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Scoring last night's Republican Presidential primary debate

 
 
nimh
 
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 10:28 am
Nobody here at all watch the Republicans' debate last night? Noone anything to say on it?

I didnt see it either.

Didnt see the first Dem debate either. Mostly because it's deep into the night here by the time your debates start. Perhaps I'll look up a video still.

I read a bunch of reports about the Republican debate though - even though most of them just recycle all the same three or four quotes. (Fox goes into most detail.)

And blithely going lazily just on what I read, I have the following awards to give out..

-------------

http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/6547/thumbs4rq8.jpgThe Creepy Gathering of Uniform-looking Old White Men Award: The GOP Primary Candidates

http://www.foxnews.com/images/283479/11_21_051507_debate_group.jpg

http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/6547/thumbs4rq8.jpg The "Oops! What do you mean they just did?" Award for Ignoring the Latest News: Tommy Thompson

Quote:


[For those who missed it: A majority of Iraq's parliament last week signed a proposed bill that would require a timetable for the withdrawal of U.S. soldiers from Iraq and freeze current troop levels; "The bill would create a timeline for a gradual departure, much like what some Democratic lawmakers in the United States have demanded".]

http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/3839/thumbs3ag3.jpg The Courage To Refuse to Pander, Take a Principled Stand, and Confront the Party Base with an Uncomfortable Truth Award: John McCain

Quote:
"It's not about the terrorists, it's about us. It's about what kind of country we are. And a fact: The more physical pain you inflict on someone, the more they're going to tell you what they think you want to know."


[Giuliani went for the hypocritical self-contradiction: "I would tell the people who had to do the interrogation to use every method they could think of. Shouldn't be torture, but every method they can think of," [he] said, adding that that could include waterboarding." Because pushing someone's head under water until he almost suffocates, over and again, is, uh, not torture..]

http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/6547/thumbs4rq8.jpg The Most Blatant Disregard for Rule of Law Award: Mitt Romney

Quote:
[Answering the same question, Romney responded] "You said the person is going to be in Guantanamo. I'm glad they're at Guantanamo. I don't want them on our soil. I want them in Guantanamo where they don't get the access to lawyers they get when they're on our soil. I don't want them in our prisons. I want them there. Some people have said we ought to close Guantanamo. My view is, we ought to double Guantanamo," Romney said.


http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/6547/thumbs4rq8.jpg The Justification of Torture Award: Duncan Hunter

Quote:
[Answering the same question, Hunter responded] "Let me just say, this would take a one-minute conversation with the secretary of defense [..] I would say to SecDef, in terms of getting information that would save American lives even if it involves very high-pressure techniques, one sentence: 'Get the information.'"


http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/3839/thumbs3ag3.jpg The Boldest Outright Rejection of Conservative Orthodoxy Award: Ron Paul

Quote:
Rudy Giuliani took umbrage at a suggestion by Congressman Ron Paul that past U.S. foreign policy had fostered hatred of America leading up to 9/11. [But] Paul refused to [withdraw his comment], contending that terrorists "don't come here to attack us because we're rich and we're free. They come and they attack us because we're over there."


http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/3839/thumbs3ag3.jpg The Tough and Unwelcome Truths about Iraq Award: Ron Paul

Quote:
"Right now, we're building an embassy in Iraq that is bigger than the Vatican. We're building 14 permanent bases. What would we say here if China was doing this in our country or in the Gulf of Mexico? We would be objecting," Paul said in explaining his opposition to going to war in Iraq.

"They are delighted that we're over there because Usama bin Laden has said, 'I'm glad you're over on our sand because we can target you so much easier.'


http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/6547/thumbs4rq8.jpg The State of Denial about Iraq Award: John McCain

Quote:
"If we fail in Iraq we will see Iraq become a center for Al Qaeda, chaos, genocide in the region and they will follow us home," McCain said.


