Latest Challenges to the Teaching of Evolution

@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

I know that during our generation of "growing up," our parents never talked about sex.

Neither did our's. And thank goodness for that. I'm sure it would have been much less fun otherwise. And how could they anyway to someone who owes their existence to the "event"?

Quote:

You know the event, brother
Toby, -- 'tis too melancholy a one to be
repeated now, -- when the few animal
spirits I was worth in the world, and
with which memory, fancy, and quick
parts should have been convey'd, -- were
all dispersed, confused, confounded, scat-
tered, and sent to the devil.

Tristram Shandy. Vol IV. My Father's Lamentations. Inserted between Chapters XIX and XX. A sort of aside. Uncle Toby's sister being the conveyance. Brother means brother-in-law.

Such events are not abstractions.

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

, we welcomed it for our kids.

I hope they were suitably grateful. Some people think that modern parents are so envious of their kids having the fun they had finding out about sex themselves that they'll do anything to stop them having the same fun. I think there might be a germ of truth buried somewhere at the bottom of that.

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@cicerone imposter,

Quote:

but our two kids do not belong to any religion.

Which suggests that not belonging to any religion can be passed down from parents to offspring. Just as belonging to a religion can be.

It's obviously a feather in your cap once the assumption you start with is granted.

1 Reply

@Ionus,

Ionus wrote:

Which side were you on again ? It is difficult to tell.

It shouldn't be hard to tell. I've been on A2K over 10 years and posted over 10000 times. My position should be very clear.

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@rosborne979,

Yeah--it's the ostrich position. Head in the sand, arse in the air.

ros only deals with posts he can make sarcastic remarks about. Arguments are on Ignore.

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@spendius,

The only difference being that when both parents are religious, they not only convert their children into it, but try to also convert others into their religion.

Atheists don't promote anything, because there's nothing to promote.

What I find interesting are the many countries in Central Asia that are considered Muslim countries have laws against promoting religion.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

Atheists don't promote anything, because there's nothing to promote.

I would quibble with that a bit CI.

I suspect most atheist parents don't promote atheism directly to their kids, but I do suspect that they promote critical thinking and an open exploration of available knowledge, and I suspect that they also promote a naturalistic viewpoint from which to evaluate things. With those things as a foundation most kids probably follow that philosophy.

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, parents can't help imparting their own experiences and perspective onto their kids, whether they do it intentionally or not. It's just they way people (kids) learn things and the way people (parents) behave.

And then beyond the parents, society itself indoctrinates purely by virtue of being the environment kids grow up on. Some things just can't be avoided.

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He's brilliant is our ros.

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@rosborne979,

Your kind of quibbling is acceptable.

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@cicerone imposter,

We know that ci. You're really into talking about critical thinking and the exploration of available knowledge, and promoting a naturalistic viewpoint from which to evaluate things as an effort free method of avoiding doing any of them. It's very noticeable.

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@rosborne979,

Pretty much how it was in my house growing up. An absence of God and then at the age of 10 or so we started going to the Ethical Society.

Quote:

Key to the founding of Ethical Culture was the observation that too often disputes over religious or philosophical doctrines have distracted people from actually living ethically and doing good. Consequently, "Deed before creed" has long been a motto of the movement.

I don't remember my parents ever saying anything against deists, even though it burned me up that I had to say a prayer in class every morning.

1 Reply

@panzade,

Cripes pan. If that burned you up how do you think you would feel if your poverty stricken village had been washed away in a flood? You need a sense of proportion or somebody might think you're a serious racist. Who taught you English?

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Quote:

Fox & Friends' latest extremist guest and convicted child abuser blames teen pregnancy on teaching evolution in school
(by Brooke Obie, MediaMatters.org, August 30, 2010)

In a strikingly short interview, Fox News' Fox & Friends' Juliet Huddy hosted anti-abortion activist Bob Enyart to discuss the availability of birth control to students at a Colorado school, who have their parents' consent. Ignoring Enyart's multiple convictions and jail sentences that included abusing his stepson, as well as his history of outlandish and disrespectful behavior towards victims of AIDS, Fox gave Enyart a platform to say that the reason teen pregnancy has increased in Denver is because "Kids are told that they're animals...and we shouldn't be shocked when they behave like animals." It's no surprise that Huddy cut him off pretty early on in his rant:

BOB ENYART (COLORADO RIGHT TO LIFE): This fails because it's wrong. Adam city high school, a denver suburb tried this. The pregnancy rate went up 40% and the headlines nationwide were 108 babies born in one school year. It's a tragedy. God did not make 14-year-old girls to be used by boys. This is a mistake.

