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AMERICAN CONSERVATISM IN 2008 AND BEYOND

 
 
Debra Law
 
  0  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 02:46 pm
@okie,
okie wrote:

FedEx is not a fantasy. It is an American success story, born out of entrepeneurship and innovation. In fact, FedEx transports alot of the Postal Service mail, because it is more efficient than the Postal Service doing it themselves.

By the way, I would love to see the government open up small envelope mail to competition. What are they afraid of? Why not?


Fed Ex skims the profitable cream off the top of the package delivery industry and leaves the unprofitable, but necessary left-over work for the government to accomplish. Forget for all practical purposes that the postal service must maintain a huge national mail distribution system and workforce in order to get a credit card bill or a birthday card from one end of the country to a small town at the other end of the country for just 44 cents.

Okie fails to understand that private business, motivated by profit, would simply stop delivering mail to that small town because the cost of doing so cannot be justified.

Okie, in his unrealistic conservative fantasy world, demands that private business be allowed to skim the profitable cream off the letter delivery system and leave the unprofitable business to the government. He wants his wish fullfilled so that he can whine about the inefficiencies and costliness of big government when he drops that Christmas card in the outgoing U.S. mail system for delivery to grandma in small town Washington, North Dakota, Iowa, or Maine.
H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 02:53 pm
@Debra Law,


The government (USPS) hires FedEx to deliver what they can't and don't want to deliver.
FedEx does not skim, nor do they cherry pick. FedEx has share holders that hold them accountable.
FedEx is in business to provide a service at a profit. The USPS is mostly a jobs program that provides a service.
The USPS does not care if it makes a profit because it is funded by, and part of the government.
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 03:07 pm
@H2O MAN,
This gets to become a irony for conservatives; they say FedEx as a commercial enterprise is successful while USPS is a failure, but here waterboy claims FedEx is partially a government enterprise. LOL
Debra Law
 
  0  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 03:07 pm
@H2O MAN,
H2O MAN wrote:
The USPS is mostly a jobs program that provides a service.


How nice. You obviously don't value the service that the government is constitutionally empowered to provide to you. When the local letter carrier delivers your mail tomorrow, why don't you explain to him/her how angry you are about your tax dollars being used to partially fund the federal jobs program that hands him/her an undeserved paycheck every two weeks.
H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 03:11 pm
@Debra Law,
Debra Law wrote:

H2O MAN wrote:
The USPS is mostly a jobs program that provides a service.


How nice.


How nice and how true.

Why are you so angry DL?
0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 03:12 pm
@cicerone imposter,


cice girl now claims the USPS is a failure...
0 Replies
 
okie
 
  2  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 03:21 pm
@MontereyJack,
MontereyJack wrote:

Read parados's post, okie. He's right. FedEx cherrypicked part of the USPS service that it could make a profit on and left the rest of it, that it couldn't make the large amount of money on, to the government. If it had to do all kinds of mail and packages and delivder them to everybody, everywbere, as the USPS does, it wouldn't be profitable. Yet the Constitution established the PS because it thought it was a public good.

Same thing with HMOS ande insurance com[panies. thehy cherrypcik the healthiest, on whom they can make a profit, and leave the rest to the government, who have to service ALL the people.

Then why did the Postal Service let FedEx cherry pick what they did, if the Postal Service could do the cherrypicked portion cheaper? That is the first loophole in your argument. A second one is that UPS and FedEx do in fact deliver packages all over the country, to remote places, where even with a surcharge added still do not make a profit on some particular deliveries. Just as Walmart has loss leaders in their stores, thats the way businesses work, it isn't smart to cut out all activities, because those activities feed business into other sectors. Another example, businesses give free estimates because it feeds their businesses, even though doing estimates directly lose money in and of themselves.

The stupidity of government is now being demonstrated by eliminating GM dealers, apparently somewhat arbitrarily, from the top down, not determined from the bottom up, from the market itself.

If I was running the asylum, or the post office, I think there are countless things to take a look at in terms of improving service and efficiency. Number one, the people in the post office don't have to act like they are taking their last breath, or doing you one incredible favor, when they serve customers. We don't have to run the post office as if we are still in the 1800's.

I do in fact have a beef with insurance companies in regard to conditions not directly caused by people. Behaviorly caused rate differences by insurance companies, I do endorse those, such as smoking, etc., but other conditions, I do think some reform is needed, but you cannot allow people to not carry insurance until they get sick with something, then expect insurance companies to accept pre-existing conditions. That is another subject totally different than mail delivery.
H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 03:26 pm
@okie,
okie wrote:
... UPS and FedEx do in fact deliver packages all over the country, to remote places, where even with a surcharge added still do not make a profit on some particular deliveries.


