Do Christians believe in ghosts?

@OmSigDAVID,

The human minds ability to create fantasy is also amazing!

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@cicerone imposter,

I'd sure hate to have my cover peeled

OWWW

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@neologist,

neo, You've been "revealed" a long time ago; and I still respect you!

1 Reply

@neologist,

I read of a Moslem who was flayed and buried alive
for some minor religious infraction by other Moslems; maybe he hated it.

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@cicerone imposter,

cicerone imposter wrote:

The human minds ability to create fantasy is also amazing!

Some of it has been confirmed; e.g., while in states of "death" in hospitals,
people 's minds have drifted over to the waiting room where
some of their relatives were discussing them.
Some of those relatives were subsequently disinherited for bad-mouthing the decedent,
after his human body returned to life and he had his lawyer change his will.

David

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

David - I like the term 'meatsuit' you used on another thread one time. That implies no one has to peel or flay anyone and a person is released, just slips out of this outer covering and the soul or spirit is set free - 'Free at last - free at last - Thank God Almighty - I'm free at last....'

My mother-in-law, (whom I loved very, very much - such a pure and genuine spirit she was) had that phrase used in her eulogy at her funeral service along with some kick-ass celebrating gospel music and excellent food- (the hedonistic part of you will be happy to hear).

I walked in the door sad - and walked out the door happy. Fantasy or not - I was convinced her spirit was set free.

1 Reply

@aidan,

aidan wrote:

Quote:

David - I like the term 'meatsuit' you used on another thread one time. That implies no one has to peel or flay anyone and a person is released, just slips out of this outer covering and the soul or spirit is set free

Yes; people who have returned from "death"
(I put that in quotes in recognition of the fact that death is illusionary and has never existed)
have complained that getting back into their human bodies was like being put back in jail.
I wish that my own experiences had been longer. I liked being out, but I did not feel that I was trapped.

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@cicerone imposter,

And I, you

May you never even come close to the NDE

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@OmSigDAVID,

I never had what anyone called a near death experience, but once I was given anesthesia and I had an allergic reaction to it and I went into some sort of state in which I was unconscious but I could hear what was going on around me.

The voices were like balls on a roulette wheel. Individual people were saying complete sentences but I was hearing them one word from one person and then another word from another person like a ball falling into slots on a roulette wheel - it's hard to explain - but anyway - even though it was all crazy and disjointed, I could understand everything.
And then it got totally silent. And then I was in the beautiful green meadow and I felt like I can only think I must have felt before I was aware that I had anything to worry about or be responsible for - even something as trivial as homework or having to learn to count or say the alphabet. And I felt infused with warmth and overcome by the knowledge that I was cared for.

It was so wonderful that yeah - I didn't want it to end and as soon as it ended and I asked what had happened to me and they told me - I knew I wanted to remember that feeling forever so I wrote it down in minute detail.

Even thinking about it now brings me peace. Because I know what it feels like to be totally at peace and far from fearing it - I look forward to it - especially knowing that when it happens with my 'death' it will last forever.

I think I also told you about the time I was on a plane and I was nearly panicking because of turbulence and then from nowhere at all - this wonderful sense of peace descended again. Not that I knew the plane wouldn't crash but I knew if it did - I'd still be alright.
Again - I knew that I'm cared for and will be cared for beyond any caring that is in this world.
That only happened to me once on a plane - I wish I could access that every time I have to fly Laughing

It was like a drug - but much more effective than a drug - and it took immediate and total effect.

Where do you think stuff like that comes from? If it's only my fantasies or imagination I thank God I have that sort of imagination instead of a nonactive one that doesn't give me that sense of well-being and peaceful assurance.

1 Reply

@aidan,

aidan wrote:

I never had what anyone called a near death experience, but once I was given anesthesia and I had an allergic reaction to it and I went into some sort of state in which I was unconscious but I could hear what was going on around me.

The voices were like balls on a roulette wheel. Individual people were saying complete sentences but I was hearing them one word from one person and then another word from another person like a ball falling into slots on a roulette wheel - it's hard to explain - but anyway - even though it was all crazy and disjointed, I could understand everything.
And then it got totally silent. And then I was in the beautiful green meadow and I felt like I can only think I must have felt before I was aware that I had anything to worry about or be responsible for - even something as trivial as homework or having to learn to count or say the alphabet. And I felt infused with warmth and overcome by the knowledge that I was cared for.

It was so wonderful that yeah - I didn't want it to end and as soon as it ended and I asked what had happened to me and they told me - I knew I wanted to remember that feeling forever so I wrote it down in minute detail.

