LEGISLATORS Murder Young Students

Violent crime hit an all-time high in 1991. Footnote 1
Since then, "gun control" laws have been rolled back,
the number of privately-owned guns has risen to an all-time high,
and violent crime has dropped to a 30-year low.

More Guns.
The number of privately-owned guns in the U.S. is at an all-time high.
The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (BATFE)
estimates there were about 215 million guns in 19991;
the National Academy of Sciences puts the 1999 figure at 258 million. Footnote 2

The number of new guns each year averages about 4.5 million (about 2%). Footnote 3

According to the Bureau of Justice Statistics, there were 60.4 million
approved (new and used) NICS firearm transactions from 1994-2004. Footnote 4
The FBI reports that there were 61.6 million approved NICS transactions
from Nov. 30, 1998 through the end of 2005, and that the annual number
of transactions increased 2.4% between 2003-2004 and 3.1% between 2004-2005. Footnote 5

More Gun Owners.
The number of gun owners is also at an all-time high.
The U.S. population is at an all-time high (296 million), and rises about 1% annually, Footnote 6
and numerous surveys over the last 40+ years have found that almost half
of all households have at least one gun owner. Footnote 7

Some surveys since the late 1990s have indicated a smaller incidence of
gun ownership, Footnote 8
probably because of some respondents' concerns about "gun control,"
perhaps a residual effect of the anti-gun policies of the Clinton Administration.

More Right-to-Carry.
The number of RTC states is at an all-time high, up from 10 in 1987 to 40 today. Footnote 9

In 2005, states with RTC laws, compared to the rest of the country,
had lower violent crime rates on average: total violent crime lower by 22%,
murder by 30%, robbery by 46%, and aggravated assault by 12%. Footnote 10

Less "Gun Control."
Violent crime has declined while many "gun control" laws have been eliminated
or made less restrictive. Many states have eliminated prohibitory or
restrictive carry laws, in favor of Right-to-Carry laws. The federal Brady
Act's waiting period on handgun sales expired in 1998, in favor of the
NRA-supported National Instant Check, and some states concurrently or
thereafter eliminated waiting periods or purchase permit requirements.
The federal "assault weapon" ban expired in 2004. All states have hunter
protection laws, 46 have range protection laws, 46 prohibit local jurisdictions
from imposing gun laws more restrictive than state law,
44 protect the right to arms in their constitutions, and Congress and 33
states have prohibited frivolous lawsuits against the firearm industry. Footnote 11

Less Crime.
The FBI reports that the nation's total violent crime rate declined every year
between 1991-2004, to a 30-year low in 2004, and estimates that it rose 1% in 2005. Footnote 12

(By comparison, the most recent Bureau of Justice Statistics crime victim
survey found that "at the national level crime rates remain stabilized at
the lowest level experienced since 1973," when the first such survey was conducted. Footnote 14)

According to the FBI, in 2005 the nation's violent crime rates were
significantly lower than they were in 1991, when the violent crime rate hit
an all-time high. In 2005, total violent crime was lower by 38%, murder
by 43%, rape by 25%, robbery by 48%, and aggravated assault by 33%.
During 2004-2005, total violent crime was lower than anytime since 1976.
For the last seven years, the murder rate (between 5.5 and 5.7 per
100,000 annually) has been lower than anytime since 1965.13 Studies by
and/or for Congress, the Congressional Research Service, the Library of
Congress, the National Institute of Justice, the National Academy of Sciences,
and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention have found no
evidence that "gun control" reduces crime. Footnote 15

Notes:

1. BATF, "Crime Gun Trace Reports (1999) National Report," Nov. 2000, p. ix (www.atf.gov/firearms/ycgii/1999/index.htm).

2. National Research Council, Firearms and Violence: A Critical Review, National Academies Press, 2005.

3. BATF, "Firearms Commerce in the United States 2001/2002" (www.atf.gov/pub/index.htm#Firearms).

4. BJS, "Background Checks for Firearm Transfers, 2004" (http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov./bjs/pub/pdf/bcft04.pdf).

5. FBI, "NICS Operations 2005," Jan. 2006 (www.fbi.gov/hq/cjisd/nics/ops_report2005/html/ops_report2005.htm#page4)

6. Bureau of the Census (http://www.census.gov/popest/states/tables/NST-EST2005-01.xls).

7. Gary Kleck, Targeting Firearms, Aldine de Gruyter, 1997, pp. 94, 98-100.

8. E.g., BJS Sourcebook of Criminal Justice Statistics 2002, Table 2.58, (www.albany.edu/sourcebook/).

9. See NRA RTC fact sheet (within www.nraila.org/Issues/Filter.aspx?ID=003).

10. FBI, Crime in the United States 2005 (http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/05cius/data/documents/05tbl05.xls) for state crime statistics.

