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Latest Challenges to the Teaching of Evolution

 
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 02:48 pm
@Setanta,
Oh I enjoy it . I get some really good stuff froom his worldview . I wanna har about where Jesus gave him his insights to the fossil record.
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 02:50 pm
@Setanta,
I did collapse the last thread he was on because it just got too ridiculous and his buddy Leadfoot was getting whiney.
0 Replies
 
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 02:57 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
doesnt that presume that you first KNOW something about how"all the systems coexist and are composed or originate?


I don't presume anything, I am not God nor am I smart enough to know things by presumption.

Quote:
1. you ignore the age of the earth and the evidence for the appearance of sveral genera (including hominids and hominins).
2. Youve asserted that youve "back engineered an Intelligence but thats just you blowin smoke out your ass (I humbly submit based on your reticence to "Share" your deep insights of life and "BJ's biochemistry" .


Instead, I ask the proper questions and then do as thorough of a study of all the the available evidence so as to reach as clear of an understanding of how the systems coexist as I can that day. After 30 years It is getting clearer.

Quote:
1. you ignore the age of the earth and the evidence for the appearance of sveral genera (including hominids and hominins).]
No I don't. I believe the Earth is very old. Most dating processes are based on the presumption that:

1. The entire universe that has a 300 billion light year diameter today, had a diameter of .5 milimeters at the initiation of the Big Bang and all helium and hydrogen came into existence near that point in space by some unexplained natural process.

2. That the universe was deteriorating everywhere and all the time in the same way it is today.

I believe those two presumptions are wrong because the data suggests otherwise.

I believe:

A. Matter existed before the Big Bang. ( and more than likely all matter)

B. The only thing that has inflated since the Big Bang is matter and the Higgs Field where it interacts with matter. And, that change in spatial density caused by the uneven inflation between:

1. matter and the higgs field that interacts with matter
and
2. the higgs field that doesn't interact with matter because, in empty space there is no matter

And, that is why we have gravity and the different. nuclear forces we observe and experience.

I think the evidence supports.

1. The Big Bang is a inflationary transition event where the rate of decay started to change and, that change occurred from the center of the universe and worked out from there over a long period of time. (and that is what Hubble observed is his Red Shift and, we observe in the density fluctuations from the WMAP.)
2. The Big Bang could possibly be the events described in the Bible and other ancient oral traditions as the flood event and, the Earth is the actual Ark of Noah.

Quote:
1. you ignore the age of the earth and the evidence for the appearance of sveral genera (including hominids and hominins).
2. Youve asserted that youve "back engineered an Intelligence but thats just you blowin smoke out your ass (I humbly submit based on your reticence to "Share" your deep insights of life and "BJ's biochemistry" .


I think biochemistry is a very small part of the entire story and was quite different before the Big Bang Transition event.

Quote:
3. You seem to rely on folk stories over evidence and if evidence refutes your folk tales, you cling to the folk tales. Kinda baloneyish Id say.


In think it is baloneyish to assume the universe had a diameter .5 milimeters and the order in matter popped out of nothing. They have no evidence suggesting that is true pure beyond speculation. Plus they have no explanation for why we have gravity and the nuclear forces. I do. It has to do with entropic gravity.
0 Replies
 
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 03:00 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
a. Geology is quite able to map the comings and goings of continental land masses and supercontinents through time. We have a perfectly good record of the EOCENE and there was NO Flood worldwide during this epoch (LET ALONE ONE FOR THE ENTIRE UNIVERSE)> You gotta remember that "Ancient Aliens TV show" Is just entertainment by a bunch of pseudo archeological/cosmological CLOWNS.
It was not a flood of water (though there might have been floods because of it.) It was a universe wide inflationary event. Geology is correct and fits into this theory. Though when glaciers cover most of the Earth with water that could be described in legends as a flood.
Leadfoot
 
  2  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 04:19 pm
@izzythepush,
Oh that’s rich, a supposed science supporter attempting to defend his science error by claiming he believes in science.

Got a citation to support that laughable claim of what came before the B.B.?
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 04:25 pm
@Leadfoot,
Why would I want to do that? You're going to believe a load of bollocks regardless, and I really don't give a ****.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 05:12 pm
@brianjakub,
I have to admit that I have no answer to all that, youll need to consult someone else.
Im sorta limited by facts and evidence, and interests. You seem to provide me none of the above.



brianjakub
 
  0  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 05:23 pm
@farmerman,
I am organizing it. I shouldnt have to. Scientists know in their heart that it is ridiculous to claim the universe had a diameter of . 5 milimeters before the big bang and that gravity can exist without matter and qm and relativity just appeared obe day. As someone not making a living in the scientific community i guess i have the freedom to use the philosophy of common sense realism that is necessary to tie it all together.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 06:30 pm
@brianjakub,
that and a coupla beers and i d say some of the same stuff, except I would try my hand at sci fiction.


