IT'S TIME FOR UNIVERSAL HEALTH CARE

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A MINORITY VIEW
BY WALTER E. WILLIAMS
RELEASE: WEDNESDAY, FEBRUARY 14, 2007, AND THEREAFTER

Do We Want Socialized Medicine?

Problems with our health care system are leading some to fall prey to proposals calling for a nationalized single-payer health care system like Canada's or Britain's. There are a few things that we might take into consideration before falling for these proposals.
London's Observer (3/3/02) carried a story saying that an "unpublished report shows some patients are now having to wait more than eight months for treatment, during which time many of their cancers become incurable." Another story said, "According to a World Health Organisation report to be published later this year, around 10,000 British people die unnecessarily from cancer each year -- three times as many as are killed on our roads."

The Observer (12/16/01) also reported, "A recent academic study showed National Health Service delays in bowel cancer treatment were so great that, in one in five cases, cancer which was curable at the time of diagnosis had become incurable by the time of treatment."

The story is no better in Canada's national health care system. The Vancouver, British Columbia-based Fraser Institute has a yearly publication titled, "Waiting Your Turn." Its 2006 edition gives waiting times, by treatments, from a person's referral by a general practitioner to treatment by a specialist. The shortest waiting time was for oncology (4.9 weeks). The longest waiting time was for orthopedic surgery (40.3 weeks), followed by plastic surgery (35.4 weeks) and neurosurgery (31.7 weeks).

Canadians face significant waiting times for various diagnostics such as computed tomography (CT), magnetic resonance imaging (MRI) and ultrasound scans. The median wait for a CT scan across Canada was 4.3 weeks, but in Prince Edward Island, it's 9 weeks. A Canadian's median wait for an MRI was 10.3 weeks, but in Newfoundland, patients waited 28 weeks. Finally, the median wait for an ultrasound was 3.8 weeks across Canada, but in Manitoba and Prince Edward Island it was 8 weeks.

Despite the long waiting times Canadians suffer, sometimes resulting in death, under federal law, private clinics are not legally allowed to provide services covered by the Canada Health Act. Regardless of this prohibition, a few black-market clinics service patients who are willing to break the law to get treatment. In British Columbia, for example, Bill 82 provides that a physician can be fined up to $20,000 for accepting fees for surgery. According to a Canada News article, "Shortage of Doctors and Nurses Could Hurt Medicare Reforms" (3/5/03), about 10,000 doctors left Canada during the 1990s.

There's help for some Canadian patients. According to a Canadian Medical Association Journal article, "U.S. Hospitals Use Waiting-List Woes to Woo Canadians" (2/22/2000), "British Columbia patients fed up with sojourns on waiting lists as they await tests or treatment are being wooed by a hospital in Washington state that has begun offering package deals. A second U.S. hospital is also considering marketing its services." One of the attractions is that an MRI, which can take anywhere from 10 to 28 weeks in Canada, can be had in two days at Olympic Memorial Hospital in Port Angeles, Wash. Already, Cleveland is Canada's hip-replacement center.

Some of our politicians hold up the Canadian and British nationalized health care systems as models for us. You can bet that should we ever have such a system, they would exempt themselves from what the rest of us would have to endure.

There's a cure for our health care problems. That cure is not to demand more government but less government. I challenge anyone to identify a problem with health care in America that is not caused or aggravated by federal, state and local governments. And, I challenge anyone to show me people dying on the streets because they don't have health insurance.

London's Observer (3/3/02) carried a story saying that an "unpublished report shows some patients are now having to wait more than eight months for treatment, during which time many of their cancers become incurable."

hokie wrote :

Quote:

London's Observer (3/3/02) carried a story saying that an "unpublished report shows some patients are now having to wait more than eight months for treatment, during which time many of their cancers become incurable."

similarly , here in canada there are sometimes long wait times for certain procedures .

what i am wondering is this :
does EVERY U.S. citizen regardless of ability to pay always receive immediate and complete treatment for any injury or sickness ?
is the pauper or the unemploed treated equally as well as the well-to-do person with sufficient insurance to cover any and all injury and sickness ?

under canada's universal health system your social status bears little relationship to the treatment received - and if one isn't satisfied with the treatment in canada , one is free to obtain and pay for treatment in the U.S. or any other country .

if the U.S. health care system is so much superior , why is the U.S life expectancy not the highest in the world ?

imo canadian's are getting good value for their money .
i'm sure if we would be willing to pay as much as american's , our health care could be even better .
at this time , very few canadians are willing to pay more for their health care , that's for sure .
hbg

hamburger wrote:

hokie wrote :

