Tryagain
 
  1  
Reply Mon 9 Apr, 2007 06:48 am
0 Replies
 
Richard Saunders
 
  1  
Reply Mon 9 Apr, 2007 07:07 am
Eventually its all going to come out in the wash. The whole income tax-financing-the-federal reserve is simply a big pyramid scheme which cannot be sustained forever and which will implode upon itself.

Having nothing but a fiat currency guarantees this eventuality.

Just my opinion.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Mon 9 Apr, 2007 07:25 am
Quote:
These statistics-- which are for the year 2000, by the way-- refer to the circumstances of your letter carrier and the IRS agent who audits your tax return, among others. Several million others.

No, those stats are for the year 2012. Read the sentence.

Quote:
By the time our average federal employee reaches 30 years of service in 2012, he will be 59 years old, his annual salary will be $90,721


Quote:
On the other hand, the 2000 median income for all ages in the United States overall, according to the U.S. Census Bureau's Sept., 2001 report "Money Income In The United States: 2000" was $42,148

Now the idiot is comparing 2000 salaries to 2012 salaries. Only a complete moron would do such a thing or accept someone else doing that. Lets run some simple math and see what a $42,148 salary would be in 2012 at 3% inflation. At 3% inflation the average salary in the US would be $61,881. Well over the retirement salary for a postal worker. Keep in mind the postal worker is not recieving any Social Security payments. At 2% inflation the average salary in 2012 would be $54,510. Still putting the average salary well over the retirement salary.

Lets face it. Someone that compares 2000 figures to 2012 figures to try to demonize someone is a villian of the highest order.

But of course the arugment about average salary ignores the time in the workforce and the high earning power of someone in their 50s. Just for comparison lets find the salaries of 50-59 year olds.
Here is the average salary in 2006 of those with more than 20 years experience
http://www.payscale.com/research/US/Years_Experience=20_years_or_more/Salary

Again, if we adjust for inflation, it appears that the 30 year veteran of the postal service is making about the same as a 20 year construction worker. Hardly some fantastic amount of money.

Maybe you need to read more carefully Tryagain. Look at what the person is really saying and how they are spinning the numbers rather than believing without examining it all.
Quote:
Even the most sincerely held and well-intentioned misunderstanding has the serious potential to ruin the lives of those misled by it.


If this was an example of the integrity of those that challenge the income tax, the only thing it says to me is how intellectually and morally bankrupt they are.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Mon 9 Apr, 2007 07:57 am
Tryagain wrote:
I think you will find you can and with the blessing of thr IRS.

It appears you are right about the business use of home. They have changed the standards again after they tightened them up a few years ago.

Quote:
Your home office will qualify as your principal place of
business if you meet the following requirements.

• You use it exclusively and regularly for administrative
or management activities of your trade or business.

• You have no other fixed location where you conduct substantial administrative or management activities

http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-pdf/p587.pdf
0 Replies
 
Tryagain
 
  1  
Reply Mon 9 Apr, 2007 03:00 pm
Welcome back Richard, "The whole income tax-financing-the-federal reserve is simply a big pyramid scheme which cannot be sustained forever and which will implode upon itself."

Never a truer statement made.



Eagle eyed Parados wrote, " Maybe you need to read more carefully Tryagain. Look at what the person is really saying…"

Wise words indeed.


Then on this Easter Monday, Parados saw the light:

"It appears you are right about the business use of home."


OMG I hope you will understand that I am writing this from Mercy Hospital. Please, in future preface any such agreements with a HEALTH WARNING so the necessary precautions may be taken.
0 Replies
 
Tryagain
 
  1  
Reply Tue 10 Apr, 2007 12:19 pm
0 Replies
 
TTH
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 04:15 am
Tryagain do you ever talk normal? :wink: Laughing Laughing

I can't understand you most of the time when you talk about taxes.
I think you help the IRS by writing forms most people can't understand.

Am I happy to pay taxes to the government? I rather have the money myself but, I believe in paying taxes. I will pay taxes any day as long as the government keeps up with technology.

Did I hear the word AUDIT? Have you ever been to one? Can you imagine a taxpayer's face when they are being audited by the IRS and at the end of it they actually get money back Shocked
Does that ever happen? Sure it does. Or, how about after the audit and everything looked good so the tax return stands as is? Wow that is a load off the taxpayers shoulder.

