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Latest Challenges to the Teaching of Evolution

 
 
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Feb, 2012 10:06 am
@farmerman,
Quote:
Once again you have little understanding of what you write.


I have some understanding. Whether it is "little" or not is not for me to judge. It is what it is. You asserting that it is "little" is what I would expect you to say.

Quote:
Did you just look that up and are trying to insert it into your scribbles so that I would be impressed at your depth of knowledge or, as I think, are you just tossing cooked pasta onto the backsplash?


It's obvious really. Things like welfare provision and regulation of inter-state commerce make co-operative federalism a necessity. Strict constitutional reliance would produce gridlock. And I am not trying to impress anybody. I merely offer viewers a part of the other side of the picture in case it not being offered would result in you silly sods running things which would be an unmitigated disaster.

I don't cook and I eat very little pasta as I find it bland. If I did cook it I would avoid tossing it onto the backsplash as far as I was able.

I don't endorse Creationism in science classes unless it is handled by an expert. From what I understand the low wages and lack of esteem of teachers in schools is such that experts are few and far between in the profession.

Quote:
Oh so you claim that Im covered under a Hatch Act.


I claimed no such thing. I merely asked for your thoughts on the Hatch Acts which seem to consist of the assertion that it/ they have fallen into desuetude. Which proves my point about co-operative federalism.

It isn't a question of your membership of the scientific priesthood. It is a question of whether you received federal appropriations and if you did whether doing so renders your participation in a highly charged political debate on one side illegal under the Constitution.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Feb, 2012 11:50 am
@spendius,
Quote:
I don't endorse Creationism in science classes unless it is handled by an expert.
You are often unintentionally hilarious. However all that aside an "expert" in the SCience of Creationism would be who?

Quote:
It is a question of whether you received federal appropriations and if you did whether doing so renders your participation in a highly charged political debate on one side illegal under the Constitution.
Quite a stretch spendi. I suppose you are free to search out case law on this question, Ive been active in local and state politics for years while I taught, did funded research, or was a mining consultant in private industry. I have never been challenged and , in partisan politics, "getting you with a problem of ethics" is like strawberry jam for opponents.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Feb, 2012 12:07 pm
@farmerman,
Quote:
You are often unintentionally hilarious.


Unintentionally is an assertion. What would you do without the jolly old assertion? I do believe you would become speechless.

Quote:
However all that aside an "expert" in the SCience of Creationism would be who?


I would give it a try if you know a school board which would let me.

I wouldn't expect you to have been challenged on your infractions of the constitutional legislation in the Hatch Acts which I take it you are confessing to. That is an obvious example of co-operative federalism.

I think the Hatch Acts were a response to a feeling that federal funds should not go to anyone seeking to undermine American ideology. I suppose Senator McCarthy was due to the use to which a close reading of law could be put in order to promote oneself.
cicerone imposter
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Feb, 2012 12:28 pm
@spendius,
"Unintentionally" is well used, and applies to most of your posts. I concur with fm; that's the reason I continue to read your posts. It's really hilarious most of the time, and the daily laughter helps keep me in a good mood.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Feb, 2012 02:02 pm
@cicerone imposter,
tch Acts on his brain this week. Next week itll probably be the HAwley Smoot TArriffs
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Feb, 2012 02:52 pm
@farmerman,
Legislation on tariffs is certainly an interesting field of study. We had a case about 20, maybe 30, years ago when it was discovered that the US government had a list of constituencies in Great Britain where certain famous products were manufactured. Harris tweed comes to mind but there were many others. Melton Mowbray pork pies.

These constituencies were threatened by targeted tariffs if proposed changes to steel tariffs were introduced.

But that is by the bye.

I had been under the impression that certain provisions in the Taft-Hartley Act had been applied by the courts more strenuously in regard to teachers in schools and universities than others on the grounds of the undesirability of permitting the dissemination of subversive doctrines from the teacher's dias and the professorial chair. A point I made years ago. Teachers being required to take loyalty oaths.

I suppose Senator McCarthy focussed so much on Hollywood precisely because of the educational aspect of films.

Some of these sorts of provisions have extended to people working for private firms engaged on government contracts which, as I'm sure you know, must be a very large number. It would probably be a stretch to envisage such firms as those supplying bagels to the PX being included but there are many other contracts of a more technological kind to which a similar justification as that applied to teachers, professors, writers, film-makers and media generally. The educative function of recorded music being notorious for its efficiency.

As you often remind me I know very little about these sorts of things so I thought you being an expert on the ground, in the thick of it so to speak, could supply me, and possibly others, with some guidance.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Feb, 2012 03:57 pm
@spendius,
I should have said that the number of constituencies whose world famous product was threatened by special tariffs was significantly larger than the majority the governing party had in the House. As also with the number of marginals.

BTW Our parties are not like yours. You have no whipping system because, I assume, those seeking election in far flung states, and districts of states, are not as dependent on being a member of a disciplined centralised party as our MPs are. Lose the Party whip here because of voting incorrectly and they are finished except in exceptional circumstances.

And the discipline is especially rigorous when small parliamentary majorities are operating the levers. Some laxity is permitted with safe majorities.

