Help! What can I do for my daughter?

Hugs, Mame...

(aww ****, I dint want top of page)

Hugs anyway, and you know I know yer flippin' awesome...

So glad you posted back Mame - know you don't do personal stuff on the board - that took guts on your part... and hey, you deserve a little empathy and sympathy girl.

You are a very strong lady, hugely admired and respected. Daughter must be a chip off the old block - yep, huge hurt.... anger will undoubtedly come, but hopefully, for the moment, she needs to focus on baby and child - that, her friends can support her with where she is, you can support her in just listening and allowing her to rant, ramble, cry and probably incoherently and uncontrollably laugh at how awful the situation is right now. Emotions are gonna be all over the shop.

If you wanna ramble... can't think of a better place to do it, than here amongst your friends. x

Mame, this is so devastating for her and for you because you are her mom. My heart aches for you both.

I know you will be there for her no matter how far apart you both are, and that will be most helpful for her.

The other advice from CI and Butrflynet is absolutely practical and necessary and it can also give her something to do that feels constructive and is protective of her and her baby. It is far too easy to get swallowed up by emotion and leave the essentials of daily living by the wayside.

Your extraordinary strength will go a long way toward helping her through this awful time.

So sorry Mame!

I do find myself wondering if the pregnancy has triggered a fear in him of losing another child?

But, why doesn't matter all that much, I guess.

So hard to bear a loved one's pain, isn't it?

((((((((((((((((((((((((((Mame and Mame's daughter)))))))))))))))))))))))))))

Support for sure. (where are those anchovies...)

er, kidding re the anchovies.

Yeh, try to help her with facing stuff, calmly, if you can nail which stuff.. no easy task, but better in the long run. Possibly hard re mother daughter dynamic.
Anyway, support..

Sorry, Butrflynet, didn't mean to ignore your post. She's in London, Ontario, and I think she has a fairly good network of support. Yes, we're on Skype, well, he is! But we're emailing and all she has to do is let me know when she'll call and I'll head to town where I get cell reception. Thank you for your concern. He's not a bad guy. Not at all. I still care for him.

Oh ****.

This is the email I just sent her. I don't know what else to say.

Denise, hello honey:

I've been thinking of you non-stop since our conversation. I wish I could lean over and wrap my arms around you, honey and give you a big squeezy old hug and kiss. I wish I could kiss it and make it all better. But, of course, I can't, and nobody can protect you from life, as you know all too well.

I can only imagine what you're going through - wondering what signs you missed, what he's really talking about, what you could have done, why he would want to do this... I'm just so, so sorry that you're going through this. As his wife, you may have had a part to play in all this (don't we all?) but the ultimate decision was his, the method was his, his feelings and confusion are his and you are not to blame for anything he does or says. And don't take on more than what you think is right. He may not like certain characteristics of yours, etc., but talking is the first option, counselling the second, and giving up is the last resort. He may even find he's made a terrible mistake before too long, and there may be a chance for you two again. Never say never, honey. You never know.

I hope you call on your friends and family whenever you need them - they're your greatest resource. And any time you want to call me, let me know, and I'll head to town. And email me if you want - vent it all out. Purging is good!

Alex and I were going to hang out in Calgary when we're both done camp - would you like us or me to come out some time? I expect that to be early November. Let me know.

Know that I'll be thinking of you and sending you positive and very loving thoughts, Denise. You are a strong woman and together, with your family and friends, you will come out of this whole. In the meantime, accept my love and support.

You've gone through more in the last two and a half years than many people do in a lifetime.

Give yourself a break and remember to ask yourself every day what you can do for yourself. It's so important to do something good for yourself, Denise, EVERY SINGLE DAY.

Love you lots and I'm with you in spirit throughout this...

Mom

That's a very caring and thoughtful email, Mame, and I am sure Denise
will appreciate your being there for her. I still have the picture of them and Lucy
so vividly in my memory as it showed them as such a loving and lovely family.
It's a darn shame, isn't it?

CJ, I'm emailing you since we have no pm's yet.

You did good Mom...

Keep talking to her - email... just so she knows you're there. She doesn't have to read them if she doesn't want to - but she'll know you're there.

