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ISRAEL - IRAN - SYRIA - HAMAS - HEZBOLLAH - WWWIII?

 
 
blueflame1
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Aug, 2006 07:29 pm
gunga, Israeli terrorists became Prime Ministers. But their ruthlessness is well documented. It took a lot for Rabin to shake the hand of a terrorist like Arafat but it also took a lot for Arafat to shake the hand of a terrorist like Rabin. Rabin's assassination changed everything but he was not killed by a Palestinian. As for your comments about Palestinian prisoners in Israeli jails, "Palestinian Child Political Prisoners in cruel, inhuman and ...300 Palestinian child prisoners in Israeli prisons and detention facilities. centers. ... The Palestinian child prisoners are tried before and sentenced by ...
www.palestinemonitor.org/new_web/palestinian_child_political_prisoners.htm - 92k - " http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ned=us&q=palestinian+child+prisoners&btnmeta%3Dsearch%3Dsearch=Search+the+Web
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Aug, 2006 07:54 pm
BernardR wrote:
I usually don't take issue with you, Gungasnake but I find that I must. You are aware, of course, that the USA and many of its citizens pour large amounts of money and other support into Israel each year.

Why are they wasting our money?

The Fanatic Murdering Islamo-fascists are much more into Economics and cost effectivenes. Instead of housing Prisoners--feeding them--guarding them--they are efficient. They merely slash their throats like they slashed the throat of the innocent newsman- Pearl!


There ARE a couple of exceptions to the rule, that being one of them.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Aug, 2006 08:05 pm
blueflame1 wrote:
gunga, Israeli terrorists became Prime Ministers. But their ruthlessness is well documented. It took a lot for Rabin to shake the hand of a terrorist like Arafat but it also took a lot for Arafat to shake the hand of a terrorist like Rabin. Rabin's assassination changed everything but he was not killed by a Palestinian. As for your comments about Palestinian prisoners in Israeli jails, "Palestinian Child Political Prisoners in cruel, inhuman and ...300 Palestinian child prisoners in Israeli prisons and detention facilities. centers. ... The Palestinian child prisoners are tried before and sentenced by ...


Funny I should walk in and see something like this on A2K. I was just out running errands and listening to Christ Plante on WMAL, and Plante was talking about "palestinians", and particularly children. He mentioned this site:

Palestinian Media Watch:

http://www.pmw.org.il/tv%20part10.html

and, apparently, most "palestinian" children actually wish to become suicide/homacide bombers (shahada), and Plante mentioned an interview with two eleven year old girls, both of whom explained to the reporter conducting the interview that virtually all palestinian children wish to become suicide bombers, and that shahad, or death for Allah, was vastly preferable to any sort of success or happiness in this life.

There is one solution to this thing and one only, and I hope everybody figures it out before any major grief arises from it not being figured out in time: the slammite world has to be forced to find a place to put the "palestinians", and that place has to be very far from israel.

Alternately some Pacific island might be found for them or some very remote spot in Russian east Asia or some such, but it has to be sufficiently remote and isolated that they cannot harm anybody other than themselves.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Aug, 2006 08:08 pm
I should also mention that, were that to happen, I would expect that Israel would only be too happy to allow any "palestinian" homacidal maniacs under the age of majority which it might be holding to be shipped off to wherever the "palestinians" were to end up.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Aug, 2006 08:22 pm
Here you go:

http://pmw.org.il/asx/PMW_Walla_7.asx

Try watching this ****, and then tell me what a bunch of heartless bastards Israelis are for holding underaged "palestinians" in prison.
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Tue 15 Aug, 2006 11:44 pm
Rebuilding Lebanon's shattered economy

Quote:
With a truce between Israel and Hezbollah raising hopes of peace in Lebanon, much of the focus is moving towards the task at hand: how to rebuild the country and how to pay for it.
Throughout the conflict, a string of world leaders have vowed to help once the fighting had stopped - not only with humanitarian aid but also by helping pay for restructuring efforts.

Now they will be asked to put their money where their mouths were.

Tunisia's president has called for an emergency summit of Arab leaders, urging collective support for the rebuilding of the war-torn country.

And Sweden has taken a lead in the West by organising a donor conference on 31 August, which some 60 countries and aid agencies are expected to attend.

"The world community now has to give its support to Lebanon's recovery and to the Lebanese people who have been severely affected," says Swedish Foreign Minister Jan Eliasson.

Logistical nightmare

As yet, no reliable estimate for the cost of rebuilding Lebanon exists.

