Any serious Christians left?

Arella Mae- I give up! Apparently there is no way that logic and reason can even enable you to consider your stand when you think that your god has said "the word".

Hey, if your religion gives you peace, more power to you. I would suspect though, that one day your eyes will be opened, and I think that you might be very, very pissed off with yourself. Happy trails!

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Give up?

Give up on what? I thought we were just having a discussion! I didn't realize you were trying to change my views or convert me to your way of thinking! Shocked

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Arella Mae wrote:

Give up? Give up on what? I thought we were just having a discussion! I didn't realize you were trying to change my views or convert me to your way of thinking!

I certainly was not attempting to "convert" you. It is just that I find your views very much out of even mainstream Christian thought. I found you fascinating. Even though I have known many Christians in my lifetime, I had never known anyone as adamantly fundamentalist as you.

Some of the things that you have written on this and other threads were, to me, so "way out" that I had a hard time believing that a person actually ascribled to those ideas.

I attempted to offer some alternative approaches, to see if you could think through some of your stances on issues. No one asked you to change, just to think. I have come to the conclusion that your beliefs are set in stone, so there is really no reason for any discussion. If I want to know what you think, all that I need to do is pick up a New Testament, and it will be all there.

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Well, I for one entertain no ambition of changing your views or converting your way of thinking A M ... some things just plain offer no payoff. I'm sure you honestly, sincerely do the best you are able given the resources available to you.

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And, she got 85 pages of attention by people hoping against hope that this could be the day!

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In witnessing to God's call for justice and human dignity, the Mission and Social Justice Commission of The Riverside Church seeks to celebrate diversity, build inclusiveness, and ensure equity for God's people locally, nationally and internationally. The Commission facilitates the planning and implementation of activities available to every member of the Church and community through worship, reflection, education, service and action. Toward these ends, the Commission is responsible for the benevolence, service and social justice ministries of the Church.

Below are descriptions of social justice ministries, task forces and programs:

THE MINISTRIES

1. Global Justice and Peace:
Witnesses to Riversiders' involvement as an international peace church and focuses on the United Nations' role in peace making and peace building.

2. Maranatha:
Maranatha, a ministry of The Riverside Church, is committed to serving God by fostering greater understanding while promoting equity for Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender and Queer/Questioning people. To these ends, we have organized our ministry to serve, advocate, and support the LGBTQ community.

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timberlandko wrote:

Well, I for one entertain no ambition of changing your views or converting your way of thinking A M ... some things just plain offer no payoff. I'm sure you honestly, sincerely do the best you are able given the resources available to you.

Timber, the payoff I find is just learning of others' beliefs and how they think. That's enough for me.

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cicerone imposter wrote:

In witnessing to God's call for justice and human dignity, the Mission and Social Justice Commission of The Riverside Church seeks to celebrate diversity, build inclusiveness, and ensure equity for God's people locally, nationally and internationally. The Commission facilitates the planning and implementation of activities available to every member of the Church and community through worship, reflection, education, service and action. Toward these ends, the Commission is responsible for the benevolence, service and social justice ministries of the Church.

Below are descriptions of social justice ministries, task forces and programs:

THE MINISTRIES

1. Global Justice and Peace:
Witnesses to Riversiders' involvement as an international peace church and focuses on the United Nations' role in peace making and peace building.

2. Maranatha:
Maranatha, a ministry of The Riverside Church, is committed to serving God by fostering greater understanding while promoting equity for Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual, Transgender and Queer/Questioning people. To these ends, we have organized our ministry to serve, advocate, and support the LGBTQ community.

And just what is YOUR point?

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JPB wrote:

And, she got 85 pages of attention by people hoping against hope that this could be the day!

JPB, you know what really offends me? What offends me is other people consistently telling me I am imposing my beliefs on them, etc., and I do not TELL them YOU HAVE to believe it. Yet, I am consistently told by many on this forum that we are just having a discussion and no one is trying to change my views. Ok, I can accept that.

But statements like yours and "I was just trying to get you to think" I find offensive because it seems some have already made up their minds (set in stone) that I don't think, I am wrong, my views need to be changed, etc.

It's a discussion to me. It is an exchange of ideas. PERIOD! Understand? I don't tell you or anyone else that you don't think, you're illogical, irrational, etc., for what you believe or what you don't believe because I accept that we are all different.

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The point is that the article is way beyond your comprehension range.

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Perhaps not, Arella, but you do tell them how they have to BEHAVE, don't you?

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JPB wrote:

Perhaps not, Arella, but you do tell them how they have to BEHAVE, don't you?

I do? Telling them what the Bible says is not me telling anyone how to behave JPB. Asking someone to not cuss, use God's name in vain, etc., is not telling them how to behave. Telling people what is offensive to me and asking them to not do it is not telling them how to behave. I do not demand that anyone do anything. Request? Yes, request often, yes!

You know, kind of like you implying I am wrong, or I'll never get it, etc.?

Funny, but I don't see you having a single problem with anyone else actually telling me what to do, (i.e., leave, etc.) I don't see you saying a single thing about anyone saying anything to me implying I said something I never said or that I have a belief that I have even denied having). Why is that JPB? Why is it that you only appear (to me at least) to do this? I haven't read every post in every thread you've posted in but in this one, where have you once even tried to understand me?

