REPENT!!! THE END IS HERE????

Wolf_ODonnell wrote:

Okay, apologies for any offence caused.

Secondly, I still don't think you've got your terminologies right. Why invent a new a-religious term when you can just call use the term, fundamentalist Atheist or extreme Atheist?

I am an Atheist, but I'm reasonably tolerant of other religions (so long as they don't try and fop off lies as facts). In fact the only religion I'm intolerant of is Scientology and I see that more as a cult than anything else.

Furthermore, wouldn't a religion have to involve the worship of a God or some kind of spirituality? What with Atheists not having either, you can't really say they're a religion of sorts.

Dogmatic belief, perhaps, but not religion.

P.S. Can anybody see a way to get back on topic? Because I can't. I fear Wilso's comments may have permanently derailed the topic.

It seems that the U.S. federal court of appeals may not agree with you.

Posted: August 20, 2005
1:00 a.m. Eastern

© 2005 WorldNetDaily.com

A federal court of appeals ruled yesterday Wisconsin prison officials violated an inmate's rights because they did not treat atheism as a religion.

"Atheism is [the inmate's] religion, and the group that he wanted to start was religious in nature even though it expressly rejects a belief in a supreme being," the 7th Circuit Court of Appeals said.

I am just wondering.... Does your sig line emit tolerance? This is not a criticism, just an honest curiosity.

Now, back to trying to get the thread back on track.

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Wolf_ODonnell wrote:

Okay, apologies for any offence caused.

Secondly, I still don't think you've got your terminologies right. Why invent a new a-religious term when you can just call use the term, fundamentalist Atheist or extreme Atheist?

I am an Atheist, but I'm reasonably tolerant of other religions (so long as they don't try and fop off lies as facts). In fact the only religion I'm intolerant of is Scientology and I see that more as a cult than anything else.

Furthermore, wouldn't a religion have to involve the worship of a God or some kind of spirituality? What with Atheists not having either, you can't really say they're a religion of sorts.

Dogmatic belief, perhaps, but not religion.

P.S. Can anybody see a way to get back on topic? Because I can't. I fear Wilso's comments may have permanently derailed the topic.

Apology accepted and thank you. (Also thanks to Intrepid.)

But Wilso's comments didn't really derail the topic. He just added the usual element of Atheistic screed/tirade that is inevitably going to be part of the mix. Buddhists don't believe in God either, but they are definitely a religion, so a religion is a system of religious belief more than any kind of professed faith in a deity or deities. Atheism qualifies there quite easily. Whenever you have somebody adamently professing there is no God, that is as much a matter of faith as is a belief in God. And when (the generic) you work so hard to convince others of the validity of your religious faith, you are proselyting as much as any radical evangelist wearing a sandiwich board saying "Repent!!! The End is Near!!!!"

See? We're right back on topic. Smile

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Foxfyre wrote:

ents didn't really derail the topic. He just added the usual element of Atheistic screed/tirade that is inevitably going to be part of the mix. Buddhists don't believe in God either, but they are definitely a religion, so a religion is a system of religious belief more than any kind of professed faith in a deity or deities.

Ah, yes, but I stated or spirituality, which Buddhism has. Buddhism, I guess is atheism, but to say that means Atheism is religion is patently absurd.

Quote:

And when you work so hard to convince others of the validity of your religious faith, you are proselyting as much as any radical evangelist wearing a sandiwich board saying "Repent!!! The End is Near!!!!"

See? We're right back on topic.

Huzzah!

P.S. To say the signs in the Middle East now are a sign of the Rapture is patently ignoring the other times of turmoil like the Arab-Israeli War.

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Wolf_ODonnell wrote:

Foxfyre wrote:
ents didn't really derail the topic. He just added the usual element of Atheistic screed/tirade that is inevitably going to be part of the mix. Buddhists don't believe in God either, but they are definitely a religion, so a religion is a system of religious belief more than any kind of professed faith in a deity or deities.

