Solius Symbiosus
 
  1  
Reply Tue 19 Jun, 2012 04:38 pm
@spendius,
spendius wrote:
Quote:
And vast areas of eastern Russia are permafrost.


And vast areas of abyssal plains. Hence, the reason that the "top hat" solution to the Macondo well blow out(Deep Water Horizon) didn't work.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 03:25 am
@Solius Symbiosus,
I disagree. oceanic methyl hydrates are fom the biological reduction of CO2. About 25 years ago A major oil company did a recovery test off the CAlif Coast in the
Clathrate zone" (at about 3 to 400 m) and when collected, there was significant crystallization of "new" hydrates.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 04:49 am
@farmerman,
Yes--but clathrates in the deeps are insulated from changes in temperature to a far greater extent than the permafrost. The point is, I think, that man-made warming releases methane from the permafrost causing a multiplying cascade.

The underwater situation is insulated, in the short run at least, and the potential of it has nothing to do with the cascade envisioned by some doomsayers.

Pointing out the vastness of oceanic clathrates is irrelevant to the situation on land. Because methane and other greenhouse gases are trapped in the sea is not an argument about the release of these gases from the permafrost.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Fri 22 Jun, 2012 06:41 am
@spendius,
fm--do you think there are any clathrates of ungovernable jealousies affecting the climate of opinion regarding future weather patterns?
0 Replies
 
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 9 Jul, 2012 10:01 am
@farmerman,
new site called FRAC FOCUS is, under the reuirements of Pq Act 13, publishing the mixture of chemicals used in the frcking operations in PA.
So I dont run afoul of the TOC's herein, youll just hve to Google the term FRAC FOCUS .

You can see that theres some onyteresting stuff used and while most of it is marginally of concern, some can be a bit on the dangerous side wrt ground water resources
spendius
 
  2  
Reply Mon 9 Jul, 2012 10:44 am
@farmerman,
Who are you addressing fm.

Why no answer to my question?

We can only assume that there are some clathrates of ungovernable jealousies and you don't care to say so for obvious reasons. Your scientific integrities I mean.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Mon 9 Jul, 2012 03:00 pm
@spendius,
Quote:
We can only assume that there are some clathrates of ungovernable jealousies and you don't care to say so for obvious reasons. Your scientific integrities I mean.
Better have another round , for you are ALMOST making sense here. PS your last sentence above, is not even a sentence.

Im using this as a semi journalling exercise. It allows me to cache my own thoughts and findings on this subject and to communicate them with whoever is followingthe events in the severl states. There are some folks out in A2K land who are truly interested in this subject (some pssionately so). Im merely providing some information that the interested reader will probably not be aware.
spendius
 
  1  
Reply Mon 9 Jul, 2012 03:18 pm
@farmerman,
I will decide what a sentence is.

There is fracking going on near Blackpool. There have been numerous items on local TV about the operation. I don't take much notice of them.

The Arabs can render every search for an alternative to their oil inefficient simply by turning the tap open more. They have us by the short hairs thanks to the debacle in 1956.

farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 9 Jul, 2012 03:27 pm
@spendius,
not really. Based upon conservation and more fuel efficient cars, coupled with the new techniques of slant drilling and fracking,the US is, for the first time in 3 decades, a net EXPORTER of oil,"wet gas" ad finished product.

The Areabs (especially Saudi, have no desire to create any hortfalls that could drive the world back over the edge of financial ruin once again.

Qhwn you say "Fracking in Blackpool" is this another of your attempts t humor or are you serious? What are they fracking within
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 9 Jul, 2012 03:33 pm
@farmerman,
Ive tuned into an update of world gas reservs and saw the gas fields in and around Blackpool. Seems that UK has about 25% ofUS reserves, Thats really a lot. China, ARgentina, and US are the world leaders in shale gas. Think large sedimentary basins in intercratonic fields. The geology fits and Im ure we will be exploring intensively in several AFrican countries (other than S Africa) and in abyssal plains
0 Replies
 
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Sep, 2012 07:27 am
BC commission finds seismic events linked to fracking
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Sep, 2012 09:37 am
@ehBeth,
Im using a wifi at a Tenn library. I think they still use tin cans and so I couldnt speedily open your link Beth---Any precis possible?
ehBeth
 
  1  
Reply Tue 4 Sep, 2012 10:10 am
@farmerman,
this piece from the big Cdn underwriting mag is a summary (apparently Shale Daily is the place to go for the full report)

The B.C. Oil and Gas Commission has penned several recommendations in response to its finding that anomalous seismicity in isolated areas of northeast British Columbia was the result of hydraulic fracturing.

