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Latest Challenges to the Teaching of Evolution

 
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 10:21 am
@Leadfoot,
I enjoy pointing out that there is no "ending" a debate with blinding polite discourse. You may as well hand out cookies and milk.
Id rather fight it out where we all can see and judge the logic and evidence in our arguments. Quora doesnt really allow me to tell you that I think your views may be fulla ****, A2K does.

I see that youre here today, too much Politeness burning your ass??
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 10:33 am
@Setanta,
I and some stoner grad student friends, hiked up to Machu picchu years ago. During the hike an archeologist teacher from Yale had a group going up the hills and he was yakking on about Hiram Bingham and how he, as a harvardian Historian developed his hypothesis of a beach house for the Inca, He went on about how the historians have been the real unsung heroes of much of the archeological finds in South America, (macchu picchu, Cozumel, Puma punku etc etc).

I was more amazed aas I recall as to how this guy, at least in his 60's was able to hike at the clip he set, and keep talking) I think we were starting at 10000 m and had a coupla more thousand to the top, and all o us were totally out of breath
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 10:36 am
@farmerman,
I did that climb as a young man, and made it to the top with a few others.
0 Replies
 
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 11:46 am
@farmerman,
Quote:
I really dont give a **** what you believe
runs your world. Youre just a pawn in a chess game of life, so shall I call you Mongo?


A perfect example of your bigotry.

Who is moving the chess pieces?

Quote:
Modern BIOLOGICAL and MEDICAL SCIENCES are (Im sorry to inform you) BASED upon neo- Darwinian evolutionary theory. (At least 8 very top notch US mmedical universities and research centers are CHAIRED by paleontologists or Evo/Devo researchers) AND--- There IS NO raging disagreement among contributing scientists regarding evolution . Thats all crap that guys like gunga snake publish every coupla months when he posts cherry picked quotes or listing dead ngineers and dentists as "Experts " in developmental biology.


A perfect example of institutional bigotry.

Quote:
ALSO Common ancestry in all life is a matter that is evidenced indisputably, aaaand HUMAN BEINGS created gods, not the otherway around (the last one was me opining my proof is the historical record of the "evolution" of all these gods that people worship and yet cannot agree on )


A perfect example of conclusions drawn purely from naturalism while leaving out naive realism to determine the possible ontology. Which then can be subjected to subjective idealism to determine source of ontology to assist in reverse engineering the information in the data.

Is naturalism the only philosophy you use in a car purchase? You never look at how the ontology of the model your looking at meets your needs. Do you consider how different manufacturers vehicles evolved over time from previous models and developed a track record of reliability? Do you show customer loyalty to a manufacturer that, due to intelligent engineering have built a reputation of developing a vehicle through evolution whose ontology meets your needs with quality and reliability?

I suspect that in all areas of your life (both personal and business) you use that philosophical thought process with the exception of your world view concerning the origins and ontology of the universe and the origins and ontology of life.

Can you explain why this choice of limiting your philosophic understanding of information in certain parts of your life is more logical than than my choice to avoid such limits?

Can putting such limits on philosophical understanding lead to biases in your understanding of science that I do not encounter by my using a broader philosophical applications to my understanding of all types of information?

Quote:
Consequently , if you try to act like a fool and be a defiant denier of science in your worldview, I shall work diligently to see that you and those of your ilk who actually believe in Creationism ID (CID), do not have the opportunity to spread this BS to our kids in public schools.
Is using an broader application of philosophies as, people of my ilk tend to do, lead to bullshit?

If so maybe you should quit using those philosophical points of view in your car buying decisions and purchase an armored personnel carrier (or maybe a tricycle) as a personal vehicle.
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 12:49 pm
@Leadfoot,
I was at Quora for a while, until they falsely accused me of plagiarism for quoting Theodore Roosevelt. It's a big place--I never saw you, and I was very busy and many followers.
0 Replies
 
Setanta
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 12:51 pm
@farmerman,
Is it that amazing? After all a lecturing professor does need leather lungs.
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 01:12 pm
@brianjakub,
The only thing your post is a perfect example of is someone not knowing the correct definition of bigotry.
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 01:15 pm
@izzythepush,
explain why I am wrong.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 01:42 pm
@brianjakub,
Bigotry is about discrimination based on class, race, gender, disability, sexuality. It's not about the exchange of ideas. Nobody should have to give a **** what anyone else believes unless that causes discrimination. Farmerman hasn't discriminated against you, he's debated with you honestly.

As for the rest of your pseudo science, you've come with a predetermined set of beliefs which you then try to fit around your understandings of science. When people who don't come to the table similarly encumbered and dismiss your beliefs because there's very little if any evidence for it you cry bigotry. There's nothing bigoted about it, it's reason pure and simple.

Overall it's quite distasteful for a comfortably off white American, who reeks to high heaven of white privilege, to complain about bigotry when there are real victims of bigotry all around us.
cicerone imposter
 
  2  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 01:47 pm
@izzythepush,
Quote:
Overall it's quite distasteful for a comfortably off white American, who reeks to high heaven of white privilege, to complain about bigotry when there are real victims of bigotry all around us.