Ah, yes, but I stated or spirituality, which Buddhism has. Buddhism, I guess is atheism, but to say that means Atheism is religion is patently absurd.

Quote:
And when you work so hard to convince others of the validity of your religious faith, you are proselyting as much as any radical evangelist wearing a sandiwich board saying "Repent!!! The End is Near!!!!"

See? We're right back on topic.

Huzzah!

P.S. To say the signs in the Middle East now are a sign of the Rapture is patently ignoring the other times of turmoil like the Arab-Israeli War.

Well I personally don't think this is "it", but turmoil in the Middle East does fit in with a lot of the more popular end time theologies. The ancients believed that life began in the general Middle East area that composed all the world that they knew at the time. And almost all end time speculation also places the beginnings of the tribulation and the end also in that area.

I think much of Bible prophecy is written back into the history as it unfolded and they could intellectually make this prophet's or that prophet's words fit into a particular scenario. But I do not think all prophecy can be explained in that way and there is much that defies any explanation other than supernatural activity at play if you believe it at all.

So how much of the end time prophecies were in fact for other periods of history and how much relate to events yet to come? Theologians have been arguing that for my entire lifetime and will no doubt be arguing it long after I've passed on. But, if you are a believer, there is always the possibility that we should be paying attention to what is going on in the world and understanding it in its true context. And that's what makes all this interesting while at the same time horrible to anybody with any human sensibilities at all.

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I remain curious. What would convince you (the generic you) that the time is now. All of world history is culiminating in a final dramatic climax according to Bible prophecy?

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bm

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Foxfyre wrote:

I remain curious. What would convince you (the generic you) that the time is now. All of world history is culiminating in a final dramatic climax according to Bible prophecy?

The same amount of evidence that could make me believe the earth is in fact filled with hydrogen, and as a result stays aloft in the great openness that is space, rather than fall and pop on the horn of a giant intercosmic unicorn.
Absurd? Absurd is relative to perspective.

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Doktor S wrote:

Foxfyre wrote:
I remain curious. What would convince you (the generic you) that the time is now. All of world history is culiminating in a final dramatic climax according to Bible prophecy?

The same amount of evidence that could make me believe the earth is in fact filled with hydrogen, and as a result stays aloft in the great openness that is space, rather than fall and pop on the horn of a giant intercosmic unicorn.
Absurd? Absurd is relative to perspective.

I love your metaphor. But expand on this please. Is this a colorful way of saying its all a lot of hooey?

And anybody else. Do you agree that it is? Why?

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Foxfyre wrote:

Doktor S wrote:
Foxfyre wrote:
I remain curious. What would convince you (the generic you) that the time is now. All of world history is culiminating in a final dramatic climax according to Bible prophecy?

The same amount of evidence that could make me believe the earth is in fact filled with hydrogen, and as a result stays aloft in the great openness that is space, rather than fall and pop on the horn of a giant intercosmic unicorn.
Absurd? Absurd is relative to perspective.

I love your metaphor. But expand on this please. Is this a colorful way of saying its all a lot of hooey?

And anybody else. Do you agree that it is? Why?

A lot of hooey? From the perspective of someone steeped in religion, raised to believe the bible is more than it appears to be, no. To these people the bible, it's predictions, and it's teachings are certainly not 'hooey'
But even such a person as this would need to take a huge leap to believe their purported end times are now.
I myself am not such a person, as I have never seen anything convincing to cause me to adopt the belief the bible is anything more than a work of literature. To me, a belief in biblical events or prophesies does in fact constitute a whole load of 'hooey', on par with a childs unshakeable belief that 'hogwarts' is a real place. Both unevidenced, both founded in literature.

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I think some of the signs that are being seen now can be and are too easily (to some, that is) explained away with "science". The increase in the amount of storms and their severity are being explained away. The rising crime rates are explained away as there are more people so it's not as bad as others think, etc.

