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Fascist America, in 10 easy steps

 
 
Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 01:57 am
From Hitler to Pinochet and beyond, history shows there are certain steps that any would-be dictator must take to destroy constitutional freedoms. And, argues Naomi Wolf, George Bush and his administration seem to be taking them all.

http://i19.tinypic.com/4hvuhrd.jpg

From today's Guardian (pages 46 - 51)
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Walter Hinteler
 
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Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 01:59 am
http://i14.tinypic.com/4d4h07m.jpg

http://i16.tinypic.com/2jfgdwi.jpg


... ... ...

http://i13.tinypic.com/2yzcxvb.jpg

Quote:
Right now, only a handful of patriots are trying to hold back the tide of tyranny for the rest of us - staff at the Center for Constitutional Rights, who faced death threats for representing the detainees yet persisted all the way to the Supreme Court; activists at the American Civil Liberties Union; and prominent conservatives trying to roll back the corrosive new laws, under the banner of a new group called the American Freedom Agenda. This small, disparate collection of people needs everybody's help, including that of Europeans and others internationally who are willing to put pressure on the administration because they can see what a US unrestrained by real democracy at home can mean for the rest of the world.

We need to look at history and face the "what ifs". For if we keep going down this road, the "end of America" could come for each of us in a different way, at a different moment; each of us might have a different moment when we feel forced to look back and think: that is how it was before - and this is the way it is now.

"The accumulation of all powers, legislative, executive, and judiciary, in the same hands ... is the definition of tyranny," wrote James Madison. We still have the choice to stop going down this road; we can stand our ground and fight for our nation, and take up the banner the founders asked us to carry.
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Letty
 
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Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 02:44 am
Book marking, Walter, until my brain comes to life.
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Letty
 
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Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 07:11 am
It's difficult for me to be objective about these ten steps of dictatorship, Walter, because a clever propagandist could deftly work them into any presidency. The one thing that makes me feel that democracy is still alive and well and living in America, is that the general populace appears to be recognizing George W. Bush as being a very ineffective president in spite of his despotic ways.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 07:20 am
Well, Naomi Wolf has indeed a very ... ehem ... progressive view.
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cjhsa
 
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Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 07:23 am
More A2K socialist agenda.... pffffffffffttttttttttttttttttt.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  0  
Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 07:28 am
cjhsa wrote:
More A2K socialist agenda.... pffffffffffttttttttttttttttttt.


Either you read what is posted, cjhsa, or do commenting on my threads.
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blatham
 
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Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 11:53 am
Letty wrote:
It's difficult for me to be objective about these ten steps of dictatorship, Walter, because a clever propagandist could deftly work them into any presidency. The one thing that makes me feel that democracy is still alive and well and living in America, is that the general populace appears to be recognizing George W. Bush as being a very ineffective president in spite of his despotic ways.


It ain't an either/or question, Letty. One needs to think in a clear and honest way about what changes would have to take place for a democracy like Canada or Switzerland or the US to move in the direction of a fascist mode of 'governance'. Citizen monitoring, for example. Hyper-patriotism, for example. Restrictions or derogation or punishment for those speaking against government officials or policies, for example. The dismantling of habeus corpus traditions and values, for example.
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McGentrix
 
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Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 12:50 pm
blatham wrote:
Letty wrote:
It's difficult for me to be objective about these ten steps of dictatorship, Walter, because a clever propagandist could deftly work them into any presidency. The one thing that makes me feel that democracy is still alive and well and living in America, is that the general populace appears to be recognizing George W. Bush as being a very ineffective president in spite of his despotic ways.


It ain't an either/or question, Letty. One needs to think in a clear and honest way about what changes would have to take place for a democracy like Canada or Switzerland or the US to move in the direction of a fascist mode of 'governance'. Citizen monitoring, for example. Hyper-patriotism, for example. Restrictions or derogation or punishment for those speaking against government officials or policies, for example. The dismantling of habeus corpus traditions and values, for example.


