Where is the balance between standing up for yourself . . .

Interesting question.
I feel, if a partner is that insensitive that he needs to be told
how to treat his spouse, then he'll be too insensitive to her efforts to
compromise.

How about the impression that you are "too sensitive". I have gotten that when I express how I feel about something that bothers me. Rather than understanding - sometimes I get the response - don't be so sensitive.

Mutual respect and the on-going practice of not taking each other for granted.

Not everyone is the same, Linkat, and if it is important to you
then it should be addressed, regardless. You always can say: "I might
be sensitive in this particular area, but it is important to me, and
therefore it should be important to you".

There is nothing wrong or bullying about pointing out behaviors that cross the line towards disrespect.

The best advice I was ever given with regards to parenting and/or partnering is to always talk to each other as if there was a guest in the room. Works like a champ!

CJ - I try to say it like that to my husband, but he has difficulty in putting himself in some one else's shoes. I am not saying he is a bad person or inconsiderate or it is some major issue, just that he has a harder time gasping that some one feels and when some one thinks differently than himself.

For example, when driving he will get very angry if some one slows down or looks like there looking for a certain street or something. His response that person can't drive! My response to him is usually something like - maybe their lost or maybe they're looking for a certain street. I find it easy to empathize with most people no matter what they are like - my husband quite the opposite - perhaps that is part of being more sensitive.

On the positive side he does realize that and even when we were getting married mentioned that as one thing he loved about me. So it can be difficult at times because of it, but like some one said before you need to try to respect each other even if you feel differently.

My response to your husband in this situation would probably be to not respond at all. He has buttons that get pushed. If his ire is directed at an outside entity, I probably wouldn't acknowledge it. If he's angry at someone outside of your involvement and takes it out on you by the way he treats you or speaks to you, then that's a totally different matter and one I wouldn't accept. The question, "Why are you speaking to me that way?" can oftentimes break the moment and let him think about what he's doing. By engaging him in conversation about a random driver lets him focus his feelings on the only person available. Does he behave the same way whether or not you're in the car? If so, then putting yourself in the situation only lets him continue to rant. Is he venting at you or at the windshield?

While at home, even if he's had a bad day and is a total grouch to all around him, I'd walk away saying something such as, "Let me know when you're ready to be civil." Everyone has buttons, but no one is entitled to take their frustrations out on those in the immediate vicinity. Demanding respect doesn't have to be overt, you can simply point out that the line has been crossed and you aren't a willing participant to the way he is venting.



Empathy is a fabulous trait, don't apologize for it or try to diminish it. You already accept that this in a difference between you and your husband. I don't think you can create empathy in someone else. He gets frustrated and calls someone a moron, or whatever. You don't think the other driver is necessary a moron, but what's the advantage of expending energy in the debate?

J-B made some very good points.

Linkat, I actually can empathize with your husband, as I am one of
the fast drivers, and anybody who slows me down, will get some choice
words from me too.

I guess that's why you and your husband complement each other -
he reacts to situations and you'll explain the cause why. This should
take the edge off him and in time with repetitive explanations he'll
learn to be more patient. Empathy is something one can learn if it
is pointed out and explained. Just keep it up.

And I think "You are too sensitive." Means you don't cope well with rudeness. I guess that makes me too sensitive.

I guess this one deserves a spot of its own, Philosophy and Debate, perhaps?

I don't know the answer.. but I think one can support change in it, from my own experience. Good idea for a thread.

Good one, J_B - open a thread!!

I am trying to teach my daughter empathy, so don't
shatter my hopes yet

Children can and do learn empathy from their parents, among others.

Trying to teach an ADULT, on the other hand, rarely works. IMO, if they haven't developed the emotional capacity by their teen years, it's pretty much too late.

Re: Where is the balance between standing up for yourself .



Back to the issue at hand... it's a matter of knowing your rightful place in the universe, which will allow you to be assertive, to be yourself. Sounds simple, but it isn't. It takes many of us a long time to get there, and some never do.

Go and read Jespah's thread, Bolt out of the Blue and take that advice. Just Say No to Bullying.

Good point, Roger.

While the discussion on empathy continues on the other thread, I have another thought on changing the behavior. I don't think modelling empathy will change the behavior, but demonstrating it might. What if, the next time he goes off about another driver, you pattern the same behavior (perhaps even at a exaggeration)? Screaming, "Yea, you f'n moron, how dare you slow down in front of my husband and make me have to sit here and listen to this crap?" Rather than bringing the discussion back to a one-on-one with your husband, you might be able to show him how idiotic his response really is. I don't think it will take many instances before he thinks about his rants while in your presence.

If nothing else, it should evoke a good laugh.

I think this discussion needs to be moved from the realm of the theoretical to the concrete.

Serious example: when my husband and I were first married, we lived in southern NH. He forbade me to work for any college because the pay was insufficient. He also told me to work only in NH and not in MA because he expected his dinner ready when he came from home work.

Mid-level example: He had his mother pick out our apt. , which was nothing I would ever selected, then he had the mother of his best friend select curtains -- I was still in Michigan before we married and he was on the road during the four months of between his moving to NH and our marriage.

Low level serious example: He told me that when furnishing our home, I could only shop at Paine's Furniture -- a store that has since gone out of business but seems to have been high end (never wentthere) or at antique shops.

My response to #1. After several months of fruitless looking in NH, I convinced him he should allow me to work in MA, after which I found two part-time NH jobs.

#2 Surprisingly, he decided Ethan Allen was alright. Interestingly, all antiques purchased by me were appraised at a higher value then those he inherited from his grandmother, a former dealer.

#3 I hated the drapes but told him the style was contemporary and did not match antique furnishings and suggested we return them. He refused again and again. Ifinally made new curtains.

J_B - In most cases, I do not say anything, but we are all human and sometimes his lack of patience and understanding can irk me. But then again I have a much longer fuse so usually I just let me vent out and ignore it. I am not 100% sure if he acts differently when I'm not there, but I can't imagine he wouldn't. It seems more his personality than something directed at me.

Funny I do say something along those lines - usually like just because you had a bad day don't take it out on me or I'll talk when you calm down and are nice something like that. Just the other day, he yelled at me to hurry up! This was for something I was going to do and didn't even involve him. I let him know that I don't appreciate being spoken to like a child, that I am his equal and will not spoken to so disrespectfully. I then went ahead with my business at hand and later that night he did apologize.

I understand that he does not intend to be rude, mean and disrespectful. He doesn't realize how demeaning that tone and words are - often he will say I am being too sensitive, other times after he thinks about it he will apologize.

Thanks all - if anything what you have to say does make me feel better.

J_B - love that thought - I may have to try it, but not sure how good I would be at pulling it off.