HUDDY: But the fact is in Denver, 41 1/2 out of every 1,000 girls, 15 to 17 have babies. That's a pretty high number.

ENYART: That -- the major reason for that is that our school curriculum today all over the country is officially godless. Kids are told that they're animals, that they've evolved from animals and then we shouldn't be shocked when they behave like animals. We need to teach kids that they're special. Girls are worth waiting for. They're worth waiting until marriage. They're not there to be used by boys and this policy --

HUDDY: Lori [Casillas (COLORADO YOUTH MATTER)] -- go ahead, real quick, "this policy" - Ok, Lori, I I want to get your side. I'm sorry, I'm sorry Bob, to cut you off. I need to get to Lori, though.

After a brief rebuttal by Lori Casillas, from Colorado Youth Matter, the interview was abruptly over, signaling that perhaps producers regretted having Enyart on to spout his views about evolution being taught in schools and "girls" not being taught to "wait...until marriage."

Fox hosted the same Enyart who, in 1999, was convicted of misdemeanor child abuse for beating his now-stepson with a belt, and served 60 days in jail. Enyart was jailed again in 2009 after being convicted of trespassing during an anti-abortion protest of the Focus on the Family headquarters. He also excused the murder of Dr. George Tiller by an anti-abortion extremist as simply "an occupational hazard," and likened Tiller to a "Mafia hit man," saying: "If a Mafia hit man gets killed, people recognize it's an occupational hazard."

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@wandeljw,

Jeepers Mr Wilson!

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@wandeljw,

To paraphrase Mr. Mencken, nobody ever went broke underestimating the intelligence of the American public. Faux News proves this every day.

1 Reply

@wandeljw,

Quote:

God did not make 14-year-old girls to be used by boys.

Evolution does that I believe. If our God doesn't forbid it then the only way to stop it is to punish the girls and, if they can be identified, the boys as well.

Quote:

the interview was abruptly over, signaling that perhaps producers regretted having Enyart on to spout his views about evolution being taught in schools and "girls" not being taught to "wait...until marriage."

Whatever is said about Fox it is a big player in Media. And Media is strongly in favour of getting rid of our God for very obvious reasons. Fox is owned by News Corporation which has appeared on this thread in various disguises.

It is wrong to beat a kid with a belt and Enyart deserved his 60 days. I would have given him two years. But that doesn't alter his statement or discredit it.

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@spendius,

I understand that you are not condoning Enyart's behavior, but only agreeing with his statement. Enyart's position that teaching evolution is to blame for the high rate of teen pregnancy reminds me of statements that you have made, spendi. Is your position basically the same as Enyart's?

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@spendius,

Quote:

It is wrong to beat a kid with a belt and Enyart deserved his 60 days. I would have given him two years. But that doesn't alter his statement or discredit it.

It is, perhaps, just like the infinite number of monkeys typing on an infinite number of laptops, SURELY, one will write King Lear.

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@Setanta,

I hope that Mr Mencken has a whirl in his grave everytime some jockstrap repeats his elitist crap in order to sound off on his superior horn. He's some snob is our Setanta.

And Fox News is no different from any other major news channel.

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@wandeljw,

Quote:

Is your position basically the same as Enyart's?

Not really wande. He's too coy and might be milking a shock/horror udder. He does start out that teenage pregnancy is a bad thing. My position is that I would expect every female to get pregnant as soon as she becomes capable. That's because I understand evolution and you lot are just playing at it for various personal reasons. Withdraw religious sanctions inhibiting natural drives and all you have left are state sanctions. You do want sanctions to restrict teenage pregnancies don't you? Why I can't imagine from the position you promote. What state sanctions would you recommend wande? The ones the older women want??

You do know I presume that the first foals of young mares command premium prices at yearling auctions. I imagine quality of the foal has been scientifically measured to fall off as the age of the mare increases. With cash.

Which tells me that pro-evolutionists should encourage teenage pregnancy. You could get five, maybe six, generations a century and what self respecting species wouldn't go for that?

Veblen said that the illegitimacy rate represented the triumph of the hormones over the proprietries. An evolutionist can be in favour of nothing else and should condemn any interference with the natural process.

1 Reply

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