Even thinking about it now brings me peace. Because I know what it feels like to be totally at peace and far from fearing it - I look forward to it - especially knowing that when it happens with my 'death' it will last forever.

I think I also told you about the time I was on a plane and I was nearly panicking because of turbulence and then from nowhere at all - this wonderful sense of peace descended again. Not that I knew the plane wouldn't crash but I knew if it did - I'd still be alright.
Again - I knew that I'm cared for and will be cared for beyond any caring that is in this world.
That only happened to me once on a plane - I wish I could access that every time I have to fly
It was like a drug - but much more effective than a drug - and it took immediate and total effect.

Where do you think stuff like that comes from?
If it's only my fantasies or imagination I thank God I have that sort
of imagination instead of a nonactive one that doesn't give me
that sense of well-being and peaceful assurance.

I think that the universe is made out of consciousness
and those are part of it. I also think that when u return to America,
u shoud find a bookstore and research near death experiences, as related by medical doctors.

Later this week, I 'm going to San Diego for the annual convention
of the International Association of Near Death Studies www.IANDS.org

David

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@OmSigDAVID,

These reported phenomena have never been confirmed, very likely because they just don't happen.
I am also not a Christian and not a believer in ghosts, spirits, demons, etc. Identity dies with the body.

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@echi,

So, echi, when it is a well educated, intelligent, well-balanced person not given to neuroses, anxiety, or hallucinations, and who was stone sober when he reported an encounter with a presence he likened to a 'ghost', what do you think it is that he encountered?

1 Reply

@echi,

echi wrote:

These reported phenomena have never been confirmed,
very likely because they just don't happen.
I am also not a Christian and not a believer in ghosts, spirits, demons, etc. Identity dies with the body.

Upon what basis do u assert that thay have never been confirmed ?

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@Foxfyre,

Certainly not something supernatural.

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@OmSigDAVID,

I reject your assertion that there are confirmed cases of supernatural phenomena.

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@echi,

echi wrote:

I reject your assertion that there are confirmed cases of supernatural phenomena.

U can reject it, but it has happened anyway,
regardless of your rejection, except that these facts are natural
not "supernatural". Your vu of nature is inaccurately limited.

David

1 Reply

@OmSigDAVID,

If these are natural phenomena then please share your theory and evidence.

1 Reply

@echi,

echi wrote:

If these are natural phenomena then please share your theory and evidence.

He already has. With his own experience described in some detail. Perhaps you could share your theory and evidence for this statement of yours:

Quote:

Identity dies with the body.

My intent is not to be argumentative or contentious at all, but usually people who hold such a firm conviction generally have a reason for holding it.

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@Foxfyre,

Thank u, Foxfyre

I don 't wish to be overly redundant.

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Here is a cut and paste from another thread:

I was impressed by the following:
in the early 1990s, a member of my Manhattan-based fine dining group
invited me to a dinner meeting of her study group as to the works
of Arthur Conan Doyle qua Sherlock Holmes.

We were seated around circular tables for 12.
To her left, was her friend, Mary Francis.
My hostess said that she 'd absent herself early, because
an old friend of hers was in extremis, on his deathbed,
and most apprehensive of his future. Being in lower Manhattan,
I opined that we were surrounded by bookstores and that she shoud
get him a book qua near death experiences, to cheer him up and raise his confidence.

Mary Francis then mentioned that in the 1950s, she had great
difficulty in giving birth in a hospital, in the State of Florida.
She said that her attending obstetrician said something to the effect
of "we 've lost her" or "she 's gone", etc. whereupon her
consciousness rose from her body and she observed efforts below
to revive her. She said that her consciousness drifted out
and back behind the hospital. She 'd never been back there before.

She saw her 5 year old son sitting at the top of a flight of wooden
stairs, waiting out his mother, inside. She said that she saw
a female black cook come out and give him a slice of chocolate cake, then
go down the stairs into the yard, pull down a banana from a tree and give it to him.

Mary Francis told us that her thoughts then turned to her daughter
in school some miles distant, whereupon her consciousness appeared
in her class in an elevated position over her daughter.
She saw that a spelling test was in progress
and that her child had misspelled one of the words,
which woud not have happened if fonetic spelling had been used.

Mary Francis then became distraught at the impending loss of her
family, whereupon she re-appeared in the hospital and re-entered
her material body and revived. Her physician was enuf
of a scientist with an inquiring mind to ask her how she felt
and she related her experiences to him. The cook was called
to her room, who confirmed the cake and the banana.
Mary Francis' husband ventured forth to their daughter 's school
and inquired qua what the class was doing at whatever time of day
her body was dead: the spelling test was confirmed
and at the end of the day, her daughter came home with the misspelled word.

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Do Christians believe in ghosts?

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