[Become a center for Al Qaeda and chaos?]

http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/6547/thumbs4rq8.jpg The State of Denial about 2006 Award: John McCain

Quote:
"We didn't lose the 2006 election because of the war in Iraq. We lost it because we in the Republican Party came to Washington to change government, and government changed us," McCain said. "We let spending go out of control."


http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/6547/thumbs4rq8.jpg The Shamelessly Trying to Personally Appropriate the 9/11 Tragedy for Himself Award: Rudy Giuliani (via his adviser Ed Goeas)

Quote:
"The war on terrorism to Rudy is personal," Giuliani adviser and pollster Ed Goeas told CBSNews.com. "I think you saw in his reaction that this is more than just an intellectual debate, this is something that is personal to him."

[Unlike for, you know, the other candidates, for example, I assume.. Rolling Eyes]

http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/3839/thumbs3ag3.jpg The Runner-Up Refusing to Pander Award: Rudy Giuliani

Quote:
He told the Houston audience that he believes abortion is morally wrong and would counsel anyone who is considering the procedure not to follow through with it. But, he said, he refuses to impose his views on those who believe otherwise and so he leaves the decisions to those who must bear the consequences -- the women who have to make the choice.


http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/3839/thumbs3ag3.jpg The "Touche" Award for A-Propos Double Jab: Tom Tancredo

Quote:
Tancredo said he had heard so many conversions on the issues that "it's beginning to truly sound like a Baptist tent revival meeting here."'

"``I'm glad to see conversions [..] But I must tell you, I trust those conversions when they happen on the road to Damascus, not on the road to Des Moines'


http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/3839/thumbs3ag3.jpg The Rare Moment of Ironic Wit Award: Rudy Giuliani

Quote:
[C]alling out so-called conservatives for taking non-conservative positions, [..] Gilmore [..] referred to "Rudy McRomney," [but] Giuliani .. took the accusation in stride.

"[..] I think 'Rudy McRomney' wouldn't make a bad ticket, and I like the order," he said


http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/3839/thumbs3ag3.jpg The "Doh!" Rebuttal to Facile "Tax-Raiser" Spin Award: Mike Huckabee

Quote:
[C]alling out so-called conservatives [..] Gilmore cited [..] Huckabee's decision to raise taxes in Arkansas [..].

Huckabee [responded], "We raised gasoline taxes in my state to build a road program that we desperately needed. But 80 percent of the people of my state voted for it .. Do I apologize for going along with what 80 percent of the people of my state supported? No."


http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/6547/thumbs4rq8.jpg The Dangerous Gingrich Revolution Libertarian Award for Promising to Gut an Already Deficient State: Rudy Giuliani

Quote:
Giuliani said that as New York mayor ``I put controls on every one of the city agencies, which is what I would do in Washington.'' He promised to ``do Reagan like, across-the-board budget cuts, 5 to 20 percent.''

Giuliani said about 50 percent of federal employees are going to retire in the next 10 years and he pledged not to refill half of those positions.


http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/6547/thumbs4rq8.jpg The "Scientists? I know better than scientists" Award: Tommy Thompson

Quote:
Thompson [added] that embryonic stem cell research is a promising science, but adult stem cells appear to have the same characteristics as embryonic stem cells.

"Until this research is done, we do not have to destroy any more embryos. There is enough lines right now, and capable with this other research going on, that embryonic stem cells, along with adult stem cells, cord blood and amniotic fluid can continue," he said.


http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/3839/thumbs3ag3.jpg The Lonely Venture into Quality Journalism Award: Bloomberg.com

.. for being the only one of the reports I read that didn't just repeat Giuliani's quotes from Hillary Clinton, but looked up the original context:

Quote:
Giuliani, saying there is something ``really big at stake'' in the election, targeted New York Senator Hillary Clinton. Giuliani said Clinton agreed with the statement ``that the unfettered free market is the most disastrous thing in modern America'' and also said that taxes are needed because ``we have to take money from you in order to give it to the common good.'' [..]

In a 1996 C-Span interview, Clinton said she agreed with a quote she cited her book, ``It Takes a Village,'' that ``The unfettered free market has been the most radically disruptive force in American life in the last generation.'' Clinton also said in the interview ``that the market is the driving force behind our prosperity,'' ``but that it cannot be permitted just to run roughshod over people's lives as well.''