“The investigation has concluded that the events observed within remote and isolated areas of the Horn River Basin between 2009 and 2011 were caused by fluid injection during hydraulic fracturing in proximity to pre-existing faults,” notes the commission’s report.

Fracking involves injecting water and other fluids at high pressure thousands of metres below the earth’s surface to crack shale rocks and release natural gas. The process has increasingly come under fire because of concerns over the possibility of water contamination and low-magnitude earthquakes, and fuelled discussions over the need for insurance coverage.

The B.C. commission became aware of the anomalous, low-level seismic events, only one of which was ‘felt’ at the earth’s surface, after they were recorded by Natural Resources Canada (NRCan) near areas of oil and gas development. “None of the NRCan-reported events caused any injury, property damage or posed any risk to public safety or the environment,” the commission states.

The report discusses the 38 NRCan-reported events, and 216 and 18 events, respectively, recorded by dense arrays deployed at Etsho and Kiwigana.
The commission’s recommendations include the following:
•submission of microseismic reports;
•establishment of a notification and consultation procedure;
•study of the relationship of hydraulic fracturing parameters on seismicity; and
•upgrading and improving B.C.’s seismograph grid and monitoring procedures.

Grid network upgrades have already begun, the report notes. “The upgraded grid will provide improved monitoring for induced seismicity and will form the basis for the monitoring, detection, notification and consultation procedure.”

Natural gas producers have voiced their support of the recommendations. The Canadian Association of Petroleum Producers is “in the process of finalizing operator guidelines and increasing financial support for more seismic monitoring in the region,” president Dave Collyer says in a statement.
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2012 05:55 am
@ehBeth,
An interesting aside is that the "abio bouys" are drumming up their mantra that we have an unending supply of nat gas in the planet. Yet, even with these new deposits like the Marcelluw and the Bakken and the Utica, they all lie within specific marine sediment deposits that form clearl;y identifiable fossil "basins" .

While there is a possibility for the Tropsch process to produce a certain amount of hc's, it is hardly an amount that can be added to a reserve estimate.

I heard one of these guys last week .I was listening to "Coast to Coast AM" a talk radio show of outrageous pseudo- science and weirdness and supernatural ****.
spendius
 
  0  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2012 06:09 am
@farmerman,
Any chance of a couple of the more startling examples of the "outrageous pseudo- science and weirdness and supernatural ****"?

Some of us have learned to treat assertions with a degree of suspicion. Just so we can peer-review them ourselves.
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2012 09:51 am
@spendius,
you should start a conversation with gunga about that, as he looks to "Coast to Coast AM" as one of his unassailable information sources.
You could share a coke with him.
spendius
 
  0  
Reply Fri 14 Sep, 2012 10:37 am
@farmerman,
You said you were listening to the programme.

Have you no quotes to give your assertion a toe in the water? Or are you only up for peer-reviewing when your peers are on the job?
farmerman
 
  2  
Reply Mon 17 Sep, 2012 07:09 am
@spendius,
no, I was "listening to the program" , there is a difference
spendius
 
  0  
Reply Mon 17 Sep, 2012 07:50 am
@farmerman,
Whatever!!

Any quotes?

I find assertions a bit suspicious. I can see from my thumbs that it's considered impolite. But what can I do about it. I can't stop myself from finding assertions suspicious. I would probably be divested of what wits I have if I did.

If one believed what everybody said on the basis that each and every spouter is an oracle of wisdom one would soon be walking upside down inside handcuffs saying "okay, I've had enough. What else can you show me?"
farmerman
 
  1  
Reply Mon 17 Sep, 2012 09:16 am
@spendius,
I use more paraphrases , since quotes often are only meant to impress rather than communicate.
 

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