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Why can't (minorities) Just Get Along?

 
 
cjhsa
 
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 06:44 am
Los Angeles is a flashpoint for racism, particularly between blacks and new, mostly illegal, immigrants. Some of you will likely read the article and comment about how awful guns are. The problem is much deeper than that.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/01/17/us/17race.html?hp&ex=1169096400&en=20e6b200bebccf4f&ei=5094&partner=homepage

LOS ANGELES, Jan. 16 ?- The Latino gang members were looking for a black person, any black person, to shoot, the police said, and they found one. Cheryl Green, perched near her scooter chatting with friends, was shot dead in a spray of bullets that left several other young people injured.

She was 14, an eighth grader who loved junk food and watching Court TV with her mother and had recently written a poem beginning: "I am black and beautiful. I wonder how I will be living in the future."

"I never thought something like this could happen here in L.A.," said her mother, Charlene Lovett, fighting tears.

Cheryl's killing last month, which the police said followed a confrontation between the gang members and a black man, stands out in a wave of bias-related attacks and incidents in a city that promotes its diversity as much as frets over it.

Ethnic and racial tension comes to Los Angeles as regularly as the Santa Ana winds. Race-related fights afflict school campuses and jails, and two major riots, in 1965 and 1992, are hardly forgotten. But civil rights advocates say that the violence grew at an alarming rate last year, continuing a trend of more Latino versus black confrontations and prompting street demonstrations and long discussions on talk-radio programs and in community meetings.

Much of the violence springs from rivalries between black and Latino gangs, especially in neighborhoods where the black population has been declining and the Latino population surging. A 14 percent increase in gang crime last year, at a time when overall violent crime was down, has been attributed in good measure to the interracial conflict.

This month, the authorities reported that crimes in the city motivated by racial, religious or sexual orientation discrimination had increased 34 percent in 2005 over the previous year. Statistics for 2006 have not yet been compiled.

Rabbi Allen Freehling, executive director of the Los Angeles Human Relations Commission, a group created after the 1965 riots, said the recent growth in hate crimes reflected a failure by government and community leaders to prepare residents for socioeconomic changes in many neighborhoods, "and therefore people have a tendency to lash out, out of desperation."

In November, three Latino gang members received sentences of life in federal prison for crimes that included the murder of two black men ?- one waiting for a bus, another searching for a parking spot ?- and assaults on others in a conspiracy to intimidate black residents of a northeast Los Angeles neighborhood.

In another case, a twist on past racial dramas, 10 black youths, some of whom prosecutors say had connections to a gang, are on trial for what prosecutors contend was a racially motivated attack in neighboring Long Beach on three young white women who were visiting a haunted house on Halloween. Long Beach also experienced an increase in hate crimes in 2005.

But even with the alarm caused by the recent increase in bias crimes, Constance L. Rice, a veteran civil rights lawyer, said that, considering Los Angeles's diversity, race relations remained relatively calm and were even marked by many examples of groups getting along.

Still, in several corners of the city, particularly where poverty is high and demographics are shifting, tensions have been flaring.

"You don't find entire segments of the city against one another," Ms. Rice said, "but in the hot spots and areas of friction you find it is because the demographics are in transition and there is an assertion of power by one group or the other and you get friction."

In Harbor Gateway, the neighborhood where Cheryl Green was killed, tension had grown so severe that blacks and Latinos formed a dividing line on a street that both sides understood never to cross and a small market was unofficially declared off-limits to blacks. Ms. Lovett had warned her children not to go near the line, 206th Street, but Cheryl had ridden her scooter near it to talk to friends when she was shot.

Neighbors said the dominant 204th Street gang, which is Latino, had harassed blacks and Latinos alike and effectively kept the groups divided, though language and cultural differences also have contributed to segregation.

"We wave hello, but I cannot really talk to blacks because my English is limited and I don't want to mess with the gang," said Armando Lopez, speaking in Spanish, who lives near where Cheryl was shot.

A man who described himself as a former member of the 204th Street gang said black gang members had shot or assaulted Latinos, too, and explained the violence as a deadly tit-for-tat.
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boomerang
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:02 am
I think the operative word here is gangs, not minorities.