True. I was once a delivery driver for UPS and you would not believe how that company bends over backwards to serve the customer.
0 Replies
 
Thomas
 
  3  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 03:59 pm
@Debra Law,
It's been a while, Debra, that I've taken Okie's side against yours. But this is such a time.

Debra Law wrote:
Okie fails to understand that private business, motivated by profit, would simply stop delivering mail to that small town because the cost of doing so cannot be justified.

I don't think that's true. Economics 101 would predict that if delivering mail to a small town is more expensive than delivering it between large cities, private businesses wouldn't stop delivering. Rather, they would continue delivering, and would charge the extra cost to their customers. Three points about that:

1) I haven't seen any actual evidence yet that Fedex, UPS, and friends are refusing to deliver to remote areas -- or that they're charging extra for it. Admittedly though, I haven't looked very hard either, so I'm always willing to learn.

2) I would have no problem if private businesses charged extra for delivering mail to the countryside. After all, our place of residence is a lifestyle choice like any other, and the burden of delivering mail to us is a cost of that choice like any other. Why should city-dwellers pay the costs that the lifestyle choices of boonie-dwellers impose on the mail system? That makes no sense to me -- just as it probably wouldn't make sense to you if boonie-dwellers were expected to pitch in for the city dwellers' higher rents.

3) That said, at 80 billion dollars, the USPS is small change compared with the federal budget as a whole. For comparison, if conservatives hadn't started a gratuitous war in Iraq, they could have financed two or three extra Postal Services with the savings. I don't understand why getting rid of the USPS would be such a high priority for conservatives.
H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 04:05 pm
@Thomas,
Thomas wrote:

It's been a while, Debra, that I've taken Okie's side against yours. But this is such a time.

Debra Law wrote:
Okie fails to understand that private business, motivated by profit, would simply stop delivering mail to that small town because the cost of doing so cannot be justified.

I don't think that's true. Economics 101 would predict that if delivering mail to a small town is more expensive than delivering it between large cities, private businesses wouldn't stop delivering. Rather, they would continue delivering, and would charge the extra cost to their customers. Three points about that:

1) I haven't seen any actual evidence yet that Fedex, UPS, and friends are refusing to deliver to remote areas -- or that they're charging extra for it. Admittedly though, I haven't looked very hard either, so I'm always willing to learn.

2) I would have no problem if private businesses charged extra for delivering mail to the countryside. After all, our place of residence is a lifestyle choice like any other, and the burden of delivering mail to us is a cost of that choice like any other. Why should city-dwellers pay the costs that the lifestyle choices of boonie-dwellers impose on the mail system? That makes more sense to me -- just as it probably wouldn't make sense to you if boonie-dwellers were expected to pitch in for the city dwellers' higher rents.




+1
0 Replies
 
Debra Law
 
  0  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 04:14 pm
Let's review USPS profitability:

February 9, 2007

USPS REPORTS FIRST QUARTER LOSS DUE TO FUNDING MANDATED BY NEW POSTAL LAW

New postal law requires funding of retiree health benefits

Quote:
WASHINGTON, D.C. - The U.S. Postal Service (USPS) reported a Fiscal Year 2007 first quarter loss of $2.7 billion due to the accelerated funding of retiree health benefits mandated by the Postal Accountability and Enhancement Act signed into law on Dec. 20, 2006. The law requires the Postal Service to substantially fund its share of these benefits by 2017. Operationally, the Postal Service would have otherwise achieved a net income of $1.2 billion, in line with its first quarter financial plan.

First Quarter Highlights

Revenue for the first quarter (ending December 31, 2006) was $19.7 billion, an increase of 6.4 percent over the first quarter last year. This increase was driven by a 2.3 percent increase in mail volume. Standard mail volume grew by 4.9 percent. First-Class Mail volume for the quarter was virtually flat in relation to the first quarter the previous year. Total Factor Productivity (TFP) increased by 1.9 percent over the first quarter of last year-the highest in the last eight quarters. TFP measures the relationship between workload and resource usage. The first quarter gain in productivity was driven by larger than expected growth in revenue and volume.

Finances Under New Postal Law

The new postal law eliminates the escrow previously required under Public Law 108-18 and reduces USPS payments into the Civil Service Retirement System (CSRS). The $3 billion in cash - that the Postal Service placed in a federally mandated escrow account in FY 2006 - is now designated to fund retiree health benefits. Generally Accepted Accounting Principles (GAAP) dictate the $3 billion be reported as an expense in the quarter in which the law was enacted.