Her comment on taxes was made to an audience in San Francisco in 2004 and referred to repealing some of President George W. Bush's income tax cuts for the richest Americans, the Associated Press reported at the time.


http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/3839/thumbs3ag3.jpg And, finally, The Laudable Enthusiasm for Urging War within the Republican Party Award: Ruben Navarrette on RealClearPolitics.com

Quote:
It's all so Trumanesque. [..] Tough. Straight-talking. Less worried about being popular than being right.

Now here's Giuliani giving it to members of his own party with both fists and telling them they had better listen for their own survival [..].

Give 'em hell, Rudy.
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Type: Discussion • Score: 1 • Views: 3,348 • Replies: 61
No top replies

 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 10:32 am
I watched it. Pretty unimpressive all around.

It killed me when the audience cheered and clapped for support of torture and guantanamo bay. It really shows the difference between the two parties, that one side just doesn't give a damn about non-Americans' rights at all (or even Americans, it seems).

Jonah Goldberg, in a departure from his usual crap, summed up Romney's performance perfectly:

Quote:
What Do I Have to Do To Put You In This BMW Today?

That's what Romney seems to be saying if you hit "mute."


He's exactly right. Romney comes off like a used-car salesman.

Love the up and down graphics, cheers

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 10:34 am
I wouldn't piss on any of them. There might be some trace nutrients in my urine.
0 Replies
 
woiyo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 10:39 am
Not very impressed with any of them.

Since no one seems impressive on the Democratic side either, looks like we will need a 3rd party hero to save this Nation from the damage both democrats and republicans have done.
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 10:44 am
don't hold your breath...
0 Replies
 
Dookiestix
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 10:52 am
Ron Paul was the only voice of reason. The delusional rants from the other candidates was truly unbelievable, and the loaded Fox News questions, as well as the selected audience, just made the whole event seem that much more surreal.

Giuliani just put his foot in his mouth after Ron Paul spoke the truth about terrorism. What's really interesting is that Fox New's text message polling had Ron Paul in front, with Giuliani a close second. Then that changed at some point, and Giuliani pulled out with a slight lead.
0 Replies
 
kickycan
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 11:09 am
woiyo wrote:
Not very impressed with any of them.

Since no one seems impressive on the Democratic side either, looks like we will need a 3rd party hero to save this Nation from the damage both democrats and republicans have done.


Oprah! Oprah! Oprah!
0 Replies
 
woiyo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 11:19 am
Dookiestix wrote:
Ron Paul was the only voice of reason. The delusional rants from the other candidates was truly unbelievable, and the loaded Fox News questions, as well as the selected audience, just made the whole event seem that much more surreal.

Giuliani just put his foot in his mouth after Ron Paul spoke the truth about terrorism. What's really interesting is that Fox New's text message polling had Ron Paul in front, with Giuliani a close second. Then that changed at some point, and Giuliani pulled out with a slight lead.


Sure, he was the moron who said it was our fault we got bombed on 9-11 because we were bombing Iraq before??? Are you sure that wasn't Rue Paul?
0 Replies
 
Dookiestix
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 11:20 am
woiyo wrote:
Dookiestix wrote:
Ron Paul was the only voice of reason. The delusional rants from the other candidates was truly unbelievable, and the loaded Fox News questions, as well as the selected audience, just made the whole event seem that much more surreal.

Giuliani just put his foot in his mouth after Ron Paul spoke the truth about terrorism. What's really interesting is that Fox New's text message polling had Ron Paul in front, with Giuliani a close second. Then that changed at some point, and Giuliani pulled out with a slight lead.


Sure, he was the moron who said it was our fault we got bombed on 9-11 because we were bombing Iraq before??? Are you sure that wasn't Rue Paul?

Looks like you completely missed Ron Paul's point as well.