Quote:

London's Observer (3/3/02) carried a story saying that an "unpublished report shows some patients are now having to wait more than eight months for treatment, during which time many of their cancers become incurable."

similarly , here in canada there are sometimes long wait times for certain procedures .

what i am wondering is this :
does EVERY U.S. citizen regardless of ability to pay always receive immediate and complete treatment for any injury or sickness ?
is the pauper or the unemploed treated equally as well as the well-to-do person with sufficient insurance to cover any and all injury and sickness ?

under canada's universal health system your social status bears little relationship to the treatment received - and if one isn't satisfied with the treatment in canada , one is free to obtain and pay for treatment in the U.S. or any other country .

if the U.S. health care system is so much superior , why is the U.S life expectancy not the highest in the world ?

imo canadian's are getting good value for their money .
i'm sure if we would be willing to pay as much as american's , our health care could be even better .
at this time , very few canadians are willing to pay more for their health care , that's for sure .
hbg

life expectancy is not an accurate measure of "good medical care" since it is largely based on genetics. also, having great medical care doesn't mean much when you have patients who don't listen to medical advice.

what i am wondering is this :
does EVERY U.S. citizen regardless of ability to pay always receive immediate and complete treatment for any injury or sickness ?
is the pauper or the unemploed treated equally as well as the well-to-do person with sufficient insurance to cover any and all injury and sickness ?

life expectancy is not an accurate measure of "good medical care" since it is largely based on genetics. also, having great medical care doesn't mean much when you have patients who don't listen to medical advice.

USAFHokie80 wrote:

hamburger wrote:

hokie wrote :

Quote:

London's Observer (3/3/02) carried a story saying that an "unpublished report shows some patients are now having to wait more than eight months for treatment, during which time many of their cancers become incurable."

similarly , here in canada there are sometimes long wait times for certain procedures .

what i am wondering is this :
does EVERY U.S. citizen regardless of ability to pay always receive immediate and complete treatment for any injury or sickness ?
is the pauper or the unemploed treated equally as well as the well-to-do person with sufficient insurance to cover any and all injury and sickness ?

under canada's universal health system your social status bears little relationship to the treatment received - and if one isn't satisfied with the treatment in canada , one is free to obtain and pay for treatment in the U.S. or any other country .

if the U.S. health care system is so much superior , why is the U.S life expectancy not the highest in the world ?

imo canadian's are getting good value for their money .
i'm sure if we would be willing to pay as much as american's , our health care could be even better .
at this time , very few canadians are willing to pay more for their health care , that's for sure .
hbg

life expectancy is not an accurate measure of "good medical care" since it is largely based on genetics. also, having great medical care doesn't mean much when you have patients who don't listen to medical advice.

You didn't address the real question:

Quote:

what i am wondering is this :
does EVERY U.S. citizen regardless of ability to pay always receive immediate and complete treatment for any injury or sickness ?
is the pauper or the unemploed treated equally as well as the well-to-do person with sufficient insurance to cover any and all injury and sickness ?

You didn't address it, b/c it shows the problem with your argument: we have lower wait times and such b/c we tell large segments of the population to f*ck off.

Cycloptichorn

USAFHokie80 wrote :

Quote:

life expectancy is not an accurate measure of "good medical care" since it is largely based on genetics. also, having great medical care doesn't mean much when you have patients who don't listen to medical advice.

please tell us what an accurate measure of "good medical care" is .
i would be very interested in learning about it .
anything that will improve the health-care and well-being of the TOTAL POPULATION at reasonable cost is certainly something i would very much welcome .

i would think that it would also help improve mortality and morbidity rates . i certainly doubt that it would adversely effect those rates .

i doubt that anyone would object to better health care for ALL MEMBERS OF OUR SOCIETY - young and old , rich and poor - or am i mistaken in my assumption ?
hbg

btw. i just looked into my 1999 LIFE ALMANAC .
infant mortality rates :
bahamas 19/1000
barbados 17.3/1000
dominican republic 44.3/1000
cuba 7.9/1000

rather interesting imo
could it possible have anything at all to do with health care ?

Something relevant....

what standards do you propose should be used ?
hbg

hamburger wrote:

what standards do you propose should be used ?
hbg

How quickly HE and HIS family gets treated of course....who gives a F*** about everybody else, those lazy bastards.

hamburger wrote:

what standards do you propose should be used ?
hbg

How quickly HE and HIS family gets treated of course....who gives a F*** about everybody else, those lazy bastards.

What ever happened to the 90 percent christians in this country?