Sounds quite a bit like England.
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Walter Hinteler
 
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Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 12:52 pm
McGentrix wrote:

Sounds quite a bit like England.


Certainly Blair is Bush's poodle - but do you have example which led you to your conclusion?
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blatham
 
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Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 01:01 pm
McG

Your integrity stinks. Other than camera monitoring in civic areas, those characteristics do not reflect modern england as they do the modern US.
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 01:21 pm
The US? Nah. None of the examples Blatham have given are exhibited in the US.

Citizen monitoring? How so? Are you referring to the Terrorist surveillance program? Not really a citizen monitoring program. England is a great example of that.

Hyper-patriotism? What does that even mean? I am sure that to some, even having a flag is an example of hyper-patriotism. Been to a football match in Europe? Talk about hyper-patriotism.

Restrictions or derogation or punishment for those speaking against government officials or policies... Not in the US. Russia maybe, certainly N. Korea, but the US? Nope.

The dismantling of habeus corpus traditions and values? Where? In the US? Guess again.

It's easy to look at the current situation in the US and see all the bad things happening, especially if you don't like the current administration like most people on A2K. But to even suggest there is some sort of facism going on is beyond stupidity.
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Walter Hinteler
 
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Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 01:27 pm
Now, what examples did you experience in England (or Scotland, wales ..) or about what do you know, have heard of, McG?

On the other hand, Naomi Wolf is an American, even an American Christian ...
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plainoldme
 
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Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 03:13 pm
It occurred to me the other day, that if one uses the definition of fascism that was current when I was polisci major 1965-69 (fascism is an economic system whereby the means of production are privately owned but controlled by the government), that, much to the chagrin of many whose political philosophy ranges from middle to left, that the bush administration is not fascistic.

It's an oligarchy.

However, the bush system features government owned by those who also own the means of production.
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HokieBird
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 06:28 pm
A great Tom Wolfe quote for those Euroweenies that have the vapors about the US, "... the dark night of fascism is always descending on the US, but always seems to land in Europe".
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blatham
 
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Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 07:16 pm
HokieBird wrote:
A great Tom Wolfe quote for those Euroweenies that have the vapors about the US, "... the dark night of fascism is always descending on the US, but always seems to land in Europe".


Klein...American.
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McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Tue 24 Apr, 2007 07:28 pm
HokieBird wrote:
A great Tom Wolfe quote for those Euroweenies that have the vapors about the US, "... the dark night of fascism is always descending on the US, but always seems to land in Europe".


Good and accurate quote.
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blatham
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Apr, 2007 05:35 am
McGentrix wrote:
HokieBird wrote:
A great Tom Wolfe quote for those Euroweenies that have the vapors about the US, "... the dark night of fascism is always descending on the US, but always seems to land in Europe".


Good and accurate quote.


No, actually not.

Perhaps you two boys could enlighten us on the fascist histories of Switzerland, Finland, Norway, Portugal, Lithuania, Belgium, etc etc? Or perhaps your geography teacher suggested that Europe is one country. Perhaps you could tell us what was going on in Britain and Holland contemporaneously with the McCarthy period here?

But I do like the term 'euroweenie'. America, in the way of contrast, is most clearly identifiable as vagina, or the feminine, large and warmly receiving of the manly european thrust of vigorous populations. Over and over again, America receives. It's why she's there. Statue of Liberty as clitoris. And yes, you needed the French for help with that too.
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kitchenpete
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Apr, 2007 06:36 am
Funny post, blatham Laughing

McG - your point about "ultra-patriotism" at football games in the UK is undermined by the fact that this is as nothing compared with the widespread admiration of the flag and its use in the USA.

A very small minority of those who follow the England national team are thuggish in their approach. This minority is actually on the decline.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 25 Apr, 2007 06:40 am
And besides that I wouldn't call football supporters nationalists.
(Of course the third goal wasn't really one, btw!)
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