No surprise, really...
0 Replies
 
woiyo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 11:33 am
Dookiestix wrote:
woiyo wrote:
Dookiestix wrote:
Ron Paul was the only voice of reason. The delusional rants from the other candidates was truly unbelievable, and the loaded Fox News questions, as well as the selected audience, just made the whole event seem that much more surreal.

Giuliani just put his foot in his mouth after Ron Paul spoke the truth about terrorism. What's really interesting is that Fox New's text message polling had Ron Paul in front, with Giuliani a close second. Then that changed at some point, and Giuliani pulled out with a slight lead.


Sure, he was the moron who said it was our fault we got bombed on 9-11 because we were bombing Iraq before??? Are you sure that wasn't Rue Paul?

Looks like you completely missed Ron Paul's point as well.

No surprise, really...


He had no point except to show himself as the fool he is. His example/reason for attack are as silly as the one you come up with. Why did he ignore Afganistan in his comment?
0 Replies
 
Bi-Polar Bear
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 11:36 am
and so that makes him Rue Paul? Which means he doesn't agree with you so he's gay or not a real man? Hilarious.

funny thing is, Rue Paul would probably slap you around like a little dog and hit you up the keister til you were the whiny little girl..... providing of course he took any notice if you. Laughing

that's the difference between the real world and this one......
0 Replies
 
Dookiestix
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 11:45 am
woiyo wrote:
Dookiestix wrote:
woiyo wrote:
Dookiestix wrote:
Ron Paul was the only voice of reason. The delusional rants from the other candidates was truly unbelievable, and the loaded Fox News questions, as well as the selected audience, just made the whole event seem that much more surreal.

Giuliani just put his foot in his mouth after Ron Paul spoke the truth about terrorism. What's really interesting is that Fox New's text message polling had Ron Paul in front, with Giuliani a close second. Then that changed at some point, and Giuliani pulled out with a slight lead.


Sure, he was the moron who said it was our fault we got bombed on 9-11 because we were bombing Iraq before??? Are you sure that wasn't Rue Paul?

Looks like you completely missed Ron Paul's point as well.

No surprise, really...


He had no point except to show himself as the fool he is. His example/reason for attack are as silly as the one you come up with. Why did he ignore Afganistan in his comment?

Like I said, you completely missed his point. Which most likely explains why you had to throw in the "Rue Paul" comment.

The one I "come" up with? As in present tense, which I haven't yet?

Could you possibly be any less substantive and sound even more puerile? My guess is yes.
0 Replies
 
sozobe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 12:13 pm
Hey, great job!

I didn't see it, have been reading about it. I liked Andrew Sullivan's take. (He thought McCain and Paul did best, was pretty much disgusted by everyone else.) Doesn't seem to be much consensus about who won. Romney seemed to pretty clearly take the lead after the first debate. More people seem to think Giuliani won this one, but it was such an easy, stupid point he made (jumping in on what Ron Paul was saying about why 9/11 happened).
0 Replies
 
woiyo
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 12:27 pm
Dookiestix wrote:
woiyo wrote:
Dookiestix wrote:
woiyo wrote:
Dookiestix wrote:
Ron Paul was the only voice of reason. The delusional rants from the other candidates was truly unbelievable, and the loaded Fox News questions, as well as the selected audience, just made the whole event seem that much more surreal.

Giuliani just put his foot in his mouth after Ron Paul spoke the truth about terrorism. What's really interesting is that Fox New's text message polling had Ron Paul in front, with Giuliani a close second. Then that changed at some point, and Giuliani pulled out with a slight lead.


Sure, he was the moron who said it was our fault we got bombed on 9-11 because we were bombing Iraq before??? Are you sure that wasn't Rue Paul?

Looks like you completely missed Ron Paul's point as well.

No surprise, really...


He had no point except to show himself as the fool he is. His example/reason for attack are as silly as the one you come up with. Why did he ignore Afganistan in his comment?

Like I said, you completely missed his point. Which most likely explains why you had to throw in the "Rue Paul" comment.

The one I "come" up with? As in present tense, which I haven't yet?