One thing is known, however: much of the $50bn (£26bn) injected into the country during the past decade to rebuild after the 1975-1989 civil war was spent on roads and power lines, schools and sport centres, hospitals and airports.


Several Lebanese factories have been bombed to smithereens

Many of these are now in ruins.

"Huge areas of the south and Beirut are flat," says Christian Aid's Graham McKay.

"Rebuilding the infrastructure, rebuilding the 600 kilometres of roads that have been destroyed, rebuilding the 150 bridges that have been destroyed, [there is going to be a] huge bill for that."

The Lebanese government estimates the infrastructure damage alone could amount to US$2.5bn.

Beyond the economic burden, carrying out the work is going to be a logistical nightmare that will take up valuable manpower - and require energy supplies which, in many cases, have yet to be restored.

On top of that comes the need to rebuild houses and public buildings to allow people to move back into their communities.

Lebanon's economy ministry says about one in five of the country's million or so refugees have been rendered homeless by the war, and estimates that the total cost of the damage to houses might even be greater than it was during the civil war.

Hopes dashed

In the longer term, repairing Lebanon's commercial sector will prove yet another mammoth task.

Dozens of factories have been crushed in bombing raids during the last few weeks.

Commercially-driven construction sites have been deserted as foreign investors have fled.

And as for the country's tourism industry, which until early July had been forecasting more than 1.6 million visitors this year, there are no hopes of a quick recovery.

Consequently, Lebanon will find it increasingly hard to service its $35bn debts.

The government had been planning economic reforms including the privatisation of its power and telecoms sectors, tax rises and a tighter grip on the government's purse strings. These plans may now have to be shelved.

Few, if any, dare to hope for a return to the good times of the early 1970s, when Lebanon was still a Middle Eastern banking and trading hub.

Commercial opportunity?

Nevertheless, there are those who expect the reconstruction efforts to spiral into a commercial bonanza - for some, at least.

Paying for post-war reconstruction tends to involve pulling money out of one bag and stuffing it into another, and the stock markets provide a good indicator of who stands to gain.

Shares in cement and steel companies have shot up as investors predict that demand for their products will soar.

"Maybe the cement companies and the steel companies will be able to export quite a bit into Lebanon on the back of this peace initiative that's going on," says Yasser Hassanein of Dynamic Securities in Egypt.

For the people of Lebanon, the suffering is far from over. For those rebuilding this shattered country, the real struggle is about to begin.


http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41436000/jpg/_41436969_bedap416.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41436000/jpg/_41436839_precariousap416.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41437000/jpg/_41437019_possessionsap416.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41436000/jpg/_41436743_beirutafp416.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41436000/jpg/_41436689_dreamsap416.jpg
0 Replies
 
BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 12:13 am
Shattered Economy? What shattered Economy? Haven't you read the garbage issuing from the mouths of the Fanatic Islamo-fascist murderers from Syria and Iran, revel? They WON the war!!
Sure, the Lebanese have had their economy all torn up, bridges destroyed and ten times more of the Hezbollah have been killed than Israelis. But they won the war. It will now be up to the always gutless Un to make sure the Hezbollah do not in any way bother Israel.

If they do, I am sure that Israel, looking over their mistakes in this last skirmish, will, perhaps under a new PM, really kick the stuffings out of the Lebanese IF THEY PROVE TO BE TOO WEAK OR TOO PARTISAN TO SEE TO IT THAT HEZBOLLAH DOES NOT BOTHER ISRAEL AGAIN!!!

The Motto of the Mossad is N E V E R A G A I N. They will never again allow fascist murderers like the Hezbollah do to them what Hitler did to them. Count on it. The Lebanese people have not seen what real destruction is yet. They had better tell the Hezbollah that the drive of the fanatic murdering Islamo-Fascists IS NOT WORTH THE CONTINUED DESTRUCTION OF THE LEBANESE INFRASTRUCTURE!!!
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 12:27 am
Bernard, you must be a night owl like I am becoming. (used to be dependent on Tylenol PM, gave it up and this is the result)

As for your post. I don't think there was any winners in this conflict despite various claims from both sides.
0 Replies
 
BernardR
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 01:03 am
That is your point of view.My point of view is that the Isrealis showed that if Hezbos try to mess with them, Lebanon will again be taken apart as you show in your pictures.

It is the duty of any sovereign country to CONTROL the savages amongst them who may cause problems for a neighbor. Just suppose that the Black gangs in Detroit were to go over to Windsor in Canada and cause trouble. The USA would be responsible for arresting and prosecuting them.

