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Bush Supporters' Aftermath Thread V

 
 
Reply Wed 11 Jul, 2007 09:24 am
I know asking to keep this thread clear of the usual anti-Bush rhetoric, but I will ask anyways.
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Type: Discussion • Score: 0 • Views: 29,778 • Replies: 842
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Jul, 2007 09:25 am
Moving Forward in Iraq
The "surge" is working. Will Washington allow the current progress to continue?

BY KIMBERLY KAGAN
Wednesday, July 11, 2007 12:01 a.m. EDT

In Washington perception is often mistaken for reality. And as Congress prepares for a fresh debate on Iraq, the perception many members have is that the new strategy has already failed.

This isn't an accurate reflection of what is happening on the ground, as I saw during my visit to Iraq in May. Reports from the field show that remarkable progress is being made. Violence in Baghdad and Anbar Province is down dramatically, grassroots political movements have begun in the Sunni Arab community, and American and Iraqi forces are clearing al Qaeda fighters and Shiite militias out of long-established bases around the country.

This is remarkable because the military operation that is making these changes possible only began in full strength on June 15. To say that the surge is failing is absurd. Instead Congress should be asking this question: Can the current progress continue?

From 2004 to 2006, al Qaeda established safe havens, transport routes, vehicle-bomb factories and training camps in the rural areas surrounding Baghdad, where U.S. forces had little or no footprint. Al Qaeda used these bases to conduct bombings in Baghdad, to displace Shia and Sunni from local towns by sparking sectarian killings, and to force Iraqis to comply with the group's interpretation of Islamic law. Shiite death squads roamed freely around Baghdad and the countryside. The number of execution-style killings rose monthly after the Samarra mosque bombing of February 2006, reaching a high in December 2006. Iranian special operations groups moved weapons across the borders and into Iraq along major highways and rivers. U.S. forces, engaged primarily in training Iraqis, did little to disrupt this movement.

Today, Iraq is a different place from what it was six months ago. U.S. and Iraqi forces began their counterinsurgency campaign in Baghdad in February. They moved into the neighborhoods and worked side-by-side with Baghdadis. As a result, sectarian violence is down. The counterinsurgency strategy has dramatically decreased Shiite death squad activity in the capital. Furthermore, U.S. and Iraqi special forces have removed many rogue militia leaders and Iranian advisers from Sadr City and other locations, reducing the power of militias.

As a consequence, execution-style killings, the hallmark of Shiite militias, have fallen to the lowest level in a year; some Iranian- and militia-backed mortar teams firing on the Green Zone have been destroyed. Equally important, U.S. and Iraqi forces have restricted al Qaeda's bases to ever smaller areas of the city, so that reinforcements cannot flow easily from one neighborhood to another.

Many in Washington say the Baghdad Security Plan has just pushed the enemy to other locations in Iraq. Though some of the enemy certainly left Baghdad when the security plan began, this metaphor is inaccurate. The enemy has long been located outside of Baghdad and was causing violence from suburban bases. What has changed is the disposition of U.S. forces, which are now actively working to expel the enemy from its safe havens rather than ignoring them.

To accomplish this, Gens. David Petraeus and Raymond Odierno have encircled Baghdad with a double cordon of U.S. and Iraqi forces. They have been preparing the cordons patiently since February, as the new "surge" units arrived. The surge was completed only in mid-June, and the first phase of the large-scale operations it was intended to support began only on June 15. Since then, U.S. forces have begun blocking major road, river, and transportation route around Baghdad. They are also deployed in critical neighborhoods around outskirts and the interior of the city.

On June 15, Gens. Petraeus and Odierno launched a major offensive against al Qaeda strongholds all around Baghdad. "Phantom Thunder" is the largest operation in Iraq since 2003, and a milestone in the counterinsurgency strategy. For the first time, U.S. forces are working systematically throughout central Iraq to secure Baghdad by clearing its rural "belts" and its interior, so that the enemy cannot move from one safe haven to another. Together, the operations in Baghdad and the "belts" are increasing security in and around the capital.

U.S. and Iraqi forces are thereby attacking enemy strongholds and cutting supply routes all around the city, along which fighters and weapons moved freely in 2006. Coordinated operations south and east of Baghdad are at last interdicting the supply of weapons moving along the Tigris River to the capital. U.S. and Iraqi forces are operating east of Baghdad for the first time in years, disrupting al Qaeda's movement between bases on the Tigris and in Sadr City, a frequent target of its car bombs. North of Baghdad, U.S. forces recently cleared al Qaeda from the city of Baqubah, from which terrorists flowed into Baghdad. They are clearing al Qaeda's car bomb factories from Karmah, northwest of Baghdad, and its sanctuaries toward Lake Tharthar. These operations are supported by counterinsurgency operations west of the capital, from Fallujah to Abu Ghraib. U.S. forces are now, for the first time, fighting the enemy in the entire ring of cities and villages around Baghdad.