11. See NRA-ILA Compendium of State Firearms Laws (www.nraila.org/media/misc/compendium.htm). Also, note that in October 2005, federal legislation prohibiting such lawsuits was signed into law.

12. FBI, Crime in the United States 2005, Table 4, (http://www.fbi.gov/ucr/05cius/data/documents/05tbl04.xls) and BJS (http://bjsdata.ojp.usdoj.gov/dataonline/).

13. Ibid. Condensed at www.nraila.org, click on "Research," then "Crime Statistics."

14. BJS, "Criminal Victimization 2005," (www.ojp.usdoj.gov./bjs/pub/pdf/cv05.pdf).

15. Federal "assault weapon" ban: Roth, Koper, et al., Impact Evaluation of the Public Safety and Recreational Firearms Use Protection Act of 1994, March 13, 1997 (www.urban.org/url.cfm?ID=406797); Reedy and Koper, "Impact of handgun types on gun assault outcomes: a comparison of gun assaults involving semiautomatic pistols and revolvers," Injury Prevention 2003, (http://ip.bmjjournals.com/cgi/reprint/9/2/151); Koper et al., Report to the National Institute of Justice, An Updated Assessment of the Federal Assault Weapons Ban: Impacts on Gun Markets and Gun Violence, 1994-2003, June 2004 (www.sas.upenn.edu/jerrylee/jlc-new/Research/Koper_aw_final.pdf); Wm. J. Krouse, Congressional Research Service Report for Congress, "Semiautomatic Assault Weapons Ban," Dec. 16, 2004. "Gun control," generally: Library of Congress, Report for Congress: Firearms Regulations in Various Foreign Countries, May 1998, LL98-3, 97-2010; Task Force on Community Preventive Service, "First Reports Evaluating the Effectiveness of Strategies for Preventing Violence: Firearms Laws," Morbidity and Mortaility Weekly Report, Oct. 3, 2003 (www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/rr5214a2.htm); National Research Council, Firearms and Violence: A Critical Review, National Academies Press, 2005 (http://books.nap.edu/books/0309091241/html/index.html).

OmSigDAVID wrote:


Dont we all.

Anyway, you are right in the fact that "evil doers" (isnt GWB great ) will ,as you said, find a means of producing guns should they be somehow removed from the civil system.

But. On the issue of your "guns 4 kidz" program, I think thats a horrible idea. Why would you want to arm your kids?
Isnt it your job as a parent to protect your kids?
If you think that if your kids are endangered by leaving the house, then dont let them leave the house. Home school if you have too.

I just feel that if guns were allowed in the classroom, imagine the hysteria if a student felt like doing a little shooting because he was being teased at school. One thing leads to another, then you have all the pupils in a frantic shoot to survive mentality, shooting everyone with a gun (which in your perfect world would be everyone). The teachers would need guns to keep the classes in order.

Would your kids feel safer then?

If what your relying on is creating a playground cold war scenario so everyone is afraid to use guns because of retaliation with fatal force, to me this seems a little crazy.

As i said earlier, if someone really wanted to kill you, they would find alternate means.

There is more than one way to skin a sheep, even a sheep with a gun.

Because there have been occasions
in which children have been killed by violent attacks upon them.
When that happens ( tho it seldom does )
thay shud have the best available means
to defend themselves; I did.
I wud not deny that to anyone else, of any age
( if he is physically able to use it ).
In some cases,
a person of any age may be mentally disturbed;
we 'd not be in a hurry to put a gun in his hands,
tho some of such people wud arm themselves anyway.
THAT may require removing such a person from
contact with society, if he has done something rong.





That is the REASON for his ( or anyone ) having
defensive armament: so that he can defend his life,
if that becomes necessary.
If he needs it, and does not have it,
he can be forced to join the juvenile victims of murder.
( Note, incidentally, that I am not a parent. )



We know for a fact,
that everyone is in danger to SOME degree,
however slight, in leaving the house,
or in remaining inside it. For instance, the victims of Sept. 11
did not suspect that any harm wud intercept them.
People of any age can get killed ANYWHERE,
and they HAVE,
but staying inside, or living in fear is not the answer.

The answer is to prepare as well as possible
for all foreseeable emergencies,
then just hope for the best and ENJOY LIFE.



As far as I know,
that has never happened,
tho we all know that murderers have approached
with malice aforethought from outside.
If the victims had been armed,
the murderers wud not have lasted more than a few seconds.
Some of the victims spoke of preparing to defend themselves
using metal folding chairs as the best weapons they cud find;
I bet they 'd have preferred guns to chairs.
Don 't u think ?