I pulled away from my Mom when their support (or not so positive support) turned to crying and maudlin.... I needed them to be strong - but they weren't, they fell apart - so the best advice I could give you, as a daughter, is to remain strong for her, don't fall apart unless she needs you to have a cry with her, please don't tell her it will all be alright in the end... she won't want to hear that, not yet anyways...

maybe send her something... My mom was supportive to me in the only way she knew how (Noddy explained it to me) - you have to do it your way, and that will be the right way...

I don't know you're family... tho I know you... remember you said you never keep things... well, I had my parents close by to me so it wouldn't have been appropriate... but maybe a handwritten letter/card... you know how you sew... something handmade for the baby.... something your daughter can hold onto... dunno if I'm saying this right... something that is for your daughter but is from you, part of you... so you feel as tho it's not just blind words... does that make sense? (so sorry if that doesn't sound right - hope you know what I mean). x

yep, and most people who are invested in their marriage feel like they have failed when the marriage fails, even if they don't primarily blame themselves for what went wrong. Kids tend to not want to feel like failures around their parents...so pulling away could be expected no matter what mame does. So long as we parents keep acting like we are there if needed or wanted, and are respectful of the request for space, the kids almost always come around.

You're both right, and I'll take that advice. I don't see the breakdown of a marriage as a failure, anyway. Commitment is a strange thing. People change, situations change... you can't always honour your commitment. It's all a part of this crazy life. I don't care that they're splitting up, I only care about them and their pain. sigh.

I'm not quite with you there, mame, although mostly am. I get marriage mess tends to be multiply generated..

but I'm a tad sensitive about it during pregnancy. What an oaf.

Er, sorry.

Big kick, however defensively made and perhaps understandable, still, what an oaf.

I may recover equanimity on this tomorrow, as I usually see both sides, and used to align against Noddy sometimes, with the guy. But, in this case... not yet.


On marriage in general, it gets to be more and more a wonder to me, that anyone can make it work, the longer I hang around.

Mame I wish the best for the children!

Little late for that isn't it? If he didn't want it, than why did he make those 2 babies?

Who's going to fed, clothe and put those little souls through college?

Mame, So sorry to hear about this. I'm not one for offering advice. Just keep doing what you're doing.

Thinking of you and your family.

Mame,

I'm so sorry to hear of the pains your family is going through right now. I know how it feels to have my husband just leave with no warning and no trying at counseling.

What I wonder is what this other woman feels. Does any female on this board want to be with a man who would abandon his pregnant wife for her? Not me.

From what Mame says they have both been through some awful bereavements.

Any relationship, even one when the couple are best of friends, can split following something like the death of a child. Even i know that.
What is the point apportioning blame? How will that help?
Support is what's needed now- surely?
Sounds like you're handling it well, Mame
No point turning on the man - for all you know he could come back in a few weeks time and anything you say to him now will be remembered - by everyone

He is still the father - and will not abandon them forever if he's the kind of person you say he is.
Take each day at a time for a while (that's always my motto)

Good Luck to all
Respectfully
Endy

Bringing in another chair.

More shoulders and sympathy here, Mame.

Denise is going to have a tough haul. I'm glad she has lots of local support and I'm glad she has you to turn to as well. Once the shock wears off I hope she finds a very clear head when she sets up custodial and financial arrangements for Lucy and the baby. I'm not sure how things work in Canada but all too often in a divorce where young children are involved, women take on the majority of the responsibility of raising their childing, both in terms of time and money.

I just hope that they take their time in implementing final steps. This is a very difficult and emotional time. Coming up with a fair custody and childcare arrangement is never easy but certainly shouldn't be done when in a state of shock.

You've heard my soapbox on this stuff before...SIL has changed his mind on wanting to be Denise's husband -- he gets to do that because they are both adults. SIL doesn't get to change his mind on wanting to be a parent. He can divorce Lucy but he should never be allowed to divorce his kids - they are innocents in every way possible.

Best wishes to you and Denise -- and SIL if he's as nice as you say he is.

Thank you, all... Osso, Endy, JPB, all of you. Good advice and great support. She's a strong cookie, so once the shock wears off, she'll be okay. I don't think she will let herself get taken advantage of, and I don't think he'd do that to them. And I've suggested she wait a few months before discussing anything permanent.

Ah, Life. Full of drama.