The skinheads don't get along with other gangs and they're a bunch of white boys. It isn't fair to judge all white people based on the action of these idiotic gangs. Same goes for judging black and Latino people based on their equally idiotic gangs.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:06 am
boomerang wrote:
I think the operative word here is gangs, not minorities.


At least that's what the report is about and what the original NYT title says.

But such doesn't fit in cjhsa's racism.
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cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:12 am
The race wars in the U.S. have little if anything to do with white people anymore. Skinheads are a tiny, tiny faction here. Maybe you have a bigger issue with them in Germany, Walt.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:14 am
I neither questioned that nor is it the topic of the report you quoted.
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cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:15 am
Did yot not read what is said?

"Much of the violence springs from rivalries between black and Latino gangs, especially in neighborhoods where the black population has been declining and the Latino population surging. A 14 percent increase in gang crime last year, at a time when overall violent crime was down, has been attributed in good measure to the interracial conflict."

I lived in California for twenty years. The closest thing I ever saw to a white gang were territorial surfers.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:20 am
I don't know who taught you when and at what university criminology, cjhsa, but here's a rather complete bibliography on gang culture.
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cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:25 am
Yeah, and? Did you look at what you posted?

Crips, bloods, blacks, latinos...repeat ad nauseum.
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boomerang
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:32 am
Google "christian identity groups" to see just how small the "white gang" movement it.

Or Google:

Aryian nations
Volksfront
The order
KKK
Northwest imperative

.... and so on and so on and so on ad nauseum.

I'm not defending any of these race based groups - they're all equally stupid - but to pretend that gangs are limited to any one race shows you just aren't paying attention.
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:37 am
Ask any cop in any major U.S. city who the biggest, most problematic gangs are. If any of those you posted are mentioned, I'd be floored.
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Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:44 am
Why do you always like to show publically that you have no idea about you post, cjhsa?

Get some adoptions of sociology, try then some simple special books later and read a bit about criminology.
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:45 am
Excuse me, Mr. Headinthesandler.
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plainoldme
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 05:35 pm
So, what else is new?
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aidan
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 06:59 pm
It doesn't serve any productive purpose to deny facts that are clearly evident.

It is a sociological fact that minority populations in the US are more heavily involved in gang activity than native born whites. (But there are also Asian gangs, eastern European gangs, etc., etc).

People who are marginalized or feel disenfranchised in a society see less reason to follow the laws of the society they feel has made them so.

That may be why you see more rebellious and/or criminal activity and behavior from certain minority groups.

I don't think it's racist to face facts. Unless you say there is something in a black or latino person's particular DNA that makes them more prone to criminality-you're not debasing them based on their race- which is what racism is.

Is that what you're saying cj? Do you believe that these people are inherently evil and violent because of their race? Or do you believe there are other outside factors that may have contributed to their attitudes and behavior?

Because an "eye for an eye" which is the logic that precipitated this incident, is not a sentiment or practice embraced or embodied by any one or two races in particular. That particular philosophical gem has been translated into action by people of every race through every age.

And people of every stripe seem to love to feel a part of one "gang" or another...I guess everyone wants or has to feel they belong somewhere.
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2PacksAday
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:09 pm
Well said.
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gustavratzenhofer
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 07:28 pm
I'll agree. That was well said. Let's give cjsha a moment to collect his thoughts.
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snood
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 08:52 pm
kinda like waiting for rainwater to collect in a sieve.
0 Replies
 
Walter Hinteler
 
  1  
Reply Wed 17 Jan, 2007 11:32 pm
aidan wrote:
It is a sociological fact that minority populations in the US are more heavily involved in gang activity than native born whites. (But there are also Asian gangs, eastern European gangs, etc., etc).


Minorities generally (no rule without exclusion) tend to do that. Everywhere. Not only in the USA.
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Jan, 2007 07:37 am
aidan wrote:
People who are marginalized or feel disenfranchised in a society see less reason to follow the laws of the society they feel has made them so.


That or the fact they don't belong in the society in the first place - aka "illegal" aliens. Can you say MS13?
0 Replies
 
cjhsa
 
  1  
Reply Thu 18 Jan, 2007 07:45 am
Lame.
0 Replies
 
 

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