For FY 2007, the new law mandates $5.4 billion to be placed in the newly created Postal Service Retiree Health Benefits Fund (PSRHBF). Consequently, the relief from this year's $3.3 billion planned escrow and the reduction of $1.5 billion in CSRS payments must be applied to the fund. The net result is a shortfall of $600 million for FY 2007.

"It's important to put this into perspective," said Chief Financial Officer H. Glen Walker. "Although this will have a multi-billion dollar impact on our reported financial results, the additional cash required is approximately $600 million."



Wow. That's great. The USPS generates enough income to be profitable at the current rates. But for the new legal requirement that the USPS must substantially fund its share retiree health benefits, there would be no operating shortfall at all.

Let's look at more figures comparing the quarter ending on December 31, 2007 and the quarter ending on December 31, 2008:

http://www.usps.com/financials/_pdf/FinalQuarterIFY0910Q.pdf

For the quarter ending December 2007, the USPS had operating revenue in excess of 20 billion and operating expenses in excess of 19 billion for a quarterly net PROFIT of 672 million dollars.

For the quarter ending December 2008, the USPS had operating revnue in excess of 19 billion and operating expenses in excess of 19 billion for a quarterly net LOSS of 384 million dollars.

Sometimes there are quarterly net profits, sometimes there are quarterly net losses--but in the grand scheme of things, the USPS is very cost efficient and provides a valuable service for ALL residents of the entire country. If need be, the Postal Regulatory Commission will increase postal rates. But even in the face of the new law that requires the USPS to substantially fund retiree health benefits, the USPS is doing quite well financially and our postage rates are affordable when considering, for 44 cents, the USPS will deliver a birthday card at the other end of the country for you.

BUT, GOSH DARN, why should those damn postal service employees (and retirees) get union-bargained salaries and a health care plan when so many other workers in this country don't get one???? After all, people like okie and H2Oman don't value the service that postal employees provide to this country. They would rather have private business suck all the profit out of the national mail delivery system and have our mail processed and delivered RELIABLY and LOVINGLY each and every day by an entire new class of unionless, low wage/no health benefit workers. God forbid that the workers who actually provide this service should be paid a respectable wage or have good benefits when excessively paid CEOs of private corporations are waiting in the wings to snatch up all those billions of dollars for themselves.

Anyway, didn't a congressman recently tell an average "joe the plumber" citizen at a town hall meetin' that if he wanted a good health care plan that he should get a job with the government?



0 Replies
 
cicerone imposter
 
  0  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 04:19 pm
@Thomas,
It's about your #3; government operations are always failures it seems to the conservatives.
H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 04:21 pm
@Thomas,
Thomas wrote:
I don't understand why getting rid of the USPS would be such a high priority.


I would never want to get rid of the USPS, but it would become a more efficient
money maker if the private sector managed it without any government melding.
Thomas
 
  0  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 04:23 pm
@cicerone imposter,
If the problem is government failure, cut the military budget by half. If the rest of the world can defend itself for 3% of its GDP, so can America.
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 04:24 pm
@H2O MAN,
But, as Debra just pointed out, the USPS is making money just fine!
ican711nm
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 04:26 pm
@Foxfyre,
Foxfyre wrote:
The Ninth and Tenth Amendments mean absolutely nothing today as Americans have developed a level of naive trust for Congress, the White House and the U.S. Supreme Court that would have astonished the founders, a trust that will lead to our undoing as a great nation.


The Ninth and Tenth Amendments mean absolutely nothing today to almost a third of the American voters who have developed a level of naive trust for Congress, the White House and the U.S. Supreme Court that would have astonished the founders, a trust that will eventually erode helping make America again a great nation.
0 Replies
 
H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 04:28 pm
@Thomas,
But, government meddling makes them less efficient than they should be and this inefficiency reduces profits.
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 04:31 pm
@H2O MAN,
And your evidence for that is ... what?
H2O MAN
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 04:33 pm
@Thomas,


You offered no evidence that government meddling increased efficiency and profit... why is that?
Thomas
 
  1  
Reply Wed 8 Jul, 2009 04:37 pm
@H2O MAN,
H2O MAN wrote:
You offered no evidence that government meddling increased efficiency and profit... why is that?

Because it's not what I claimed.

Anyway, you're not feeling any need to support the claim you made with evidence. Noted.
 

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