Could you possibly be any less substantive and sound even more puerile? My guess is yes.


Whatever Rolling Eyes
0 Replies
 
Dookiestix
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 01:18 pm
woiyo wrote:
Dookiestix wrote:
woiyo wrote:
Dookiestix wrote:
woiyo wrote:
Dookiestix wrote:
Ron Paul was the only voice of reason. The delusional rants from the other candidates was truly unbelievable, and the loaded Fox News questions, as well as the selected audience, just made the whole event seem that much more surreal.

Giuliani just put his foot in his mouth after Ron Paul spoke the truth about terrorism. What's really interesting is that Fox New's text message polling had Ron Paul in front, with Giuliani a close second. Then that changed at some point, and Giuliani pulled out with a slight lead.


Sure, he was the moron who said it was our fault we got bombed on 9-11 because we were bombing Iraq before??? Are you sure that wasn't Rue Paul?

Looks like you completely missed Ron Paul's point as well.

No surprise, really...


He had no point except to show himself as the fool he is. His example/reason for attack are as silly as the one you come up with. Why did he ignore Afganistan in his comment?

Like I said, you completely missed his point. Which most likely explains why you had to throw in the "Rue Paul" comment.

The one I "come" up with? As in present tense, which I haven't yet?

Could you possibly be any less substantive and sound even more puerile? My guess is yes.


Whatever Rolling Eyes

O.K. A definitive "yes."
0 Replies
 
nimh
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 03:45 pm
sozobe wrote:
I liked Andrew Sullivan's take. (He thought McCain and Paul did best, was pretty much disgusted by everyone else.)

Thanks. Andrew's review is a good one. It's here.

Any conservative apart from Woiyo have anything at all to say about the Republicans' debate? Nothing?

Is the field so depressing that they've just kind of declared an unofficial boycott of any discussion about their candidates? The McCain, Giuliani & the Republicans in 2008 thread has been pretty much dead as well, in terms of conservative input - hasnt been any Republican voter but O'Bill and Lash commenting for weeks now.
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 04:29 pm
. Thanks for the enlightening commentary Nimh. I missed it (at a poker tourney), but it doesn't sound like I missed much. I will remind you of my Independence... and even mention my current disgust with the Republican Party over the so called "immigration issue". I do generally default in a lean towards Republican opinion... but right now I'm not seeing it. The difference between reality and the supposed ideals of the Republican Party aren't meshing well with my own right now it seems to be pushing me across the fulcrum.
0 Replies
 
OCCOM BILL
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 04:49 pm
Re: Scoring last night's Republican Presidential primary deb
No award for the One-liner of the night?

http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/3839/thumbs3ag3.jpg"We've got a Congress that spends money like John Edwards at a beauty shop..." Laughing
0 Replies
 
Cycloptichorn
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 04:59 pm
I'm not sure why you think that the feminization of opposing candidates in a manner designed to insult them is worth a thumbs up.

It's pretty f*cking juvenille if you ask me

Cycloptichorn
0 Replies
 
dyslexia
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 May, 2007 05:04 pm
Re: Scoring last night's Republican Presidential primary deb
OCCOM BILL wrote:
No award for the One-liner of the night?

http://img484.imageshack.us/img484/3839/thumbs3ag3.jpg"We've got a Congress that spends money like John Edwards at a beauty shop..." Laughing

That was pretty good and could have even been funny were it not that we had a congress that spent tax payers money in ways that showed creativity for adding even more layers of fat to an already stuffed pig. Tax and spend democrats vs just spend and never worry who will pay the piper (just keep adding more for the invasion of Iraq but never ever consider the eventual cost to we the people) Ron Paul was, at the least, honest with his opinions not unlike Dennis Kucinich on the other side. The rest of the bozos including the idiot Tancredo are pandering to the misbegotten who bemoan the fact that they can no longer just mark and pull "every republican" on the ballot. I'm getting to the point that no matter who wins the republican primary Kucinich would havea good chance to win the election. Weird innit?
0 Replies
 
 

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