In the State of Vermont, they 've never had any gun laws,
and very little crime, year after decade, according to FBI statistics.
Alaska repealed all of its gun laws a couple of years or so ago,
with no ill effects.



My first reaction to your question
was to say " yes " in that I did,
but on reflection, I must take cognizance
that every person, at any age, is unique, with different sentiments,
different value judgments, different emotions, and different choices.
Some people are hoplophobes, at all ages.
Your question is a lot like asking
how thay wud all vote, what philosophies thay 'd support.


Everyone is SUPPOSED to be afraid
to use guns with criminal malice;
I believe that is what u had in mind,
when u said " to use guns "; not practice on the gunnery range.



Yes; murderers did not wait around for guns to be invented
before beginning to slaughter folks.
Julius Caesar had no trouble getting assassinated
even without guns.




Yes.

Something GOOD, and refreshing about this post
is that there was NO personal acrimony.
It was CIVIL and polite, for which u have my thanks and my respect.
David

OmSigDAVID wrote:

This may be one of the most sane things you have said.

OmSigDavid wrote:



Yes, well, I did (eventually) come to the conclusion that because I'm not in your part of the planet, I really dont know what to conclude. However, as you said yourself the instances of armed criminal activities within school grounds is scarce and doesnt (IMHO) warrent pupils to be armed.

Altho that is true,
one never knows when defensive emergency equipment
will become necessary; hence, wisdom requires that one
be prepared to successfully address all foreseeable emergencies,
or take one 's chances of paying the consequences,
which might include loss of many decades of life.

Its better to have it and not need it,
than to need it and not have it.

Insofar as recidivisticly violent people are concerned,
I have advocated BANISHMENT from the North American Continent.
After thay r gone,
how thay arm themselves, and how thay get along
is their own private affair and is no longer any of our business.
David

Incidentally, I like your remarks
about abortions and drugs.
David

Finland has laws on gun ownership that are almost as liberal as in the United States (i.e. "ownership" not "carying them in public" let alone to school!). This has its roots in the widespread hunting culture, and partly in the fact that privately owned guns were used in the defence of the country during the Winter War. Still we do not have school shootings, or police shootouts, or unusually high numbers or firearm related murders (In fact the murder weapon of choice has traditionally been the axe). Hence my belief that there is more to US gun violence than just the widespread gun ownership. There is a culture of fear and violence, which is fuelled by the media, I believe. It seems to me that the best way to combat gun violence is not just to reduce gun ownership, since there are so many guns in the Us already that even if manufacture and sales stopped entirely there would still be a lifetime supply of hardware and ammo for any nut out there. I believe a culture change is required to reduce the fear that makes kids like sigDavid want to carry a gun at the age of 8, the same fear that convinced his parents to allow him to do so. The only reason to arm yourself (apart from the nuts who get sexually aroused by guns) is fear of others. The culture of fear leads to an arms race among the citizens and the ones who are most afraid will be the ones who are most triggerhappy (do it to "them" before they do it to you, shoot first ask questions later and other such American slogans fit the description). Isn't it sad that the richest most powerful nation is crippled by an all-pervasive fear of its own fellow citizens.

Right on. Fear mongering is what the media does - fear sells. Amber alerts, yellow alerts.....all of this is calculated to instill fear in people (americans) who have lived with first Nazi fear, then the Iron Curtain Communist fear, bomb shelters, air raid drills, etc. Kids grow up in an atmosphere of fear. I find it ironic that in the US, I see people wearing 'NO FEAR' t-shirts. Are they trying to convince themselves?

For their culture to change they will need to begin by treating other cultures with respect. Especially ones that are so much older than the US. (Which is just about any country on Earth--including Mexico)

The US is like a snot-faced bully, punching other kids, but deep down they know they are inferior; thus the 'bring em on' mentality of their fearless (haha) leader. Suddenly we don't hear about bin Laden anymore. He must be one smart guy to evade BushCo and all the 'intelligence' in the US.

The arms race must stop with the US. They have more than any other country, and they are certainly not responsible when it comes to where those arms are sent. The US supplied the Taliban with their weapons and they supply Israel with theirs. They have sold weapons to UAE, Egypt, Turkey, Pakistan, and supplied WMD's to Saddam who in turn used them to gas the Kurds. The US thumbs their nose at the UN Security Council, when it runs contrary to what they want. Americans should be spending their money on schools and medical insurance for their citizens, rather than billions on bombs. I realize there are many in high governmental positions in the US who are making a lot of money off of war-for-oil scams (Cheney and Halliburton, for one) but until americans wake up things will continue, and the US will bankrupt itself like Rome did, trying to control its Empire and the flow of oil.