This is the Baghdad Security Plan, and its mission is to secure the people of Baghdad. Even so, commanders are not ignoring the outlying areas of Iraq. U.S. forces have killed or captured many important al Qaeda leaders in Mosul recently, and destroyed safe havens throughout northern Iraq. Troops are conducting counterinsurgency operations in Bayji, north of Tikrit. And Iraqi forces have "stepped up" to secure some southern cities. The Eighth Iraqi Army Division has been fighting Shiite militias in Diwaniyah, an important city halfway between Basrah and Baghdad. As commanders stabilize central Iraq, they will undoubtedly conduct successive operations in outlying regions to follow up on their successes and make them lasting.

The larger aim of the new strategy is creating an opportunity for Iraq's leaders to negotiate a political settlement. These negotiations are underway. Iraqi Prime Minister Nouri al-Maliki is attempting to form a political coalition with Amar al-Hakim and Kurdish political leaders, but excluding Moqtada al-Sadr, and has invited Sunnis to participate. He has confronted Moqtada al-Sadr for promoting illegal militia activity, and has apparently prompted this so-called Iraqi nationalist to leave for Iran for the second time since January.

Provincial and local government is growing stronger. Local and tribal leaders in Anbar, Diyala, Salah ad-Din, North Babil and even Baghdad have agreed to fight insurgents and terrorists as U.S. forces have moved in to secure the population alongside their Iraqi partners. As a result, the number of Iraqis recruited for the police forces, in particular, has risen exponentially since 2006.

This is war, and the enemy is reacting. The enemy uses suicide bombs, car bombs and brutal executions to break our will and that of our Iraqi allies. American casualties often increase as troops move into areas that the enemy has fortified; these casualties will start to fall again once the enemy positions are destroyed. Al Qaeda will manage to get some car and truck bombs through, particularly in areas well-removed from the capital and its belts.

But we should not allow individual atrocities to obscure the larger picture. A new campaign has just begun, it is already yielding important results, and its effects are increasing daily. Demands for withdrawal are no longer demands to pull out of a deteriorating situation with little hope; they are now demands to end a new approach to this conflict that shows every sign of succeeding.

Ms. Kagan, an affiliate of Harvard's John M. Olin Institute of Strategic Studies, is executive director of the Institute for the Study of War in Washington.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Jul, 2007 09:27 am
Can Bush Save the Surge?
0 Replies
 
woiyo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Jul, 2007 10:38 am
Is the "surge" really working to the extent that we can realisticly see massive troop reduction? My confidence is low.

Have we again fallen into the trap of using our military in a policing operation while leaving those responsible to "nation building" on the sidelines? Yes we have.

This war, and our ONLY reason to be there, ended when we stopped looking for WMD and eliminated the Saddam regime.

The only Bush Bashing I will offer is that he and Rumsfeld never followed proper military protocal from a stratigic perspective from the beginning. They "tried to play nice" with the fromer Iraqi military members and its citizens. This is not how you fight a war.

Yet, there are no alternatives coming forward that make sense (except immediate withdrawal which no one has the balls to submitt). Redeployment, as explained by the democrats accomplishes nothing except send our troops elswhere to get shot fighting for someone elses freedom.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Wed 11 Jul, 2007 08:35 pm
Re: Bush Supporters' Aftermath Thread V
McGentrix wrote:
I know asking to keep this thread clear of the usual anti-Bush rhetoric, but I will ask anyways.


Would be nice, but the usual suspects will be along any moment now .....
0 Replies
 
Zippo
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Jul, 2007 02:26 pm
Re: Bush Supporters' Aftermath Thread V
Ticomaya wrote:
McGentrix wrote:
I know asking to keep this thread clear of the usual anti-Bush rhetoric, but I will ask anyways.


Would be nice, but the usual suspects will be along any moment now .....


Howdy! Tico, nice to see you're still around. I thought you had joined the 'surge'...Do you still support 'The Decider' ? Laughing
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Jul, 2007 06:11 am
http://i12.tinypic.com/4thrgwx.jpg
http://i14.tinypic.com/624ihp0.jpg
source: Chicago Tribune, 13.07.07, page 8
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Fri 13 Jul, 2007 06:15 am
Re: Bush Supporters' Aftermath Thread V
McGentrix wrote:
I know asking to keep this thread clear of the usual anti-Bush rhetoric, but I will ask anyways.


You can ask all you want but you ain't gonna get it.

Since your so insecure why don't you post on this forum.