Thank you.
0 Replies
 
brianjakub
 
  2  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 02:14 pm
@izzythepush,
Quote:
Bigotry is about discrimination based on class, race, gender, disability, sexuality. It's not about the exchange of ideas. Nobody should have to give a **** what anyone else believes unless that causes discrimination.


I beg to differ.

big·ot·ry
ˈbiɡətrē/Submit
noun
intolerance toward those who hold different opinions from oneself.
"the difficulties of combating prejudice and bigotry

Quote:
Farmerman hasn't discriminated against you, he's debated with you honestly.


Once again I beg to differ.

farmerman to helloandgoodbye and he's made similar comments to me in the past
Quote:
Consequently , if you try to act like a fool and be a defiant denier of science in your worldview, I shall work diligently to see that you and those of your ilk who actually believe in Creationism ID (CID), do not have the opportunity to spread this BS to our kids in public schools. I have no control over Fundamentalist parochial schools except to recognize that most of those kids wont become scientists (unless they, like Mike Behe or Steve Austen) they must "make believe" that they want to work as real scientists during their graduate studies. What you wish to do to your kids, sadly, is not under my control. EXCEPT that theres more real jobs for the biology majors that understand and adapt to evolutionry theory.
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 03:07 pm
@brianjakub,
If you want to play the victim and cry poor me then feel to do so. Just don't expect anyone else to indulge your delusions. It's actually quite pathetic.

Don't expect me to waste any more time explaining anything else to you.
0 Replies
 
rosborne979
 
  2  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 03:16 pm
@brianjakub,
If you don’t like science (which you clearly don’t) then quit pretending to do it.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 03:21 pm
@brianjakub,
Quote:
A perfect example of institutional bigotry.
You actually believe that mmedical research is an example of institutional Bigotry?? And , I suppose, so is Biological research??

I really dont know where to go from here because you obviously are kinda close minded about anything that does NOT flow back to "Sudden Appearance"< Irreducible complexity, or Biblical History as "science". Theres really nothing we can do but bid each other well and keep going .
I understand here you come from and where youre going, Just so you understand I aint buyin anything you write about.
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 05:17 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
You actually believe medical research is an example of institutional bigotry??
. No. I believe in evolutionary biology. If I didn’t there would be no explanation for birth defects, genetically transferred medical problems, microbial resistance to antibiotics, selective breeding, hybrid seed corn, etc. . .

I believe random mutations in DNA can introduce new information (especially things like birth defects) but is totally incapable of providing the information for paradigm change like flight in birds or asexual to sexual reproduction.

The other reason I believe recognizing intelligence is important is when naive realism and subjective idealism is used to determine ontology. This is extremely important in the medical field when determining the legitimacy of physician assisted suicide, aborting innocent babies because their father was a rapist or the baby is an inconvenience, destroying human beings for scientific research etc. . . But, most importantly is when those procedures are forced on doctors or patients who do use naive realism and subjective idealism to determine how and why things are the way they are.

The bigotry comes in when you determine naturalism should be the sole philosophy used in interpreting scientific data and the only one presented in public schools, colleges medical schools, etc. . .

I believe naive realism and subjective idealism should be used in science and taught in school alongside naturalism in all subjects and at all levels. I want to present all views which is the view of a progressive fre thinker. You, on the other hand, want to limit it thought and teaching to naturalism which by definition is bigotry.

Quote:
I understand where you come from and where you are going, Just understand I ain’t buyin anything you write.


Well you can say you understand but, you can’t explain the origin of life, matter, gravity, sexual reproduction, flight. Etc. . .

Since naturalism alone can’t explain those things and naive realism using subjective idealism possibly could contribute to explaining them, the floor should be open to all reasonable philosophical discussion at all times.
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 05:23 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
Id rather fight it out where we all can see and judge the logic and evidence in our arguments. Quora doesnt really allow me to tell you that I think your views may be fulla ****

Congrats, you win. Fantastic finish farmer.

Hope no one missed that fantastic logic and evidence.
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 05:42 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
we were starting at 10000 m and had a coupla more thousand to the top, and all o us were totally out of breath

I see your followers don’t question your feats of climbing any more closely than they do your evolution arguments.
edgarblythe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 05:49 pm
@Leadfoot,
So you must be calling fm a liar.
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 06:18 pm
@edgarblythe,
Are you unwilling or unable to read and decide for yourself?
Do you see a problem? Do you accept everything he says without question or are you even paying attention?

Let me just say - I rest my case.
0 Replies
 
Helloandgoodbye
 
  1  
Reply Wed 13 Jun, 2018 06:31 pm
@farmerman,
Farmerman, farmerman. It is not surprising evolutionary religious gurus are more common in a culture where one of the main false teachings is evolutionism is it? Sitting in chairs, who cares.

Biological and medical sciences can survive, and thrive just fine without religious teachings like panspermia, and monkey to man teachings;)

You sound like an Islamist extremist....(because you are a religious extremist) ‘deny the popular belief, and there will be consequences you say’

All false information will soon be no longer part of this world, so do as you please. Preach n teach what u wish. Even something as unscientific as panspermia, whales with legs, bliions of years, abiogenesis, reptiles with feathers etc.
Isaiah 11:9 ‘a day is coming soon when the knowledge of the Lord will cover the earth as water covers the sea’

It saddens my heart to know u and do many others are caught up in such a lie:(
 

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