Similarly in Lebanon. However, I know many of the Lebanese are Sympathetic to the Hexbollah, but now they must ascertain whether their sympathy is viable given the fact that if they do not help to keep the Hezbollah peaceful, the country may be ruined again but this time with even more force!!
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 03:54 am
The thing the lebanese need to understand is that, had Israel fought this thing under the same set of rules as the hezbullies, there would be a million or more lebanese casualties. Israel could as easily have dropped three atom bombs on Lebanon, and that WOULD have stopped the rocket attacks, and a hundred Israelis who are dead now would be alive.

They might decide to do that next time. Surely if I were a Lebanese, I would not count on the idea of Israel continuing to let its own people die to save Lebanese from their own cowardice and stupidity.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 04:07 am
revel wrote:


http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41436000/jpg/_41436969_bedap416.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41436000/jpg/_41436839_precariousap416.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41437000/jpg/_41437019_possessionsap416.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41436000/jpg/_41436743_beirutafp416.jpg

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41436000/jpg/_41436689_dreamsap416.jpg


Kind of reminds me of a song Bobby Bare used to sing....

THE WINNER


Quote:

The hulk of a man with a beer in his hand he looked like a drunk old fool
And I knew if I hit him right why I could knock him off of that stool
But everybody they said watch out hey that's the Tiger Man McCool
He's had the whole lotta fights and he's always come out winner yeah he's a winner
But I had myself about five too many and I walked up tall and proud
I faced his back and I faced the fact that he had never stooped or bowed
I said Tiger Man you're a pussycat and a hush fell on the crowd
I said let's you and me go outside and see who's the winner
Well he gripped the bar with one big hairy hand then he braced against the wall
He slowly looked up from his beer my God that man was tall
He said boy I see you're a scrapper so just before you fall
I'm gonna tell you just a little bout what it means to be a winner
He said now you see these bright white smilin' teeth you know they ain't my own
Mine rolled away like Chicklets down the street in San Antone
But I left that person cursin' nursin' seven broken bones
And he only broke ah three of mine that makes me the winner
He said now behind this grin I got a steel pin that holds my jaw in place
A trophy of my most successful motorcycle race
And each morning when I wake and touch this scar across my face
It reminds me of all I got by bein' a winner
Now this broken back was the dyin' act of a handsome Harry Clay
That sticky Cincinnati night I stole his wife away
But that woman she gets uglier and she gets meaner every day
But I got her boy that's what makes me a winner
He said you gotta speak loud when you challenge me son cause it's hard for me to hear
With this twisted neck and these migraine pains and this big ole cauliflower ear
And if it wadn't for this glass eye of mine why I'd shed a happy tear
To think of all that you gonna get by bein' a winner
I got arthritic elbows boy I got dislocated knees
From pickin' fights with thunderstorms and chargin' into trees
And my nose been broke so often I might lose if I sneeze
And son you say you still wanna be a winner?.......
0 Replies
 
McTag
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 06:28 am
So we have proved, if proof were needed, that Israel with a colossal "defence" budget and plenty of modern munitions, can bomb its neighbours flat.

However some people, within Israel as well as outside, are asking whether that is sufficient to morally justify a status quo. By this action and by its behaviour over decades, the state of Irael has steadily lost support, within and without.

Which I think is a shame.
0 Replies
 
McGentrix
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 06:37 am
McTag wrote:
So we have proved, if proof were needed, that Israel with a colossal "defence" budget and plenty of modern munitions, can bomb its neighbours flat.

However some people, within Israel as well as outside, are asking whether that is sufficient to morally justify a status quo. By this action and by its behaviour over decades, the state of Irael has steadily lost support, within and without.

Which I think is a shame.


Lost support? According to whom? The arabs?
0 Replies
 
revel
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 07:13 am
McGentrix wrote:
McTag wrote:
So we have proved, if proof were needed, that Israel with a colossal "defence" budget and plenty of modern munitions, can bomb its neighbours flat.

However some people, within Israel as well as outside, are asking whether that is sufficient to morally justify a status quo. By this action and by its behaviour over decades, the state of Irael has steadily lost support, within and without.

Which I think is a shame.


Lost support? According to whom? The arabs?


Quote:
Israeli criticism of the war in Lebanon

Ari Shavit is one of the most respected, veteran establishment journalists in Israel, and today, in the pages of Haaretz, he heaped blame on Prime Minister Ehud Olmert for the grave harm that the war in Lebanon has imposed on Israel:

"If Olmert runs away now from the war he initiated, he will not be able to remain prime minister for even one more day. Chutzpah has its limits. You cannot lead an entire nation to war promising victory, produce humiliating defeat and remain in power. You cannot bury 120 Israelis in cemeteries, keep a million Israelis in shelters for a month, wear down deterrent power, bring the next war very close, and then say -- oops, I made a mistake. That was not the intention. Pass me a cigar, please.