Quote:


As you can see this is the conservatives view on freedom.

My way or the highway.
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Jul, 2007 12:54 am
What was wrong with the old thread?
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Jul, 2007 05:54 am
Beats me. Maybe the conservatives hoped to create an uncorrupted conservative thread so they can tell themselves what a wonderful man Bush is, being sent to us by God to thech those heathen Muslims that freedom is the correct path to happiness.

Iran, thru Israel, will soon see the light (nuke light) and she to will see how wonderful freedom is. And the Bush supporters will tell themselves how the world and history will heap praise and glory on Bush for his manley stand against the Muslim religious fanatics out to destroy the free world.

Quote:
America stands for liberty, for the pursuit of happiness and for the unalienable right for life. This right to life cannot be granted or denied by government because it does not come from government, it comes from the creator of life.
George W. Bush


Quote:
For all who love freedom and peace, the world without Saddam Hussein's regime is a better and safer place.
George W. Bush


Quote:
Free nations are peaceful nations. Free nations don't attack each other. Free nations don't develop weapons of mass destruction.
George W. Bush


AH, you mean like America and Israel?

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/g/george_w_bush.html
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Jul, 2007 07:58 am
I doubt that a new thread will change the facts: al-Qaida is as strong as it ever was; the world hates us and sees us as a bully; and we have dumped $500 B of treasury on this misbegotten war. Great work, Shrub!
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Jul, 2007 08:30 am
Is it "the ususual Bush-bashing rhetoric" when the Deputy Attorney General to Ronald Reagan (and who is also an adjunct scholar with the American Enterprise Institute, a resident scholar at the Heritage Foundation and was a contributing author to the articles of impeachment for Bill Clinton) calls for the impeachment of the President and the Vice-President? http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07132007/profile.html
0 Replies
 
HokieBird
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Jul, 2007 10:38 am
Fein voted for Bush in 2000. He voted for Bush in 2004. Now he's whining.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Sat 14 Jul, 2007 07:01 pm
blatham wrote:
Is it "the ususual Bush-bashing rhetoric" when the Deputy Attorney General to Ronald Reagan (and who is also an adjunct scholar with the American Enterprise Institute, a resident scholar at the Heritage Foundation and was a contributing author to the articles of impeachment for Bill Clinton) calls for the impeachment of the President and the Vice-President? http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07132007/profile.html


Yes actually. You could very well start a separate thread about it.
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sun 15 Jul, 2007 07:00 am
McGentrix wrote:
blatham wrote:
Is it "the ususual Bush-bashing rhetoric" when the Deputy Attorney General to Ronald Reagan (and who is also an adjunct scholar with the American Enterprise Institute, a resident scholar at the Heritage Foundation and was a contributing author to the articles of impeachment for Bill Clinton) calls for the impeachment of the President and the Vice-President? http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/07132007/profile.html


Yes actually. You could very well start a separate thread about it.


McG shuts his eyes, places fingers in his ears and intones loudly

"NA NA NA NA NA NA NA NA!"
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sun 15 Jul, 2007 10:56 am
Re: Bush Supporters' Aftermath Thread V
Zippo wrote:
Ticomaya wrote:
McGentrix wrote:
I know asking to keep this thread clear of the usual anti-Bush rhetoric, but I will ask anyways.


Would be nice, but the usual suspects will be along any moment now .....


Howdy! Tico, nice to see you're still around. I thought you had joined the 'surge'...Do you still support 'The Decider' ? Laughing


Do you still believe wild conspiracy theories and hate Jews? Laughing
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Sun 15 Jul, 2007 11:01 am
McTag wrote:
What was wrong with the old thread?


Nothing. Why don't you go hang around there instead?
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Sun 15 Jul, 2007 11:42 am
Ticomaya wrote:
McTag wrote:
What was wrong with the old thread?


Nothing. Why don't you go hang around there instead?


I want to hang around here and help celebrate the demise of George W Bush, one of the worst disasters that ever befell his country.
0 Replies
 
Advocate
 
  1  
Reply Sun 15 Jul, 2007 11:51 am
McT, I think most of the world would join you in celebrating. He is a disgrace to the human race.
0 Replies
 
blatham
 
  1  
Reply Mon 16 Jul, 2007 11:05 am
HokieBird wrote:
Fein voted for Bush in 2000. He voted for Bush in 2004. Now he's whining.


This comment rests upon a well-established logical and democratic truism:

Where one has previously voted for (or thought well of, or spoken out in favor of) a particular candidate (or party) then one is henceforth obligated, as a logical matter and as a matter of personal character within a democracy, to refrain from any and all critical speech (or criical thought) regarding said candidate or party.

Do we have it right here, HokieBird?
0 Replies
 
 

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