If you are going to point fingers, then kindly point them at everyone.

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Okay, JPB, point at everyone (else) that attempts to restrict the freedoms of others through their votes?

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cicerone imposter wrote:

The point is that the article is way beyond your comprehension range.

It is NOT beyond my comprehension range. I understand it just fine. So, if you were trying to show me I was incorrect just because other churches, Christians, etc., subscribe to that belief then I will tell you like Setanta has posted to me: "Just because 50,000 people believe a stupid thing, it doesn't make it any less stupid." (Paraphrased).

I don't agree with the teachings of those in your post. DUH!

You, in my opinion, just like to poke fun at me and mock me and insult me because I believe in something you don't and seem to think you are better than me because of it. I never thought I was better than you because you don't believe.

Oh, and don't apologize to me again CI, please. I am afraid I'd have a hard time believing you ever meant it in the first place.

SO in the interest of causing no more strife......................................CLICK!

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I was talking about your voting patterns, Arella. You said you never tell anyone what to BELIEVE and that you vote according to what the bible says. You've admitted in this thread that those votes can deny someone a right to choose how to live their own lives. So by your vote you tell people how to BEHAVE and that vote is based on your BELIEF, right? So, it doesn't matter to you that people have a different belief set than you are long as they behave in a manner that is in keeping with the laws of your god.

Who else would you like me to point that out to?

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Arella Mae, if you get all upset and angry over someone else's language, how they say what they say, why don't you look at yourself. Ask yourself, why am I poking my nose into how someone else speaks? Then, why don't you just say what you must say the way you want to say it. Be an example, for Pete's sake!
You sound as a goody-two-shoes, and you are the one pointing fingers.

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I have bad news for AM. The US claims over 80 percent of christians, but is one of the most crime riddled country in the "civilized" world. AM and her ilk are failing miserably.

Onward christian sol-o-diers, marching off to war...

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sozobe wrote:

Intrepid wrote:
Arella Mae wrote:
WAIT A MINUTE! WHAT DO YOU MEAN 'MA'?

Hmmmm.....somebody is baaacckkk

Check out the date he joined -- he's been around and posting in the Spirituality & Religion forum since before Arella Mae joined (as Momma Angel). Just because someone has 62 posts (or whatever the total is now) doesn't mean he's new.

Thanks for the head slap. I needed that. I usually check my facts..... Embarrassed

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Arella Mae wrote:

Phoenix32890 wrote:
Arella Mae- There is one important point that you make, that I cannot fathom. On one hand you vote your conscience, based on learning about the issues. On the other hand, you say that you believe that the bible is the word of god, and believe every word of it. How do you deal with some of the contradictions found in the bible?
[/color][/b]

Phoenix, I don't believe there are any real contradictions in the Bible. There are things that may appear contradictory but if research is done on them I've always found an explanation. . .

And in so doing, you have made an interpretation.

Arella Mae wrote:

Phoenix wrote:
Apparently, from what you are saying, I can infer that you may make up your mind about something, but if you subsequently discover something in the bible that is in opposition to your conclusions, you will reverse your decision. Am I correct in that assumption? And when you find a contradiction in the bible, which words do you believe?

Phoenix, yes, you can infer that. Try to look at it this way for one second. If one truly believes God is the ultimate authority, and therefore; His word is the ultimate authority, which I believe, why wouldn't I accept God's word over anyone's? Even my own?

You take the words as they are written, and then you consider what the real meaning must be.

Phoenix wrote:

I don't know much about the New Testament, but a quick perusal found this passage:

THE GOSPEL ACCORDING TO
ST MATTHEW
CHAPTER 15
4 For God commanded, saying, Honour thy father and mother: and, He that curseth father or mother, let him die the death.

Arella Mae wrote:

I believe that Jesus means resentment, anger, etc., is to be avoided . . .

Then you are, without question, interpreting the written word.

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JPB wrote:

I was talking about your voting patterns, Arella. You said you never tell anyone what to BELIEVE and that you vote according to what the bible says. You've admitted in this thread that those votes can deny someone a right to choose how to live their own lives. So by your vote you tell people how to BEHAVE and that vote is based on your BELIEF, right? So, it doesn't matter to you that people have a different belief set than you are long as they behave in a manner that is in keeping with the laws of your god.

Who else would you like me to point that out to?

Again, you will stick up for their right but not mine. I HAVE THE RIGHT TO VOTE THAT WAY! Why don't you say that? Why can't you just say, "you know what, according to the constitution of the United States, that is HER RIGHT"? All I hear is, no one is denying your right to vote. And no one is denying my right to vote, not even with words. But they are (with words at least) trying to deny my right to vote the way I want to or decide to. Because I don't agree I am then called (fill in the blank). HUH? Shocked

If you could vote that I couldn't consider my religious views in my vote, would you advocate for that JPB? I won't assume that you will. I honestly would like to know your answer.

And I admitted that yes, I understand how this may be restricting the rights of another person. AGAIN, what makes their right anymore important than mine? You are asking me (in essence) to give up my right to give someone else a right? HUH? Shocked

And yet, I get berated for it? Can't you see the hypocrisy in that JPB? This is why I say as long as we are within our legal limits we have no right to tell another person how to vote or what to base that vote on. PERIOD.

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Any serious Christians left?

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