"Therefore, the day [Hezbollah leader Hassan] Nasrallah comes out of his bunker and declares victory to the whole world, Olmert must not be in the prime minister's office. Post-war battered and bleeding Israel needs a new start and a new leader. It needs a real prime minister."

Also in Haaretz, Israeli politician Yossi Sarid today said: "This war is, first and foremost, an Israeli tragedy. It is also a Lebanese tragedy and, in fact, an international one. When the Israeli cabinet decided to respond to the abduction of two soldiers by launching a war, it did not take into consideration the fact that no one would stop it ...

"The United States under Bush single-handedly destroyed its deterrent power and that of the free world, including Israel. If the American demon that has taken over Iraq is not so terrible and can be worn down, then just how terrible could the Israeli demon possibly be?"

These columns illustrate several important points:

1) Many Israelis are openly acknowledging that the Israel-Lebanon war has been a disaster for Israel;

2) Waging unnecessary wars, particularly when they are waged poorly, makes a nation much weaker, not stronger (see, e.g., Iraq);

3) Contrary to the reprehensible accusations in this country that opposition to, or criticism of, the Israel-Lebanon war is evidence of anti-Israel bias or even anti-Semitism, many people are opposed to the war -- and critical of President Bush's foolishly unrestrained support for it -- precisely because it is so harmful to Israel;

4) Israel's democracy is sufficiently healthy that journalists and other citizens not only can criticize the country's leader in the middle of a war but can call for his resignation -- without being branded a traitor, a subversive, a coward and all of the other slurs to which Bush critics in the U.S. are routinely subjected.


source
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 07:43 am
Some similarities here between Bush's invasion of Iraq and Olmert's invasion of Lebanon. We, overawed with our military might, believed we could control a small weak country like Iraq without any problems. We were dead wrong. Israel, with her military might, felt they could defeat a ragtag group of guerrillas without any problem. They were dead wrong as well.

I wonder if America and Israel will wake up an see that it will require something more than military might to solve these problems.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 07:47 am
In dealing with armed lunatics, armed might is about the only option other than surrender and submission.

What is it that's hard to see? I mean, from where I sit, the only thing I really see in the left here is a refusal to recognize what they're dealing with.
0 Replies
 
old europe
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 07:59 am
McGentrix wrote:
McTag wrote:
So we have proved, if proof were needed, that Israel with a colossal "defence" budget and plenty of modern munitions, can bomb its neighbours flat.

However some people, within Israel as well as outside, are asking whether that is sufficient to morally justify a status quo. By this action and by its behaviour over decades, the state of Irael has steadily lost support, within and without.

Which I think is a shame.


Lost support? According to whom? The arabs?


I wouldn't say that Israel has lost support, but rather that the war has lost support. Try reading Ha'aretz or Yedioth Ahronot. Only a minority of Israelis still supported the war in recent polls published.

Not to mention their op-eds.
0 Replies
 
xingu
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 08:34 am
gungasnake wrote:
In dealing with armed lunatics, armed might is about the only option other than surrender and submission.


I think the ones who think that invading countries and killing people are the armed lunatics. If there are people out there who hate us so much perhaps we should find out what we're doing to make them hate us. Maybe it us who should try to be more accommodating rather then expecting the world to accommodate us.
0 Replies
 
gungasnake
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 08:54 am
In the case of slammites, we pretty much KNOW why they hate us: we refuse to submit to allah and I-slam, and our economic and technological civilization have a way of making slammite society look bad.

Of all the statistics which come out of the middle east, the one that stands out is the one that says that with all that oil, average income in Saudi Arabia is around 400 usd while in Israel, which has no resources other than brains, talent, a willingness to work and a noticable lack of I-slam, average income is more like 22K - 24K.
0 Replies
 
Ticomaya
 
  1  
Reply Wed 16 Aug, 2006 08:58 am
xingu wrote:
gungasnake wrote:
In dealing with armed lunatics, armed might is about the only option other than surrender and submission.


I think the ones who think that invading countries and killing people are the armed lunatics. If there are people out there who hate us so much perhaps we should find out what we're doing to make them hate us. Maybe it us who should try to be more accommodating rather then expecting the world to accommodate us.


In other words, we should appease the terrorists?
0 Replies
 
 

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