Much of physics has an incongruity level. That gravity can be the driver of the consolidation of energy and be responsible for H He and Li , th urther interruption by other nuclei had led to nucleosynthesis. This may seem incomprehensible but, by solar and nebular spectra, it is strongly evidenced.(You doint like this hypotheses cause it is so devoid of stories and lessons and morals),
maybe thats the one thing religions can provide (if they ever get done with their primacy battles).
I dont think many people are gonna buy your stories, no matter how you claim that youve "back engineered" a designer.(Thats just an example of set's " word salad " you continually draft and use -you probably heard someone here use "back engineering" or "bucket chem" and decided to adopt it .
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 06:46 pm
@izzythepush,
That’s what I thought you’d say.

One more I’m done with.
Anyone new got something original here?
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Sun 27 May, 2018 10:15 pm
@brianjakub,
Quote:
Scientists know in their heart that it is ridiculous to claim the universe had a diameter of . 5 milimeters before the big bang and that gravity can exist without matter and qm and relativity just appeared obe day
how many dimensions are we talking about? and what do you think they describe?
izzythepush
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 May, 2018 01:33 am
@Leadfoot,
That's what science is, original new discoveries as opposed to musty old superstition.
0 Replies
 
brianjakub
 
  0  
Reply Mon 28 May, 2018 11:14 am
@farmerman,
Quote:
that and a coupla beers and i d say some of the same stuff, except I would try my hand at sci fiction.


The whole universe .5 mm in diameter. Science is already there. Im pullin them back to reality.

Quote:
Much of physics has an incongruity level.
Not if you understand the big picture. Incongruity is caused by a lacking of an objective point of view.

Quote:
That gravity can be the driver of the consolidation of energy and be responsible for H He and Li , th urther interruption by other nuclei had led to nucleosynthesis.


Energy cannot be consolidated by gravity without fully formed atoms existing. Gravity can only consolidate matter.

Quote:
This may seem incomprehensible but, by solar and nebular spectra, it is strongly evidenced.(You doint like this hypotheses cause it is so devoid of stories and lessons and morals),


It is easy to understand. You and I can understand that by colliding small atoms like H, He, and Li that they "may" fuse into larger atoms by nucleosynthesis. But we can only imagine that is happening. Scientists don't know what is going on inside a star. They are speculating because they know what they are made of and what they appear to be emitting. The heavy atoms could be formed in the star or, they could have been there the entire time the star existed (because they were put there.

Anyway, the net result must be less matter as some matter is always turned into energy by fusion and the creation of the light elements is even more speculative than the heavy as you pointed out by physics having an level of incongruity. I would says phgysics as mainstream science understands it has incongruity but, reality and how I understand physics does not.

Quote:
I dont think many people are gonna buy your stories, no matter how you claim that youve "back engineered" a designer.(Thats just an example of set's " word salad " you continually draft and use -you probably heard someone here use "back engineering" or "bucket chem" and decided to adopt it .
If a biased purely atheistic naturalistic philosophical approach is a prerequisite instead of being open to a common sense realism philosophical approach also, I agree.

My ideas are correct. I am working on my word salad. I know that you could decipher it if you want to look at it from a common sense realist approach. I am not smarter than you,

I just asked the right questions and then looked for the answers.
brianjakub
 
  0  
Reply Mon 28 May, 2018 11:18 am
@farmerman,


Looks like somebody just dropped all the species of after some catastrophic universe wide event.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 May, 2018 03:45 pm
@brianjakub,
more likely its because evolution never quits going nd most species for which we even have DNA are those from 100-200 K.

Occom had a razor
he used it very day
"the simplest answer's still the best"
is what he'd always say.

I THANK YOUU
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Mon 28 May, 2018 03:56 pm
@brianjakub,
Quote:
Im pullin them back to reality
what then is the{ To } dimension of your universe?? and what evidence can you cobble together to support it and how many dimensions can you play?

Quote:
Energy cannot be consolidated by gravity without fully formed atoms existing. Gravity can only consolidate matter.
then you didnt understand what I said.

Quote:
My ideas are correct.
the last words of fool.
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 May, 2018 04:09 pm
@farmerman,
They dont have dna for 90 %. Something else is going on.
brianjakub
 
  1  
Reply Mon 28 May, 2018 04:12 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
then you didnt undestand what i said
but, i want to. Clarify please.
0 Replies
 
brianjakub
 
  2  
Reply Mon 28 May, 2018 04:13 pm
@farmerman,
They are correct because they are not my ideas. I am just the messenger. God is no fool.
0 Replies
 
Leadfoot
 
  1  
Reply Tue 29 May, 2018 07:39 am
@brianjakub,
Quote:
And yet—another unexpected finding from the study—species have very clear genetic boundaries, and there's nothing much in between.

"If individuals are stars, then species are galaxies," said Thaler. "They are compact clusters in the vastness of empty sequence space."

The absence of "in-between" species is something that also perplexed Darwin, he said.

Read more at: https://phys.org/news/2018-05-gene-survey-reveals-facets-evolution.html#jCp

Stuff like this always sets them off. Smacks of ‘ Too much design and not enough evolution' : )
0 Replies
 
 

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