Atheism has the same logical flaws as religion

One thing that the snopes link did not cover is that in Japan I have frequently seen building-sized Santas (used to scare me when I knew him as "Satan's Claws") displayed on the size of a building.

As they are frequently huge baloons the arms are, indeed, outstrectched.

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Frank Apisa wrote:

I DO NOT KNOW EITHER WAY -- AND I DO NOT SEE ENOUGH UNAMBIGUOUS EVIDENCE UPON WHICH TO BASE A REASONABLE, MEANINGFUL, CONSIDERED GUESS.

This is a situation where unambiguous evidence is unlikely to exist, simply because of the nature of the beast. While there is nothing particularly wrong with fence-sitting, it doesn't do much for debate. Smile

To be honest, the only real position a logical, rational person can take is that, functionally speaking, there is no god(s). If you take that position, then it can be easily falsified by simply producing one example of a god. If you take the position that there are god(s), it cannot be functionally falsified. So while I don't claim, as a product of 'faith' that there are no god(s), logically I must hold that position and I wait for someone to prove me wrong.

So far... no takers.

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tagged_lyricist wrote:

One persons fact is anothers belief, one person right is another's wrong it's all context and perceptional frame works that we work on.

Each person lives in there version of reality and it is futile to try change some one else's beliefs with "fact" as beliefs are not fact based.

No one's beleif is superior to any body elses just as no person is superior to any body else (although some are more equal then others )

See, that's where you're wrong. One person's fact, assuming it is a fact, is *EVERYONE'S* fact. Facts are objective. They exist for everyone, whether or not they want to accept or admit it.

Beliefs are a poor substitute for facts and beliefs are certainly not created equal. The Flat Earth Society holds beliefs which are demonstrably false and therefore, they are absolutely inferior to the beliefs of more reasonable and rational people. A false belief is still false no matter how strongly it is held. False beliefs are *BAD*.

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Craven de Kere wrote:

Want more? Remember Jesus's open letter? It was well written, Santa being a wino was a nice touch.

Er - care to share, and explicate, and such, with the rest of us? LOL

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Craven de Kere wrote:

Want more? Remember Jesus's open letter? It was well written, Santa being a wino was a nice touch.

lol...sure. My older sister sang Jingle Bells at a show once when she was 16 (oh how severely that song epitomized the evil spirit of Christmas commercialism)--It caused a fair bit of controversy with my family.

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I live my life with no God, because I didn't invent one for myself.

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dlowan wrote:

Craven de Kere wrote:
Want more? Remember Jesus's open letter? It was well written, Santa being a wino was a nice touch.

Er - care to share, and explicate, and such, with the rest of us? LOL

Jesus used to rip on Santa all the time when we were young, at least that's what people told us. Mebbe Craven will explain better. Smile

---
In a similar vein, there was a great South Park episode ('twas actually made before south park was a show) where Jesus comes to South Park for retribution against Kringle in a kung fu match on Christmas Eve. Innocent bystanders get sharp things stuck in them, but in the end a figure skater sorts things out and Jesus buys Santa an orange smoothie. Then all the kids become Jews so they can get Hanukkah presents for 8 days straight.

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well, there is that....

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segue-there really is a South Park, the name of the town is Fairplay and its in a valley in the mtns of colorado called "south park" the 2 writers of the program are from the area and met in college at the Univ of Colorado @ Boulder. to give further defamation of the Univ of Colorado both Hobitbob (currently) and meself are products of the gradual school.

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yep...

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Hey EB, i go pogo . . .

God told me last night that she don't give two shits if anybody believes in her or not . . .

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dlowan wrote:

well, there is that....

...deb, ya see, Crave & I never knew each other IRL but we grew up in the same religious enchilada of sorts

there be some in-jokes 'bout our parents and weirdo upbringing & such Smile

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LOL - oh, I know.

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I was referring to the becoming jewish so as to get presents for eight days in South Park - one of the lesser known reasons for conversion...

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But - I would be fascinated to know about the sorts of things Jesus puts in open letters about Santa and such..

I never got any when I was a christian...

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Did anyone bother to read my last post on p. 8? Because I took some time with it, and didn't get any responses.

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I read it, and one thing I noticed was your use of 'g-d'. Lowercase 'g' but omitting the 'o', which indicates to me that on some level, you are a believer, but perhaps conflicted and/or skeptical. Your definitions also seemed quite sound to me.

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I read it, portal. I found your argument as to why it's logical to not believe in the easter bunny but illogical to not believe in god (simply because god is immaterial) to be nothing more than wordplay. Let me reword what setanta posted...

For my part, when i state that there are no gods, i state it with the same certitude, and for the same reasons, that i state that there is no immaterial giant rabbit & immaterial jolly man in a red suit who bring me stuff, & who are invisible to cameras when they want to be. Razz

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Cephus wrote:

Frank Apisa wrote:
I DO NOT KNOW EITHER WAY -- AND I DO NOT SEE ENOUGH UNAMBIGUOUS EVIDENCE UPON WHICH TO BASE A REASONABLE, MEANINGFUL, CONSIDERED GUESS.

This is a situation where unambiguous evidence is unlikely to exist, simply because of the nature of the beast. While there is nothing particularly wrong with fence-sitting, it doesn't do much for debate.

I am up to my ass with that "fence-sitting" bullshit. When you do not know -- saying that you do not know is NOT fence-sitting. It is acknowledgement of the truth.

To suppose that it makes more sense or is more rational or logical to simply take the position that there are no gods (or that there is a God) is absurd.

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OK so you're not fence-sitting, Frank. Do you not agree with cephus though that "this is a situation where unambiguous evidence is unlikely to exist, simply because of the nature of the beast"? I do.

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Atheism has the same logical flaws as religion

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