

And I have said nothing there, or before, about what I think. I am simply laying out the obvious sociological and psychological consequences.

Theodor Reik in his book Of Love And Lust has this passage-



And these anti-IDers only want the biological truth to be told in biology lessons so when they start going all unwordly when the consequences arrive you can imagine the contempt in which they are held by people who know which way up us.

Bernard Shaw has Tanner in Man and Superman say-



Suppose the villain here had read something along those lines on top of other things.

And Dylan sings--"I gave her my heart but she wanted my soul."

The wife of the cowed husband does not stop when he agrees to be sexually faithful. She has a range of further humiliations in store. She has been known to buy him a Black and Decker Workmate (an instrument of torture) for Christmas with his own wages.

Oh how we "A-holes" sniggered when we saw Seven Brides for Seven Brothers and the Dick van Dyke Show.

If you want science only then put up with what happens.

Comforting isn't it to be officially ignoring that.

BTW-- I forgot to mention that Logan Clendening was The Professor of Clinical Medicine and Professor of Medical History at the University of Kansas.

I wish we had pm's again, Spendi.

One can have "Christian values" without being a Christian. We can get into a philosophical debate about such but I fear someone would come along and tell me how shallow I am and I'm not in the mood for that right now.

I appreciate your input. And I agree there are fundamental differences between the genders, rendering relationships hard to navigate at times.

The whole world is going to pot.

Yes- you can have Christian values without being a Christian but for how long? When the submerged 90% of the iceberg is Christian you can play around on the top bit to draw attention to yourself with statements which seem perfectly reasonable until they are scrutinised. But you help melt the rest and when it is gone Christian values make no sense. Christianity was invented to counter biological scientific determinants. They were getting the human race nowhere.

I can't understand anti-IDers. They are anti-family and live in families. If you want shallowness they have it.

You can bet your boots that anybody calling you shallow is shallowness on legs.

I'm not sure the whole world is going to pot though. The times they are a-changin'. You have to learn to swim or you'll sink like a stone.

I really don't think this thread was meant to be about expressing one's religious beliefs or beliefs about marriage. Isn't this about a difficult emotional situation that a friends daughter is experiencing? Isn't someone simply looking for support?
Mame, tell me if I'm wrong.

I came to a2k by way of the relationship forum precisely BECAUSE a2k was a rare place where the members did not make a habit of telling the original poster what they wanted to hear, because instead of that honest opinions were the coin of the realm...

Maybe the original posters are looking for help with the matter at hand and not a derail of their issue into droning on and on about some personal theory.
I came to A2k for the relationship forum because I had a problem that I was genuinely looking for help with. I wasn't looking to be schooled in one persons opinion.

MB, thanks - I did get a lot of support and things to think about, and thank you, by the way, for your contribution. But I really like digressions - one thing leads to another and another and another. You wind up talking about something completely different than originally. And his post wasn't much of a digression, really - it's still on topic. At issue is her family breakdown. Ditto with Hawkeye's. I appreciate all the comments. It's all food for thought.

Spendi - I almost put a smiley after that comment about the world going to pot. I was being a bit flippant.

Here is how she's doing on Day 4: I asked her: How was today for you?

Hi mom,

Honestly, i feel every emotion many times during the day. i am still in total disbelief that this has happened and yet, it feels like forever ago. hard to believe 4 days have gone since. i usually wake up hating him so much and feeling sick...it's like it hits me for the first time every morning. i keep going back to our life a week ago and remembering what we were doing...and i was none the wiser. and then as the day progresses, i start to cry and cry and ruminate, and then get numb and despondent. by the end of the day, i am so weary that i feel depressed about my life.

marjo, michelle, and my friends have done my heart good. and so have the emails and calls i have received from my family. i am getting lots of good but sometimes contradictory advice. so i am coping well enough because i have lots of people around to keep me busy.

marjo and i are going to work out my financial situation. i could use an outside perspective on how to split our assets and debts....in a fair way. i also plan on consulting with a family lawyer this week...just to know what my rights are. greg and i have agreed that we will not go to court or need lawyers but i want to be prepared. i will also draft up a separation agreement because, unfortunately, things need to be in writing for me to trust him. it's so hard to believe, but we are going to be divorced one day and we need to be legally separated for one year before we can apply for a divorce. i know that it's not a good idea to make any major decisions...especially regarding finances or custody or whatever. this is just me preparing. we are not selling the house anytime soon. but let's face it, i don't really want to live here for too long. but i'm in no rush to sell, trust me.

i have also told greg that he will not be attending any midwife appts, ultrasounds or the birth. he was surprised to hear about not attending the ultrasound and birth...but what does he expect? he is a stranger to me and not someone i trust or feel good around. i feel so betrayed and deceived by him. this is my body and i don't feel comfortable with him around. he has walked away from certain privileges of having a family. i realize that i have a need to punish him but i also need to keep my distance with him. i will obviously share all pertinent information with him about the baby's development.
~~~

Poor kid. But thankfully, not a weak or stupid one.

Yep... thankfully she has a good support system in place too - contradictory advice can sometimes do more harm - hopefully, she will take the advice she wishes to take and dispense with the rest - she's appears a strong gal - and so will go with her feelings as opposed to what others expect her to feel - and will do what she wishes to do, as opposed to how others expect her to act now.

Emotions will be all over the place - headwise and hormonal.

Glad she is talking to you and telling you how she's feeling - hope you managed to get the phone numbers from her friends - she'll probably/maybe get a sudden massive independent streak where contact will lessen a lot, with many people - when she doesn't want to answer the phone or write emails etc.... would be good to have a safety net in place - for your peace of mind too.

Hugs to you girlie. x

Oh no, Mame!

Unfortunately, I don't think you can do anything except give her a sympathetic ear and a shoulder to cry on. And I'm sure you didn't need me to give her those.

All the best to you and your daughter for getting through this!

Mame,
I can relate so much to what your daughter must be feeling that I got a little emotionallyinvolved in this thread. It pains me to know that anyone else has to experience the pain that I did.
I also can understand her not wanting him at the birth. that's such a personal moment and I would also want someone there that I trust wholeheartedly

Oh MB, I know from your posts what you went through and how this must bring it all back. Getting emotionally involved is just fine. This situation is such a cliche it's almost embarrassing.

Yes, I agree, she has a right to not have him there in the delivery room but I hope she lets him see and hold the babe right after.

Thomas, thank you, and to Drewdad and everyone else I missed mentioning. I really appreciate your support and comments.

Good to see you, Mame. I hope you're hanging in there.

Having read the whole thread, the best advice I can give is, listen to Debra. In my discussions with her on the law forum, I followed this advice way too rarely. Consequently, I lost pretty much every argument with her. Her opinions on real life are as sound as her opinions on the law; you can't do better than to heed them.