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Wed 19 Jul, 2006 01:14 pm
This is a topic not so popular in world history prospect, but it is a disputable topic and I thought that maybe some of you have an opinion about it.
I am referring to the origin of the Albanian peoples, as they are many different opinions about it. Albania is a small country in the West Balkans as most of you know. It is located where the Adriatic sea and the Ionian sea meet - an area called Illyria in the antiquity. The Albanians comprise a different ethnic and linguistic group compared with the nearby nations (Slavs and Greeks). I am not a fan of the theory of the Indo-Europeans, but according to the scientists who support it, the Albanian language is a disputable part. For some of them it is an Indoeuropean language but for some others it isn't. The Albanians call theirselves Shqiptar and their country Shqiperi. As I said their origin is disputable. I am going to sum up the most popular theories, I am placing the two dominant theories in the beginning:
1. Albanians are the direct descedants of the Illyrians. Other Illyrian of the nearby areas were assimilated or mixed with the Slavs who came to the area later, so Albanians is the only clear inheritors of the Illyrians. The opposing ones to this theory have the argument that Albanian language is way different than the Illyrian one and the Albanian culture is too similar to the Ottoman Turkish culture, as well as they are called Albanians and not Illyrians.
2. Albanians come from the coast of the Caspian sea. The most important argument of the supporters of this theory, is that there was a land called Albania, back in the Roman era in the coast of the North Caspian, where today Azerbaijan is. According to this theory the Albanians cbame to the Balkans with the Ottoman Turks, as part of their army, during the Middle ages. The opposing ones to these theories use mentions of some Hellenic explorers, about an Illyrian tribe called Albanoi (Albanians) as well as they are Illyrian elements and names in Albanian language. Here I want to note that they are not words for sea terms in Albanian language, as they use words of Hellenic and Latin origin.
3. Albanians are of Turkish/Tatar origin. It is a fact Albanians were having an important role in the Ottoman army in many periods of the empire's flourish. Following the Caspian sea theory, there is also a theory that Albanians are Turks, who mixed with the populations of Illyria and developed their own language. However this theory can be easily declined, as the Turkish and the Albanian language are unrelated.
4. The Albanians come from a mix of Illyrians, Epirots and the Caspian Albanians. The followers of this theory believe that the Albanians really came with the Ottoman Turks, they were mixed with the native Illyrians and Epirots and they created their seperate Albanian culture which had a lot of Turkish elements as it was developed in a period where the area was Ottoman.
What do you think?
I doubt that there's a clear line after 167/165 when Gentius was defeated by the Romans and Illyria became ... Illyria.
Generally, I find it always astonishing that there a 'tribes' or even nations - espcecially in Europe, which should be 'pure'.
I'm a patriotic Westphalian ( :wink: ) but were my ancestors Francs or Saxons? If Saxons (what the surname would suggest) from what tribe? And from where did this tribe origianally come? (Can't trace back the Hintelers ealier than 1287.)
So, to answer your question: I've no own odea and just follow what I've heard, which generally is mirrored in your first theory.
Thanks for your reply. The subject is really confusing as in Roman writings they were peoples mentioned as Albanians both in the West Balkans and in the West Caspian coast.
Just wanted to add that the official educational system of Albania teaches that the Albanians are inheritors of the Illyrians. However I don't know which was the policy on this during the communist-dictatoric regime of Hoxha.
The Albanian might be a mix of Dacian refugees from East Romania(200 words appeared to be related) and Illyrian/Thracian elements.
i live near albania, corektly in croatia, former jugoslavia, in the past craotia was part of Ilirija, and Alabnia was mix from romans, greeks, makedonians. There was no Tartary army in the Balkan, only in the breif periody.
When in doubt, we can always call them the lost 13th tribe of Israel.
Albanian is a difficult one. I believe that they are an Azbairi people who came from the east with the Turks as paid mercenaries and eventually mixed with the local Slav population. I dont believe they are Illyrian or have any connection whatsover to them. Its a tough subject and a difficult one that needs much reading but so far that is what I have read which makes sense atleast in my opinion.
By the way is this you Panos?
greek76 wrote:Albanian is a difficult one. I believe that they are an Azbairi people who came from the east with the Turks as paid mercenaries and eventually mixed with the local Slav population. I dont believe they are Illyrian or have any connection whatsover to them. Its a tough subject and a difficult one that needs much reading but so far that is what I have read which makes sense atleast in my opinion.
By the way is this you Panos?
Yes
. Ela re Peter, just saw the website in your profile and recognised you, lol. You are indeed a forum maniac, you even found me here
.
LOL yeah its me I was bored so I started to browse the internet and saw this dude your avatar is funny as hell! Yeah I run them and I post in so many I forget my snames and passwords lol.
So, welcome to A2K
. You can find a lot of interesting conversations here, stick around.
reading along
neighbours of mine describe themselves as ethnic Albanians, but don't seem to know what that means ... so I'm hoping to learn something here
I believe Emporer Constantine was from Illyria. It is ironic that he converted the Roman Empire to Christianity but Albania is now Moslem.
ehBeth wrote:reading along
neighbours of mine describe themselves as ethnic Albanians, but don't seem to know what that means ... so I'm hoping to learn something here
The Albanians call their selves "Shqiptaret" in their language, which means "Sons of the eagles". I am not sure about the origin of the words Albania/Albanians.
talk72000 wrote:I believe Emporer Constantine was from Illyria. It is ironic that he converted the Roman Empire to Christianity but Albania is now Moslem.
Constantine I was born in Moesia, an area inhabited by Illyrians back then, but his parents were both Roman.
COULD ALBANIA BE FROM A WORD MEANING `WHITE'
Albanian ancestors were called Arben, a word of the Albanian-Tosk dialect, by changing the n into an r, coined Arber, used as such to this date. The ancient nation called itself Arber or Arban, which meant people who worked the fields. The word was later changed to Alban by the Romans, who called the land Albania, as is it called today by Europeans. The Greeks called Albanians the Arvanit, by changing the letter l into an r and becouse they spell the "B" "V" and from this Greek word the Turks created Arnaut, which they still use today. The word Shqiptar and Shqipëri are Albanian words that come from the blessed bird Albanian ancestors prayed to and they used its face (image) in their flag. The word must not be too old since albanian brethren in the diaspora, Italy, Greece and other places are not aware of the word and still call it Arber,and in Italy Arberesh.
Re: The Albanians
Jamarber wrote:Well.... well..... well.....
Since when the greeks can make the History of Albania??
eeeeeeeeee Ellinas??
If you knew a little bit about history you should know that:
Firstly, welcome to the forum.
Personally I don't have a clear opinion regarding the origin of the Albanians. That's why I mentioned the most possible theories, to hear opinions of other members here. A person who is studied about the issue could enlighten me, and the others interested on the subject.
What history I am "making"? I can't understand you.
I read that 200 Dacian words are similiar to Albanian.
It is possible that refugees from Romania settled in Albania.
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