And this is the area of battle between Federalisers and States Rightsers which has gone to the Feds here long ago.

The question is, from a scientific point of view, the Roosevelt position opposed by President Wilson. Is federalism necessary to compete in a global competitive economy or will States Rights serve better.

The NUCL and the NCSE are obviously federalisers. As are Democrats. I don't really know which side I'm on. I don't give a **** actually. It's just interesting. But I think federalisers will win eventually. And I think Gingrich is more that than Romney. Him being a Washington man. The Tea Party is further out.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Feb, 2012 04:12 pm
@spendius,
How 50 such disparate states are held together in a national coalition without obeying the laws of entropy is a fascinating subject. I once read that California is in the top five economies in the world.

We saw the governess of a southern state, Arkansas maybe, giving the President a wigging on the tarmac next to Air Force One with her forefinger jabbing the air close to his nose.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Feb, 2012 04:32 pm
@spendius,
Lesse, its 11:30 PM where youre at, That answers everything .
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Feb, 2012 06:19 pm
@farmerman,
It was 22.12 hrs when I posted that fm. It was the last thing I did before setting off for the pub where we discussed the advantages and disadvantages of vasectomy.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 6 Feb, 2012 06:21 pm
@spendius,
It's alright. I confessed and was forgiven.
0 Replies
 
wandeljw
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Feb, 2012 04:42 am
INDIANA UPDATE
Quote:
House Panel Leader Leery Of Creationism Bill
(The Associated Press, February 7, 2012)

The leader of the Indiana House Education Committee said a proposal specifically allowing public schools to teach creationism in science classes could be unworkable.

The bill approved by the state Senate would permit creationism as long as it included origin of life theories from multiple religions including Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism and Scientology.

Education Chairman Robert Behning said he believes it would be almost impossible to find teachers who would know about origin beliefs from so many religions.

The Indianapolis Republican said he isn't sure whether his committee will take up the bill.

Critics argue that the proposal is unconstitutional since federal courts repeatedly have found teaching creationism violates church-state separation. Senate supporters say the broader religious reference improves the bill's chances of being ruled constitutional.
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Feb, 2012 05:50 am
@wandeljw,
wandeljw wrote:

INDIANA UPDATE
Quote:
House Panel Leader Leery Of Creationism Bill
(The Associated Press, February 7, 2012)

The leader of the Indiana House Education Committee said a proposal specifically allowing public schools to teach creationism in science classes could be unworkable.

The bill approved by the state Senate would permit creationism as long as it included origin of life theories from multiple religions including Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Hinduism, Buddhism and Scientology.

Education Chairman Robert Behning said he believes it would be almost impossible to find teachers who would know about origin beliefs from so many religions.

The Indianapolis Republican said he isn't sure whether his committee will take up the bill.

He's right, the only way to make this workable is to boil it down to just one religion, let's pick one at random... hmmm, let's say, .... Christianity for example.
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Feb, 2012 06:01 am
@rosborne979,
Quote:
He's right, the only way to make this workable is to boil it down to just one religion, let's pick one at random... hmmm, let's say, .... Christianity for example....


That's right, and the religion is definitely not Christianity. In order to have an apples/apples comparision, you'd need a religion which operated on an intellectual level similar to that of evolution and the only two halfway plausible possibilities are Voodoo and Rastifari and even that is somewhat of an insult to the voodoooers and Rastas.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RWpU8sX10_4

https://encrypted-tbn2.google.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS2ZSOJ4hApnKI6Zgo_Gt_CeuBLd7ZazSwD7Th6Vqnl6_7twc1Alw
gungasnake
 
  2  
Reply Wed 8 Feb, 2012 06:05 am
http://images4.cpcache.com/product/132200724v8_460x460_Front_Color-Black.jpg

Rastafari does not involve any sort of a trans-finite sequence of zero-probability events or probabilistic miracles; it beats evoloserism hands down.
rosborne979
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Feb, 2012 06:06 am
@gungasnake,
gungasnake wrote:
Rastafari does not involve any sort of a trans-finite sequence of zero-probability events or probabilistic miracles
Neither does evolution.
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Feb, 2012 06:07 am
http://unitedreggae.com/images/movie/poster/aff-rastafari--the-journey-of-jah-people.jpg
0 Replies
 
izzythepush
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 8 Feb, 2012 06:07 am
@gungasnake,
You do sound like someone who smokes a lot of skunk.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Feb, 2012 06:08 am
@rosborne979,
Quote:
Neither does evolution.



BZZZZZZT!! WRONG ANSWER!!!

Quote:
"The likelihood of the formation of life from inanimate matter is one to a
number with 40,000 noughts after it... It is big enough to bury Darwin and
the whole theory of Evolution. There was no primeval soup, neither on this
planet nor on any other, and if the beginnings of life were not random,
they must therefore have been the product of purposeful intelligence."

Sir Fred Hoyle
Nature, Nov 12, 1981, p. 148
gungasnake
 
  -1  
Reply Wed 8 Feb, 2012 06:12 am
http://infohemp.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/Jah-rastafari.gif
0 Replies
 
 

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