So many things are happening in this world right now that point to the end times, but not everyone is going to see them for what they are. I would imagine that even when the rapture happens that "science" will find a way to explain that away also and many will accept what "science" says.

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Both Doktor and Arella Mae have a lot of company in their point of view, I think, and both their 'camps' can make strong cases to support those points of view.

In cases like this, where there is such wide divergence of belief, perception, and understanding, I like to think of myself as being in the 'what if?' camp. "What if?" Doktor is right? "What if?" Arella is right?
And then, if it is right, what do we do about it?

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Arella Mae wrote:

I think some of the signs that are being seen now can be and are too easily (to some, that is) explained away with "science". The increase in the amount of storms and their severity are being explained away. The rising crime rates are explained away as there are more people so it's not as bad as others think, etc.

So many things are happening in this world right now that point to the end times, but not everyone is going to see them for what they are. I would imagine that even when the rapture happens that "science" will find a way to explain that away also and many will accept what "science" says.

Increased amount of storms can be global warming or other earthly parterns we knoiw little about.

More crime is something christians say alot b/c the bible said that would happen in the end times. If you look the percent is the same, More ppl in the world equal more crimes but its still the same amount.

War has been around forever and more grusome than this....Also Isreal is always fighting, so any time could be the end time.

All the "signs" are very vague and can be interpreted by any1 to mean anything.

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Like I said, many of the signs can or will be explained away by "science" etc.

Foxfyre, I'm not sure what you mean by "what if"? If I am understanding what you are asking then "if" Doktor S and others are right then all that will happen is our bodies will die and that's it and I would say it wouldn't matter because we just won't know anyway.

But "what if" we are in the end times and the believers are correct? Well, I'd say that's a whole different story because the body dying won't be the end of it.

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Ill take my chances.

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the end will only happpen if some religious nutter gets his hands on the "Bomb" and make its happen.

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I keep forgetting that the only people in this world that are nuts are religious people. Rolling Eyes

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You want to know if end of times is approaching?

Listen to the experts who spend their lives searching for the signs.

http://www.prophecyupdate.com/warningsigns.htm

"The Earth is degenerating today. Bribery and corruption abound. Children no longer obey their parents, every man wants to write a book, and it is evident that the end of the world is fast approaching." Allegedly this came from an Assyrian tablet, c. 2800 BCE. However I seem to recall that an almost identical message was said to have appeared as graffiti on a wall in Pompeii.

SOURCE

For nearly 2,000 years Chrisitans have been looking for the Second Coming. They will still be looking 2,000 years in the future.

A list of failed prophecies from 30 CE to 1990.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/end_wrl2.htm

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It's the end of the world as we know it....again
http://www.geocities.com/athens/oracle/9941/

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BDV wrote:

the end will only happpen if some religious nutter gets his hands on the "Bomb" and make its happen.

Are you referring to George Bush, perchance?

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xingu wrote:

You want to know if end of times is approaching?

Listen to the experts who spend their lives searching for the signs.

http://www.prophecyupdate.com/warningsigns.htm

"The Earth is degenerating today. Bribery and corruption abound. Children no longer obey their parents, every man wants to write a book, and it is evident that the end of the world is fast approaching." Allegedly this came from an Assyrian tablet, c. 2800 BCE. However I seem to recall that an almost identical message was said to have appeared as graffiti on a wall in Pompeii.

SOURCE

For nearly 2,000 years Chrisitans have been looking for the Second Coming. They will still be looking 2,000 years in the future.

A list of failed prophecies from 30 CE to 1990.

http://www.religioustolerance.org/end_wrl2.htm

Your first link, from Bakersfield, California is a pay site for unwary believers. Your list of failed prophecies is a hoot since the "prophecies" listed are made by your average Joe. It is no different than if you or I made a prophecy. My prophecy is that morning will come after a period of darkness.

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REPENT!!! THE END IS HERE????

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