I think it is great that the IRS is auditing more. I pay my share so I feel others should too.

When I look into the sky and I see the F-117 Stealth Fighter fly by, I get the biggest smile on my face and think there is an example of my tax dollars hard at work. That is quite a sight to see too.

Just out of curiosity I want to give you a challenge. Of course you don't have to accept. Is it at all possible for you to tell us all in one sentence with words that are normal when does the AMT (Alternative Minimum Tax) apply? Just saying yes doesn't count either. You would actually have to write the sentence. The sentence cannot take 1/2 page either. When people have asked me I tell them in 5 words. They may not like it but it is the best I have been able to do. I am just curious to see someone else's answer.
So actually, anyone please feel free to try. I would like to see a better answer than the one I give.
0 Replies
 
Richard Saunders
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 04:19 am
tryingtohelp wrote:
Tryagain do you ever talk normal? :wink: Laughing Laughing

I can't understand you most of the time when you talk about taxes.
I think you help the IRS by writing forms most people can't understand.

Am I happy to pay taxes to the government? I rather have the money myself but, I believe in paying taxes. I will pay taxes any day as long as the government keeps up with technology.

Did I hear the word AUDIT? Have you ever been to one? Can you imagine a taxpayer's face when they are being audited by the IRS and at the end of it they actually get money back Shocked
Does that ever happen? Sure it does. Or, how about after the audit and everything looked good so the tax return stands as is? Wow that is a load off the taxpayers shoulder.

I think it is great that the IRS is auditing more. I pay my share so I feel others should too.

When I look into the sky and I see the F-117 Stealth Fighter fly by, I get the biggest smile on my face and think there is an example of my tax dollars hard at work. That is quite a sight to see too.

Just out of curiosity I want to give you a challenge. Of course you don't have to accept. Is it at all possible for you to tell us all in one sentence with words that are normal when does the AMT (Alternative Minimum Tax) apply? Just saying yes doesn't count either. You would actually have to write the sentence. The sentence cannot take 1/2 page either. When people have asked me I tell them in 5 words. They may not like it but it is the best I have been able to do. I am just curious to see someone else's answer.
So actually, anyone please feel free to try. I would like to see a better answer than I give.

FYI: You're income tax dollars didnt pay for that Stealth Fighter... In fact the personal income tax doesnt pay for any services for the country.
0 Replies
 
TTH
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 04:24 am
Where does my tax dollars go then?
0 Replies
 
Richard Saunders
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 04:27 am
tryingtohelp wrote:
Where does my tax dollars go then?

Basically it goes to pay interest on the debt. Most people dont realize that this country doesnt issue its own currency but instead actually purchases it from a private company.. If we got rid of that process and had the country return to issuing its own currency we could also get rid of the personal income tax and nothing would be affected.
0 Replies
 
TTH
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 04:36 am
What private company? I have been to Washington D.C. and I have seen them make our money.
0 Replies
 
Richard Saunders
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 04:38 am
tryingtohelp wrote:
What private company? I have been to Washington D.C. and I have seen them make our money.

They print it, but they do not actually issue it. The private company is called 'Federal Reserve System'
0 Replies
 
Richard Saunders
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 04:42 am
Richard Saunders wrote:
tryingtohelp wrote:
What private company? I have been to Washington D.C. and I have seen them make our money.

They print it, but they do not actually issue it. The private company is called 'Federal Reserve System'

TO further explain the process. The BEP prints up the bills and is paid a fee of about 3 cents per bill by the federal reserve.. So lets take a $100 Bill.. They are paid 3 cents to make it up. The Federal Reserve then turns around and sells that bill to the govt for $100 Face amount. That note is then introduced into the economy. This is the real reason we have all this debt going on with the federal govt.
0 Replies
 
TTH
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 04:59 am
You still have the Federal Reserve Banks which the private banks must be a member of. The money is still in the U.S. I think that is one of the ways they control interest rates. It is still tax dollars IMO. It is just a matter of where it is sitting and how the money gets moved around.


When I say I think that is how they control interest rates. I mean I think.
I really am not sure. I never researched it.
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 07:05 am
Somehow Richard has this delusion that the Federal government could buy printing presses for zero dollars and get people to run them for zero dollars.

Even if the Federal government did the printing Richard it would cost at least 3 cents per bill and perhaps more.

You should really spend some time to look at the budget Richard. All our money does not go for debt. If we pay $100 for an item and then give it to someone else for something valued at $100, how much is the item we have worth?
0 Replies
 
parados
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 07:09 am
tryingtohelp wrote:
You still have the Federal Reserve Banks which the private banks must be a member of. The money is still in the U.S. I think that is one of the ways they control interest rates. It is still tax dollars IMO. It is just a matter of where it is sitting and how the money gets moved around.


When I say I think that is how they control interest rates. I mean I think.
I really am not sure. I never researched it.


Quote:
How can the Federal Reserve influence the direction of interest rates? In one of two ways:


By raising or lowering the discount rate.
By indirectly influencing the direction of the Federal funds rate.

The Discount Rate
The discount rate is the interest rate banks are charged when they borrows funds overnight directly from one of the Federal Reserve Banks. When the cost of money increases for your bank, they are going to charge you more as a result. This makes capital more expensive and results in less borrowing. Spending decreases, causing it to become more difficult for prices to rise; the opposite being true when capital becomes less expensive due to a decrease in the discount rate.

The Federal Funds Rate
The Federal funds rate is the rate that banks charge each other for overnight loans. "Why would one bank borrow cash from another?" you ask. The Fed can require banks to keep a certain percentage of assets in the form of cash on hand or deposited in one of the Federal Reserve banks. From time to time, it will establish a required ratio of reserves to deposits; when this ratio is increased, more cash must be kept in the vault at night, making it more difficult (and expensive) for funds to be acquired. When the reserve requirement is lowered, the money supply is loosened; because less cash has to be kept on hand it becomes easier to acquire capital.

http://beginnersinvest.about.com/od/banking/a/aa062405.htm
0 Replies
 
TTH
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 07:55 am
Thank you parados. Smile

Hey Richard, my tax dollars are up in our sky paying for that stealth fighter. I wish everyone had the opportunity to actually be outside and have that fly over head. It is an amazing aircraft. I have seen it twice in the air. It really makes me feel good when I know that is where some of my tax dollars go.

I saw something else through that link that looks interesting so when I have time I want to read up on it.
0 Replies
 
Richard Saunders
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 08:46 am
parados wrote:
Somehow Richard has this delusion that the Federal government could buy printing presses for zero dollars and get people to run them for zero dollars.

Even if the Federal government did the printing Richard it would cost at least 3 cents per bill and perhaps more.

You should really spend some time to look at the budget Richard. All our money does not go for debt. If we pay $100 for an item and then give it to someone else for something valued at $100, how much is the item we have worth?

I bet you're one of those people who believe GDP and GNP are the same thing too and the govt just decided to use GDP now because its 'better' though what they've really done is hide the fact that foreginers are buying up more of America by changing the way they measure a particular set of numbers.
0 Replies
 
Richard Saunders
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 08:47 am
tryingtohelp wrote:
Thank you parados. Smile

Hey Richard, my tax dollars are up in our sky paying for that stealth fighter. I wish everyone had the opportunity to actually be outside and have that fly over head. It is an amazing aircraft. I have seen it twice in the air. It really makes me feel good when I know that is where some of my tax dollars go.

I saw something else through that link that looks interesting so when I have time I want to read up on it.

Again, your tax dollars didnt pay for it. Corporate income tax did.
0 Replies
 
Richard Saunders
 
  1  
Reply Thu 12 Apr, 2007 08:51 am
parados wrote:
Somehow Richard has this delusion that the Federal government could buy printing presses for zero dollars and get people to run them for zero dollars.

Even if the Federal government did the printing Richard it would cost at least 3 cents per bill and perhaps more.

You should really spend some time to look at the budget Richard. All our money does not go for debt. If we pay $100 for an item and then give it to someone else for something valued at $100, how much is the item we have worth?

You're negating the fact that the govt doesnt have to 'pay $100' if it issued its own money. It would be much better for the govt to pay 3 cents and issue the $100 on its own. Why is this so unbelievable for certain people to understand is beyond me.
0 Replies
 
 

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